I'm depressed... help!

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1932 posts

Uber Geek

#528694 3-Oct-2011 19:47

Check out this interview with Gareth Morgan on Q+A yesterday. Just shows how bad the NZ economy is performing.

http://tvnz.co.nz/q-and-a-news/gareth-morgan-sir-paul-callaghan-10-41-video-4430315/video

skyplonk

451 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#528723 3-Oct-2011 21:06

hellonearthisman
I can understand why the rich would vote for National, they got a pretty sweet deal from there tax cuts.

LOL!! I think that comment sums you up totally. I am not rich, In fact, I am far from rich, but voted right. I hardly got a "sweet deal".. A few dollars a week extra. A better deal than Labour and the Greens for another term!!

Who would I rather have running the country?
Some life long academic or a businessman with some experience?

Lets look left....High taxes (business and personal), hand out after hand out, social engineering, minorities that get more say (or listened to more) than the working folk.. Not to mention all this "green" crap. No thanks.

mattwnz

20180 posts

Uber Geek

#528757 3-Oct-2011 22:21

ajw: Check out this interview with Gareth Morgan on Q+A yesterday. Just shows how bad the NZ economy is performing.

http://tvnz.co.nz/q-and-a-news/gareth-morgan-sir-paul-callaghan-10-41-video-4430315/video

I didn't need to watch it to know the problems. Gareth knows his stuff, and would suggest that all NZers listen to what he says before chosing which party to vote for.

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528771 3-Oct-2011 23:33

John2010:
Brendan:
John2010: It seems they do not teach economics in schools or if they do the teachers deliver it with a strong flavour of Labour/NZ First's political rhetoric .

Perhaps the guardians of the "family silver" can tell us what other businesses the government should buy or start, or do they think the current portfolio of government owned businesses comprises a perfect portfolio?

Economics? You mean that pseudo-science based on ideology rather than fact?

Thankyou for confirming that your views have no sound basis at all.

Such a sweeping and unjustified view tell us more about you than me.

Economics does not qualify as a proper science - like chemistry or biology. Economics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia explains it a little, and this is what I found in 30 seconds. That article refers to it as a 'social science', a term which is much loser in definition than 'science' and deals more with human behaviour - e.g. psychology.
For example, there is no proper Nobel Prize in Economics as there are for all other proper sciences.

Now, having established you are wrong and I am right, I trust there will be no more ad-hominem attacks?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528772 3-Oct-2011 23:36

Ragnor:
nakedmolerat:
Ragnor:
National: No tax changes, reduce spending

reduce spending? i doubt it - they have spent more than labour in one term

oh dont forget that national will sell our 'national assets' to make the balance book look better!

You have to be kidding.. in Labour's last term(s) they brought in Working for familes, 4% kiwisaver and interest free student loans.

Massive amount of spending.

There is nothing wrong with spending - it's what we buy which is in question.

If we are buying more education and better living conditions, it is worth the money.

If we are lining the pockets of people already over burdened with money - that is bad.

Now, as a matter of history - Which NZ political party has as part of it's stated ideology the goal of enriching the Rich and hoping the rest will trickle down to you?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528773 3-Oct-2011 23:41

Ragnor:
Brendan:
MikeSkyrme:
Um, no. 51% is more than half ownership retained by the Govt. This means 51% of potential profits are still retained.

Why settle for 51% of the profits when we can have 100% by NOT SELLING OUR ASSETS!

Remember when the phone system was state owned, 6 months to get a phone line connected.

So, your argument is that if left in public hands, the electrons from our power stations will slow down and take 6 months to get to us?

Or do you mean they will introduce a delay of 6 months before connecting your power even though they do it now within a day or two? Why?

Perhaps they will also bring back Mullet hair do's and 8 track tape players as well?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#528774 3-Oct-2011 23:42

jaymz:
MikeSkyrme:
hellonearthisman:
nakedmolerat:
1080p:
Linuxluver:?NZ doesn't have a serious debt problem. But it is a lot worse now, at just under 30% of GDP than it was ?(only 18% of GDP) when National took office.?

What is your source for this data?

you can download it HERE

edit: if you look under the government sector, official government debt while under labour always below ~$20billion. since national took over, it has jumped over ~$40billion

This Time Series of Fiscal and Economic Indicators - Budget Economic and Fiscal Update 2011 ? The Treasury - New Zealand also shows how badly National Have done. Note since National took power notice how all the figures have been getting worse, Total Crown net worth, Gross debt.
Labor had Core Crown revenue exceeding the Core Crown expenses, unlike what National are managing to do.

The figures appear to have started to get worse at about the same time as the global recession kicked in with a vengeance.

Do you suppose there is a connection there?

Don't be silly! that would mean that everyone couldn't blame the government for the debt!

To be honest, I am sick to death about the whole blame game when it comes to this. It is the same old argument each time. Labour supporters blame National, National supporters blame Labour. People on the fence blame the current government.

There is no magic pill/choice that will help get NZ out of debt. As said by Johnr, focus on clearing your own debts if you have any first.

Oh, and if you have a large debt, how about thinking of a way to quickly clear it and then let the government know so they can do the same for NZ's debt?

/rant

Well said!

Especially the bit about each side blaming the other.

When will people wake up and see NONE of our politicians have a bloody clue!

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mattwnz

20180 posts

Uber Geek

#528776 3-Oct-2011 23:54

Brendan:When will people wake up and see NONE of our politicians have a bloody clue!
?

Neither do economists.

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528777 3-Oct-2011 23:55

polglase:
Some thoughts on Government Expenditure for feedback

You ask a lot of questions - it's a pity they are all the same.

Can we afford it?

I have one for you: can we afford NOT to?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528779 4-Oct-2011 00:01

TheUngeek:
Labour cultivated a culture of handouts and a sense of entitlement. Don't worry about getting a job, the state will make the rich pay for you.

I see this claim a lot from National supporters.

What I don't see is a single reference to where Labour stated this, no URL's, no peer reviewed scientific papers...

Nothing.

You know what we call a Fantastic Claim without equally fantastic evidence to support it?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528780 4-Oct-2011 00:08

MikeSkyrme:
Brendan:
MikeSkyrme:
Um, no. 51% is more than half ownership retained by the Govt. This means 51% of potential profits are still retained.

Why settle for 51% of the profits when we can have 100% by NOT SELLING OUR ASSETS!

Perhaps 51% of the profits from a highly efficient, privately operated asset would be more than the 100% currently realised by the inefficient state run assets......

Can you show me any examples of a country selling off 49% of it's electricity generating capacity and ending up with cost to consumers going down and the profits being greater than when it was 100% owned?

I will need properly scientific references. E.g. no opinion blogs, political web sites, or other vested interests.

No?

No, didn't think so.

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#528781 4-Oct-2011 00:11

TheUngeek: State run = money pit.
You would be amazed at the costs that are in some of our govt offices. Key is correct in going after them to reduce costs. Massive wastage is common.

References?

I am genuinely interested to have some official papers from Statistics NZ showing that State Run companies are always a 'money pit'.

Should i hold my breath?

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528783 4-Oct-2011 00:20

TheUngeek:

The last Labor lead government ran with a surplus even after buying some BMW's (The National also brought and could have pulled out if they wanted too) and other minor things.

WRONG, Labour signed into a deal that forced National to continue with them as the out would have cost more. Just like the Americas cup deal. Labour signed a deal making it more costly NOT to do it. How dishonest is that!? But it was typical of Helen. Dishonest and two faced. Literally lol.

Labour still did better with the spending than is National.

Jumping track to moan about a side show like BMW's was totally transparent. I've seen religious people do the same thing when cornered.

Are you aware you did that?

And again you are forgetting the recession, something well outside control of the government. In fact it's due to the government that we have weathered it reallativly untouched compared to many other countries.

Ahh, the recession! National would be the Second Coming of Jesus but for the Evil Recession!

Would you be so generous if it was Labour now in Government instead of National? Be honest...

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528784 4-Oct-2011 00:22

mattwnz:
With labour they managed to make a huge percentage of the population beneficiaries of some type with working for families, and beneficieries are their target market. As are students with their no interest student loan policies.

Interesting.

So, your contention is that Labour can get elected to government by 'buying' the votes of a few hundred thousand people by increasing their dole a couple of dollars?

Really?

Wow.

Brendan

716 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#528785 4-Oct-2011 00:26

mattwnz:
Brendan:When will people wake up and see NONE of our politicians have a bloody clue!
?

Neither do economists.

That is all too true. you might as well ask a witchdoctor.

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