The Universe, who is fascinated by that?

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#1619830 30-Aug-2016 19:39

BurningBeard:

joker97: And Neil dgT knows everything. When someone claims they know everything they ain't got much left in the tank.

When did he claim that?

I avoid falling into the trap of "scientism" and posting endless Tyson memes on BookFace, but plenty of times he's said suggested the opposite of what you just said...

"The day our knowledge of the cosmos ceases to expand, we risk regressing to the childish view that the universe figuratively and literally revolves around us."

"I never want you to quote me citing my authority as a scientist for your knowing something. If that's what you have to resort to I have failed as an educator."

“Science works on the frontier between knowledge and ignorance. We’re not afraid to admit what we don’t know. There’s no shame in that. The only shame is to pretend that we have all the answers.”

I agree. Science at this level has a high level of theory. Ive watched the latest Cosmos but not all of NDT videos but i cant see that.

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#1619832 30-Aug-2016 19:42

MikeAqua:

Rikkitic:

MikeAqua:

....

We don't want to be colonised by a technologically superior culture. Ask any indigenous people on earth.

Being human we anthropomorphise everything. We assume a technologically superior civilisation would treat us the way we treat our own indigenous people. Why should it? Just because we are jerks doesn't mean everyone else is.

One argument is a species that evolved its way to the top of the heap on their planet, is probably just as competitive and aggressive as we are.

But alternately guess superior ethics could result from superior knowledge and technology as well. We are slowly developing some as a species.

How would humans treat a new planet I wonder?

If we were settling on a new planet with an existing ecosystem, where the most intelligent life was about as intelligent as chimpanzees ....

What would we do differently?

Fully agree. Are we perfect? No. Neither are sharks or Lions. We are "perfecter" than that. Evolution. Like any species they will maximise their survival.

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#1619834 30-Aug-2016 19:43

BurningBeard:

joker97: That's what he says here and there, but it ain't what he preaches! Maybe it's his persona. I've watched a lot of his videos, almost becomes a religion of the science he preaches, very evident in "debates" with other scientists where he'd just smash them out of the park.

It IS what he preaches; I think you meant to say it's what he preaches, but not what he practices.

But yeah that's scientism, which I mentioned earlier.

I think he sometimes weighs in on topics that are out of his field, much like Dawkins does.

I'm not a fan of this "rock star" scientist thing that has people throwing Neil DT memes in people's face as if it's a big mic-drop moment. And it's usually in a "hurr hurr, take that you stupid creationist!" sort of context.

But I'm all for having people out there trying to make science "cool" and inviting.

All that being said, I doubt he actually said "I know everything" as you mentioned earlier.

He doesnt know everything, but what I bolded is what he does and that is very very important.

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#1619835 30-Aug-2016 19:45

joker97:

BurningBeard:

joker97: That's what he says here and there, but it ain't what he preaches! Maybe it's his persona. I've watched a lot of his videos, almost becomes a religion of the science he preaches, very evident in "debates" with other scientists where he'd just smash them out of the park.

It IS what he preaches; I think you meant to say it's what he preaches, but not what he practices.

But yeah that's scientism, which I mentioned earlier.

I think he sometimes weighs in on topics that are out of his field, much like Dawkins does.

I'm not a fan of this "rock star" scientist thing that has people throwing Neil DT memes in people's face as if it's a big mic-drop moment. And it's usually in a "hurr hurr, take that you stupid creationist!" sort of context.

But I'm all for having people out there trying to make science "cool" and inviting.

All that being said, I doubt he actually said "I know everything" as you mentioned earlier.

He doesn't explicitly say it, but when interacting with other scientists, the other scientists are WRONG. PLain wrong. Because he's right. Ever get that feeling?

Never but feel free to quote or Youtube. He uses publicity to bring theoretical physics and Cosmology to the living room. As does Michu Kaku

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#1619836 30-Aug-2016 19:46

BurningBeard:

joker97: He doesn't explicitly say it, but when interacting with other scientists, the other scientists are WRONG. PLain wrong. Because he's right. Ever get that feeling?

Sometimes.

It's just you said "When someone claims they know everything"... there's a big difference between claiming to know everything, and acting like one does. Jus' sayin'.

I get that. the distinction is being a know all, and bringing it to the living room.

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#1619837 30-Aug-2016 19:48

Rikkitic:

MikeAqua:

One argument is a species that evolved its way to the top of the heap on their planet, is probably just as competitive and aggressive as we are.

But alternately guess superior ethics could result from superior knowledge and technology as well. We are slowly developing some as a species.

How would humans treat a new planet I wonder?

If we were settling on a new planet with an existing ecosystem, where the most intelligent life was about as intelligent as chimpanzees ....

What would we do differently?

I think we would be very cautious and respectful until we discovered some fantastically valuable resource that we wanted, than the rationalisations and justifications would come thick and fast and the (few surviving) chimpanzees would be herded into a zoo where tears would be shed over their lost promise. We would then go on to strip-mine and overpopulate the planet and fight destructive wars over the diminishing remains. But that's just us. It doesn't mean someone else would do the same.

They would, its evolution. Humans are just one species all of us are made from the same particles.

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#1619838 30-Aug-2016 19:52

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

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#1619886 30-Aug-2016 20:34

tdgeek:

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

That is exactly NGT when he doesn't like someone. When he hasn't established prejudice, he is much nicer.

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#1619888 30-Aug-2016 20:37

joker97:

tdgeek:

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

That is exactly NGT when he doesn't like someone. When he hasn't established prejudice, he is much nicer.

Ouch LOL. Ive not seen that from him, give me some links

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#1619889 30-Aug-2016 20:39

joker97:

tdgeek:

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

That is exactly NGT when he doesn't like someone. When he hasn't established prejudice, he is much nicer.

And BTW I don't dislike Rikkitic. We often disagree, yes, sometimes we do agree, like tonite, but please do not tell me I don't like someone, especially a fellow GZ poster.

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#1619893 30-Aug-2016 20:43

tdgeek:

joker97:

tdgeek:

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

That is exactly NGT when he doesn't like someone. When he hasn't established prejudice, he is much nicer.

And BTW I don't dislike Rikkitic. We often disagree, yes, sometimes we do agree, like tonite, but please do not tell me I don't like someone, especially a fellow GZ poster.

Well if the computer simulation theory of the universe is right, then Rikkitic will quite likely be right, as the programmers would have read this post and inserted supermen and captain america, angels and spirits ... wait ...

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#1619908 30-Aug-2016 20:57

joker97:

tdgeek:

joker97:

tdgeek:

Rikkitic:

Broaden your mind. Imagine the unimaginable. Just because we have organic limits doesn't mean another life form would. We all have to obey the laws of physics, but within that constraint literally anything is possible. We think and live competition because we are parasites and have become supreme at feeding off other living things. It is a big universe, big enough for a different kind of evolution that does not depend on competition, but cooperation. Maybe there is a place where the dominant species is the one best at getting along with others. Maybe intelligent crystals evolve by focussing sunlight to extract minerals. It doesn't always have to be dog eat dog.

First rule of discussion, don't tell me to broaden my mind. Understand the Universe, what we are made of, we are not special. Nor do all lifeforms want everything for free.

You need to look at the science, not the Mega Upload on Alpha Centauri B, Or C

That is exactly NGT when he doesn't like someone. When he hasn't established prejudice, he is much nicer.

And BTW I don't dislike Rikkitic. We often disagree, yes, sometimes we do agree, like tonite, but please do not tell me I don't like someone, especially a fellow GZ poster.

Well if the computer simulation theory of the universe is right, then Rikkitic will quite likely be right, as the programmers would have read this post and inserted supermen and captain america, angels and spirits ... wait ...

How many beers you had?? :-)

I can imagine a night where all of us frequent posters were in the same room. Pay admission, get a bag of wet tea bags, handbags, and have a big good old time!! Except you as me and Rikkitic will chase you away!

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#1619923 30-Aug-2016 21:19

I am not sure how many people are familiar with the current version of einsteins field equation for general relativity, but the way I read it would be that for the big expansion (which some people call a bang) it implies that energy has a pressure which must push things outwards.

Not all forms of energy exist all of the time, and some forms of energy we guess is there by observing potential effects on things we can see. I am not sure I agree with the concep of dark matter, but dark energy is plausible although I am leaning to the idea of there being dark fields.

Also, time is relative to space, so I don't think there could have been a 'before the big bang' in the same way there is likely no after (since it is still happening).

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#1619929 30-Aug-2016 21:29

TwoSeven: I am not sure how many people are familiar with the current version of einsteins field equation for general relativity, but the way I read it would be that for the big expansion (which some people call a bang) it implies that energy has a pressure which must push things outwards.

Not all forms of energy exist all of the time, and some forms of energy we guess is there by observing potential effects on things we can see. I am not sure I agree with the concep of dark matter, but dark energy is plausible although I am leaning to the idea of there being dark fields.

Also, time is relative to space, so I don't think there could have been a 'before the big bang' in the same way there is likely no after (since it is still happening).

Time. I don't get time and space. What was going on 2 seconds before the so-called Big Bang? Expansion of the universe, if it is expanding, which I agree with, what exists 2 inches outside of the current Universe perimeter?

How can time not exist before the Big Bang? 2 seconds before. It has to be that nothing existed?? How can nothing exist? There is no space?

I cannot believe the big bang theory, I believe there has always been space and atoms, and they expand, then perhaps the big crush theory, then its too dense sonic explodes and expands, but not from a single dot.

Take our Sun, its big, in 5 million years it will expand past earth and Mars, then go super nova, and it starts again. I see the Universe as such, except over trillions of years, which again is hard to comprehend. How the massive space can be so stable is amazing.

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#1619942 30-Aug-2016 21:39

tdgeek:

TwoSeven: I am not sure how many people are familiar with the current version of einsteins field equation for general relativity, but the way I read it would be that for the big expansion (which some people call a bang) it implies that energy has a pressure which must push things outwards.

Not all forms of energy exist all of the time, and some forms of energy we guess is there by observing potential effects on things we can see. I am not sure I agree with the concep of dark matter, but dark energy is plausible although I am leaning to the idea of there being dark fields.

Also, time is relative to space, so I don't think there could have been a 'before the big bang' in the same way there is likely no after (since it is still happening).

Time. I don't get time and space. What was going on 2 seconds before the so-called Big Bang? Expansion of the universe, if it is expanding, which I agree with, what exists 2 inches outside of the current Universe perimeter?

How can time not exist before the Big Bang? 2 seconds before. It has to be that nothing existed?? How can nothing exist? There is no space?

I cannot believe the big bang theory, I believe there has always been space and atoms, and they expand, then perhaps the big crush theory, then its too dense sonic explodes and expands, but not from a single dot.

Take our Sun, its big, in 5 million years it will expand past earth and Mars, then go super nova, and it starts again. I see the Universe as such, except over trillions of years, which again is hard to comprehend. How the massive space can be so stable is amazing.

All these postulation come from math. Proven with math by math. What if math is not the right way to look at this?

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