North Island National Grid at near Capacity

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7296 posts

Uber Geek

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#2757730 10-Aug-2021 10:00

North Canterbury retailer triggered ripple and off went everyone hot water cylinder last night (who had the ability)

Off they went onto book of faces asking who has the right... Well, it'd be in the contract noone reads.

Anyhoo, there was some good data on transpowers site with breakdowns on production etc. This is how it looked last night for transit/usage. Seems when north islanders get cold. It goes to hell

gbwelly

1243 posts

Uber Geek

#2757732 10-Aug-2021 10:02

Dingbatt:

You mean Texas where the wind turbines froze in the middle of winter? Yeah, if you like.

Worth a watch to clear up the 'frozen windmill' story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmYvkCXXI4E

alavaliant

222 posts

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#2757733 10-Aug-2021 10:14

I'm just glad that I got my small house fully insulated a while back. So even if we don't use heating the house generally stays at a temperature that is comfortable (as long as you put on a few layers) in winter.

allio

885 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2757740 10-Aug-2021 10:15

Oblivian:

Anyhoo, there was some good data on transpowers site with breakdowns on production etc. This is how it looked last night for transit/usage. Seems when north islanders get cold. It goes to hell

I guess it's possible that Aucklanders are just soft while down south they're made of tougher stuff and just shiver through it. But I suspect the answer is that Southerners have very static heating requirements in winter - i.e. it's cold enough every night that you simply always have the heating on in the evenings, regardless of whether it's a particularly cold night or not. I know I turned on the heater in our bedroom in our Auckland house for the first time in a month last night. So, together with the North Island having 4/5ths of the population, it makes total sense that North Island power requirements shoot up much more on chilly nights.

Oblivian

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#2757745 10-Aug-2021 10:26

Yeah the flat line tends to suggest that. There's also a scale where the % of transfer/generation that was swinging north.

As we all likely suspected. It's turned into a poking fight between the parties

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/things-are-running-tight-this-morning-transpower-boss-warning-to-kiwis/42KMF3MXIUQYZOORUSDLMC2JBU/

Fred99

13684 posts

Uber Geek

#2757760 10-Aug-2021 10:50

Despite the snow storms yesterday, it wasn't a very cold night in Chch last night. Possibly about average - perhaps even a bit warmer.

The weather pattern was a Southerly - so the cold stuff always tends to hit the northern NI after it's passed through the SI.

My guess would be that's why you're not seeing the same peak in those graphs for SI demand.

Was a beautiful morning to see out my bedroom window this morning:

Obraik

2123 posts

Uber Geek

#2757762 10-Aug-2021 10:57

Fred99:

It will have a significant effect in future if by then we won't or don't use thermal generation to meet peak demand, and don't invest/upgrade in zero CO2 generation. The timeframe for phasing out ICE and switching to EV's is shorter than the timeframe from the planning stage to commissioning a large hydro project.

We already have a list of consented power stations.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

Fred99

13684 posts

Uber Geek

#2757819 10-Aug-2021 11:28

Obraik:

Fred99:

It will have a significant effect in future if by then we won't or don't use thermal generation to meet peak demand, and don't invest/upgrade in zero CO2 generation. The timeframe for phasing out ICE and switching to EV's is shorter than the timeframe from the planning stage to commissioning a large hydro project.

We already have a list of consented power stations.

Yeah.

So I picked the largest one in that list the Castle Hill Wind Farm (up to 858 MW) , consent lodged in 2011, appealed and consent granted in 2013 (8 years ago), consent expires in 2023, and a news comment from Genesis that there are “no immediate construction plans”.

That list seems to include many at the same stage. Is there a list of power projects that actually might happen?

Groucho

524 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2757821 10-Aug-2021 11:36

Anyone have insights as to why NZ hasn't got tidal power in the mix?!? We are surrounded by coastline which makes it ideal to set up a large scale tidal farm somewhere outside of shipping channels. Alternatively mini tidal farms dotted around the country which can be fed directly into regions lessening the reliance and load of the national grid particularly inter-island.

For decades we've had generation issues of low hydro lakes or no wind or no sun for solar (being off peak when generated anyway). Last I checked there's never been wildly varying tides on the sea floor.

If we're serious about being 100% renewable energy, tidal has to be the way forward? Demand is going to keep increasing, coal plants will be gone and climate change will presumably give the hydro lakes increasing cause for concern. Meanwhile EVs would like more share of the energy pie and domestic fires are being phased out in favour of clean heat pumps (doubling as air conditioning in our warmer summers). Fires can be a double energy blow as they provide heat and for those with wetbacks FREE hot water.

rb99

3422 posts

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#2757901 10-Aug-2021 12:09

Nationalise it.

Whatever was privatised, do the opposite.

“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” -John Kenneth Galbraith

rb99

Obraik

2123 posts

Uber Geek

#2757904 10-Aug-2021 12:18

Fred99:

Yeah.

So I picked the largest one in that list the Castle Hill Wind Farm (up to 858 MW) , consent lodged in 2011, appealed and consent granted in 2013 (8 years ago), consent expires in 2023, and a news comment from Genesis that there are “no immediate construction plans”.

That list seems to include many at the same stage. Is there a list of power projects that actually might happen?

Just because it's not under construction doesn't mean it's not consented. This is a byproduct of National selling off the generation companies. A Private company needs to be generating revenue. Building ahead of need doesn't have great cost benefits so they're not going to build those consented stations until they're well and truly needed - which in the mean time means shortage spikes.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

Groucho

524 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2757905 10-Aug-2021 12:18

rb99:

Nationalise it.

Whatever was privatised, do the opposite.

Yep, there are parallels as the same Government that gave us the energy reforms in the 90s also deregulated the building industry which has landed us with a multi-billion dollar leaky building industry. Wonder how Jenny Shipley's involvement in the construction sector is going?!?

Scott3

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#2757906 10-Aug-2021 12:20

Dingbatt:

Linuxluver:

I have 2 Tesla Powerwalls.....

I thought TPWs needed a mains input to operate. Is that not the case anymore?

...

Family members have one. Their system has a actuated grid isolation switch, allowing the system to automatically isolate from the grid, and commence operation in island mode, in the event that that there is a grid outage.

rb99

3422 posts

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#2757916 10-Aug-2021 12:37

Groucho:

rb99:

Nationalise it.

Whatever was privatised, do the opposite.

Yep, there are parallels as the same Government that gave us the energy reforms in the 90s also deregulated the building industry which has landed us with a multi-billion dollar leaky building industry. Wonder how Jenny Shipley's involvement in the construction sector is going?!?

That I don't know very much about as I was brought up in the UK, but to me its a simple (very old, well known argument) - if its a natural monopoly and and an essential service then its publicly owned - the end. There's plenty of well run publicly owned entities, and no doubt plenty of badly run ones, but ditto for private companies.

“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” -John Kenneth Galbraith

rb99

DjShadow

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#2757929 10-Aug-2021 12:39

There is another notice out for the period of 5:30pm to 7:30pm tonight: https://www.transpower.co.nz/sites/default/files/interfaces/can/CAN%20Low%20Residual%20Situation%204028274213.pdf

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