Sold counterfeit item on TradeMe - Do I have any action I can take against the seller?

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johnr

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#278206 1-Dec-2009 11:23

Comradehunt:So does this 100% give me the right for demanding a full refund from the seller, plus deserve me changing my feedback to them to red? After all I'm now out of pocket for the item and shipping.

Yes for sure that sucks

Geese

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#278314 1-Dec-2009 14:17

c71931f: Auction number?

Of my listing where the owner approached me, or of the sellers listing when I purchased it?

I'm unsure what to do really, as a student I can't afford to go running to a lawyer about it.

I assume that as I bought the item innocently off TM, cooperated with the owner and did the right thing and at my expense and return the item to the owner, and provided him with details of the person who sold it to me off TM, that the police will not be able to charge me with anything?

I have written an email to the seller, but not sent it. By now they probably already know whats going on as the owner says he will work in reverse order through all people involved until he has the person who originally stole it then get them charged.

My friend thinks I'm better to ring all the people in the phone book with same name until I strike them and confront them about it. I think email is better then there is proof of what gets said.

richms

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#278319 1-Dec-2009 14:36

As a student you should get a free consultation via your student association on matters like this.

How did you pay them? I am guessing not pay now or there would be no problems

IMO it was foolish to give it back without the alleged owner getting the police involved, as you have no requirement to do so.

Richard rich.ms

Geese

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#278327 1-Dec-2009 14:47

Yes my friend warned me as you did, but not in such a simplistic way...

There has been a development, here is what seller said:

"it wasnt stolen,it was in the glovebox of a damaged/written off rental car we brought off an Insurance company, Ive been in contact with gentleman above to get a resolution.Thanks".

So in light of this, I say it is unfair for me to lose out on the cost of the item plus return shipping, when clearly is now is not stolen, but in fact misplaced by the rental company who forgot to get it out of the wrecked car.

So advice on what to do now? Its packaged up ready to be sent, however I believe now that with what i have learnt, that really the owner should pay me at cost to return it???

richms

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#278329 1-Dec-2009 14:54

If you still have it, then keep it untill ordered by a court or police to surrender it. They have now shown that their previous claim of it being stolen was incorrect.

I am guessing it is a GPS of some sort from being in a glovebox of a car. When a friends car was written off, they had an opportunity to get anything personal out of it when it was at the panelbeaters and then they had to sign something that was to do with deregistering it and there was something on it that they had all their items and were waiving any future claims etc.

Whatever, this is not something that you should just fold over with a request from some random on trademe.

Richard rich.ms

Geese

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#278332 1-Dec-2009 15:03

sometimes on this site, and i'm not sure why, but i write a reply and instead of posting it when i click "post reply" it just takes me back to forum home page, quite annoying as i lose everything i write, so here we go again...

No student help, its my hols now and i was correspondence so slim chance of help that way.

Paid by internet banking.

My wise mate said not to send it back, just keep it until the cops come knocking - he said that was due to it being "reasonable" for me to withhold the item while i do my own investigation to whether the item was stolen or not. In this case he was right - there was a explanation to the contrary to the accusation.

So now I still have the item, all packaged, but in light of all thats occured, I am waiting to hear from both parties about what happens next. I do not think its fair i lose all my investment in the item, because a rental company bungled and forgot to check the contents of car which was written off.

I'm happy to return it but not at my expense now i know the circumstances. So I will keep it until I hear an acceptable satisfactory solution, or unless someone has some alternative advice?

Yes, it was a GPS type item, of very low value to ordinary people (under $50), but probably a high value in terms of replacement cost (who knows maybe $500??).

SepticSceptic

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#278344 1-Dec-2009 15:19

Technically, it's not even stolen !!! Just because someone forgot to check inside a glovebox at the time of sale hardly makes you an accessory to theft. You own it, lock stock and all smoking barrels, and it's up to you what you do. You could say no, get stuffed, and they wont have a leg to stand on.
Or get fully recompensed, including all shipping fees, etc.
Have a chat to the local constabulary - in person. Explain the situation. Don't even bother with legal services, unless you get it cheap/free - the minimal cost of the item makes it not worthwhile.

AliExpress

Shop now on AliExpress (affiliate link).

Geese

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#278347 1-Dec-2009 15:28

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=256631950&ed=true

That has the auction number that links to sellers listing, not that is an issue now. Note I have toasted the photo and the description.

Just spoke to 2 insurance companies, both said same thing, same as what richms said, the rental company would have signed a release form when they were paid out, the vehicle and its contents at that time become possession of the insurance company, as they stand, AIWI, them and anything in them at time of tender passes on to the new owner to do whatever he likes. The insured - ie the rental company should have checked the vehicle thoroughly before signing the release, simple. Glovebox is easy to check, not like it was hiding under the back seat or something.

richms

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#278350 1-Dec-2009 15:35

In addition, if the item was rented by a tourist and left in the car they crashed, they would have been billed for it if it was not returned, so the tourisim GPS guys again would either have an outstanding debt to the renters, or have being paid back by their insurance. In either case they have no title to the goods anymore and liability for it lies with the people that took out the rental agreement on the goods and failed to return them.

Richard rich.ms

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#278386 1-Dec-2009 16:46

Comradehunt: http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=256631950&ed=true

That has the auction number that links to sellers listing, not that is an issue now. Note I have toasted the photo and the description.

Just spoke to 2 insurance companies, both said same thing, same as what richms said, the rental company would have signed a release form when they were paid out, the vehicle and its contents at that time become possession of the insurance company, as they stand, AIWI, them and anything in them at time of tender passes on to the new owner to do whatever he likes. The insured - ie the rental company should have checked the vehicle thoroughly before signing the release, simple. Glovebox is easy to check, not like it was hiding under the back seat or something.

They rent the things out for around $30 per trip (including a postage free bag to get it back to them).
I agree with everyone else, they no longer hold any claim or title on this and they should compensate you and provide free postage if your kind enough to want to send it back to them (Or you could just say, Hey, you want it, theres a buy now price if you want to go hard line.) All you would have to have is the details off the other seller of the car and what insurance company they bought it off and the police will say, sorry but it's not yours (EDIT) to Tourism Radio New Zealand. It's actually up to Tourism Radio New Zealand considering the proof to prove it was actually stolen as opposed to left in the glove box of a wrecked car. I'd get the details of the car this was got from and who it was bought off so you have some ammo on your side.

paradoxsm

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#278421 1-Dec-2009 17:42

Ahh, I'd spotted that too, I was tempted by the CDMA plate (until the asking price went up) you also had for sale and had thought about grabbing both.

If you do still want to sell it and can legally, for $50 i'd take it (and the CDMA plate if it's $200 as cash is limited, sub-of-the-day for a week it is!)

let me know how you get on with it.

Geese

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#278543 1-Dec-2009 23:28

paradoxsm: Ahh, I'd spotted that too, I was tempted by the CDMA plate (until the asking price went up) you also had for sale and had thought about grabbing both.

If you do still want to sell it and can legally, for $50 i'd take it (and the CDMA plate if it's $200 as cash is limited, sub-of-the-day for a week it is!)

let me know how you get on with it.

Waffle alert...

Sorry yeah I'd sell it for $200 as I said on here, however through TM with their fees it would need to be a bit more as I still want $200 after any fees (which are around $13/$14 at a guess). Actually the truth was the week after it finished I had Jury duty, plus final week of my course, extra hours at work ( 6.5 more hours after jury duty), so I was quite busy - and the problem is on my civic is that the wee nuts that hold the plates on front bumper have become unwelded, so I know that in order to get new plates on once these come off, the whole bumper needs to be removed, not a quick or easy task last time when I put those ones on. But yeah now I'm not driving that car for a few weeks as I've got stiches in various places on my back, and the civic seat is soooo uncomfortable I can't stand to drive it, so I can take my time to wop the bumper off. If you want them, they are $200, just send me a PM or something.

As for the tourism radio (waffle again), I got it as I had never heard of such a thing even though I have owned a dozen GPS units and am right into geocaching. When I saw it come up on TM, I thought I better click it off.

My review of it is that it is perfect for someone travelling or a tourist, however if you listen to it "all day" it only takes about 10 to 14 days to do a big loop and start again. The music it plays is great, I thought the play order was random at first as some songs repeat, but I'm sure they loop too as once it was back at start it played them in same order. The music on it is pretty much covered by "natures best" CDs 1 2 and 3. I loved the music so I got natures best 1-3 and decided that there was little point keeping the unit as it was beginning to grind.

I'll wait for a comeback from the director when he realises its not at his doorstep in the morning. I'm not out to make any money on it, just break even, which I work out to be $40, (plus shipping). So you can have it for that if/when this all blows over. These units have a built in FM transmitter which is how they transmit to the car head unit, and I think with that and built in GPS these units are most likely pretty expensive new?

If they hire them out for $30 a go I would have thought it makes sense to recover the unit as it would pay itself back within a few hires.

mikerussellnz

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#283672 18-Dec-2009 10:27

@c71931f - Yes that is fake you can tell by the box. the real box is completely different design as it can be seen in the background of this image:

http://thenokiablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/nokia-bh-503.jpg

FreakyKiwi

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#283826 18-Dec-2009 16:09

Possible interesting point - the item was sold via auction - and as such the seller warrants that they are lawfully able to sell it and that it is not stolen - same as any physical auction. There is no liability or responsiblity on the buyer - in fact I'm sure that had the item actually been stolen then the seller would have been required to provide the original owner with compensation...

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