Opinions on Mortgage Affordability

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quickymart

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#2407125 26-Jan-2020 18:08

TwoSeven:

dejadeadnz:

However, if someone is open to apartments and perhaps aren't looking at having a family immediately, there are brand new apartments available for less than $600K which have gazillion times better temperature profiles, insulation, interior design, and what not than your average 1960s-built "classic Kiwi home".

And no-one can live in them.

The reality is with appartments is there is generally no public transport that is on-time and takes less than three days to get half a mile down the road, or that turns up and isn’t over crowded and doesn’t result in one getting soaked when its raining.

Appartments I think need to be built with single and double garages, that a not only wide enough to get out of the car but where there is enough space to store other stuff like hobby equipment.

i would expect a one or two bedroom apartment to have at least a single garage and anything bigger to have a double.

I'd be happy with an apartment.

Obraik

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#2407160 26-Jan-2020 19:48

dejadeadnz:

Obraik:

Yeah but as I mentioned, doing that means I miss out on the new home owner grants. It also doesn't change the fact that I'm still renting in Auckland and adds a whole bunch of other risks, such as bad tenants.

I don't really want to take side on this debate (not enough information to form a firm view one way or another on what's best for your present circumstances) but aspects of your thinking demonstrate the clear and well-known psychological bias of valuing the perceived loss of something concrete over any loss of an opportunity to avoid a bigger loss or make a bigger gain in the future. At some point you have to be conscious of the numbers, if you time the market wrong or keep waiting till it's the right time to access the grants, by the time you currently think it's the right time to buy/you'll be eligible, the grants criteria might change, the banks might have different lending rules, and all sorts of other things.

A lot of your decision-making process strikes me as rather emotional/intuition-based -- it's your life but I'd go and take a serious financial advice and then decide.

That quote from me is in regards to buying a house in Christchurch while still renting in Auckland. As I mentioned, I don't really have any interest in running a rental and I don't think there's much to gain from it in Christchurch right now. I'd rather wait and buy the house when I actually get to Christchurch in the next year or two.

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dejadeadnz

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#2407254 26-Jan-2020 22:39

TwoSeven:

And no-one can live in them.

The reality is with appartments is there is generally no public transport that is on-time and takes less than three days to get half a mile down the road, or that turns up and isn’t over crowded and doesn’t result in one getting soaked when its raining.

Appartments I think need to be built with single and double garages, that a not only wide enough to get out of the car but where there is enough space to store other stuff like hobby equipment.

i would expect a one or two bedroom apartment to have at least a single garage and anything bigger to have a double.

This is so stupidly and manifestly exaggerated that it's barely worth responding to. I live in Albany and although I drive to work at Newmarket most of the time, I do regularly take the bus (at least a few times a month). There are multiple brand new/near new apartment buildings with apartments selling below the 600K mark that are within easy walking distance to the Albany bus stop. The NEX buses are extremely regular and frequent and other buses, such as ones that can take one to near-CBD suburbs like Ponsonby, Newmarket, and the like, are also extremely frequent. Yes, I fully acknowledge that the bus-heavy public transport system in Auckland is hardly perfect and that the system overall can stand significant improvement. But I am also aware of numerous examples of people living in apartments that rely on public transport. Public transport patronage rates are only going up and there are more and more bus lanes being built -- all of these suggest that your dystopian views of public transport in Auckland to be unjustified.

And your suggestion in regards to apartments having lots of garages simply ignores reality. One of the problems with apartment construction in NZ is that, on a m2 basis, apartments are already significantly more expensive than houses. Tacking on more garages won't help pricing and won't help the issues that people here are discussing, i.e. providing more options and greater affordability. People who want lots of garaging space and can realistically afford it can buy whatever apartments or houses that they want within the constraints of reality. This isn't going to help a lot of people who need real options.

Handle9

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#2407256 26-Jan-2020 23:02

TwoSeven:
dejadeadnz:

However, if someone is open to apartments and perhaps aren't looking at having a family immediately, there are brand new apartments available for less than $600K which have gazillion times better temperature profiles, insulation, interior design, and what not than your average 1960s-built "classic Kiwi home".

And no-one can live in them.

The reality is with appartments is there is generally no public transport that is on-time and takes less than three days to get half a mile down the road, or that turns up and isn’t over crowded and doesn’t result in one getting soaked when its raining.

Appartments I think need to be built with single and double garages, that a not only wide enough to get out of the car but where there is enough space to store other stuff like hobby equipment.

i would expect a one or two bedroom apartment to have at least a single garage and anything bigger to have a double.

Ummm I guess the millions of people who say they happily live in apartments are lying.

A modern, quality apartment building has a thing known colloquially as an “underground car park”. These are used to park cars, negating the need for a garage.

dejadeadnz

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#2407358 27-Jan-2020 09:59

There’s a greater issue beyond the OP’s rant about garages and storage for apartments. With the rise of the small house movement and other noticeable factors, it is clear that a sizeable number of people no longer wish to live in houses where a sizeable area is just dedicated to storing a large amount of “junk” that see little use. And Kiwi “developers”, especially in the housing space, continue to have no clue when it comes to how to layout homes to maximise space, storage and light. Look at YT channels like Never Too Small, House and Home, and any Hong Kong our Taiwan based interior design channels (a few of which have English CC) and you can see how people overseas are half a century ahead of NZ in terms of including high quality cabinetry and storage options across all levels of housing.

NZ should aim to improve the quality of its housing and not just hoard more space with stupidly placed gib walls, garages, and what not.

alasta

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#2407369 27-Jan-2020 10:42

I am currently having a 40 sq/m unit built. It will have a secure car park, modern fitout, central heating, great views, access to frequent public transport, built in cabinetry with lots of storage space, freehold title, and covenants to prevent anti-social behaviour from neighbours.

As someone who lives alone and hates clutter, I am struggling to think what benefit I would have got if I bought a house three times the size.

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tdgeek

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#2407374 27-Jan-2020 10:53

alasta:

I am currently having a 40 sq/m unit built. It will have a secure car park, modern fitout, central heating, great views, access to frequent public transport, built in cabinetry with lots of storage space, freehold title, and covenants to prevent anti-social behaviour from neighbours.

As someone who lives alone and hates clutter, I am struggling to think what benefit I would have got if I bought a house three times the size.

Everyone is different, what you find ideal, others would not like. So, there is no right or wrong answer. Same as why some people have a large SUV and others have a little car, they are both good choices if thats what you want or need

Our home is 283 sqm, 1000 sqm land, we like the space, the view, the lawns/gardens, vege gardens, fruit trees. We like the space. Horses for courses.

dejadeadnz

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#2407408 27-Jan-2020 11:38

You're missing his wider point. His point (aside from the fact that he's happy with a smaller space) is that he likes a modern fit out and sophisticated storage options that for anyone who's looked for a home lately (we just bought our 2nd home), you'd know it's practically non-existent unless you design and build with a really good builder and other professionals on board. Even if you have the money, not everyone has the time.

Instead, as someone who also hates clutter, my wife and I have found that the choice in NZ is typically either buy a smaller home that is terribly designed and inefficient in every respect (e.g. your typical rubbish Kiwi 1960s/70s "classic" with no insulation and other hjorrors) or you have to get these larger McMansions with lots of rooms that are separated out using gib walls and poorly integrated. We ended up buying a small new build and doing a six-figure renovation to (relatively) quickly get what we wanted. Along the way there was obviously so much wastage for obvious reasons.

If you want "just" big, there's lots of options in NZ; likewise for "just" small. What many would like to see is people involved in construction trying a bit harder and offer more utility, instead of occupying more land and increasing the costs ever more.

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#2407424 27-Jan-2020 11:49

@dejadeadNZ I agree 100%. Good lord did I just say that 😀

We have been looking a down sizing plans in NZ and comparing them to offshore and our home are pathetic on so many levels. Add in disability requirements and we are up the proverbial creek without and means of propulsion. What house builders consider as disability friendly is a joke and what they consider is useable, logical storage is just plain laughable.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

tdgeek

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#2407431 27-Jan-2020 12:00

dejadeadnz:

You're missing his wider point. His point (aside from the fact that he's happy with a smaller space) is that he likes a modern fit out and sophisticated storage options that for anyone who's looked for a home lately (we just bought our 2nd home), you'd know it's practically non-existent unless you design and build with a really good builder and other professionals on board. Even if you have the money, not everyone has the time.

Instead, as someone who also hates clutter, my wife and I have found that the choice in NZ is typically either buy a smaller home that is terribly designed and inefficient in every respect (e.g. your typical rubbish Kiwi 1960s/70s "classic" with no insulation and other hjorrors) or you have to get these larger McMansions with lots of rooms that are separated out using gib walls and poorly integrated. We ended up buying a small new build and doing a six-figure renovation to (relatively) quickly get what we wanted. Along the way there was obviously so much wastage for obvious reasons.

If you want "just" big, there's lots of options in NZ; likewise for "just" small. What many would like to see is people involved in construction trying a bit harder and offer more utility, instead of occupying more land and increasing the costs ever more.

I didnt see his point that way. His main peeve was clutter, and the other factors he mentioned were a list of features of his build.

I agree that big is not ideal in the greater scheme of things these days, although here in Chch there is room to expand, so our section isnt holding anything back, although I believe that since this house was built in 2011, sections of this size are not allowed by CCC

alasta

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#2407480 27-Jan-2020 12:29

To clarify, I wasn't suggesting that living within the confines of 40 sq/m is right for everyone. I was just trying to point out that, if done well, it can be a great solution for people who are suited to that type of housing.

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#2410919 31-Jan-2020 21:04

I hope that guy isn't a millennial because it comes across as reinforcing stereotypes!

I live in an Auckland CBD fringe apartment, less than 2 years old and about a 5 minute walk to a bus stop that will see me wait less at most 5 minutes at any time during the day to take me into the city. There is plenty of parking in the underground carpark (although at $70k a pop I was not keen).

Price was just under the grant cap of $650k for a new build so got $10,000 from the government, and there are loads of apartments in Auckland that would be eligible for this too. If you want a standalone house for under the cap, then tough luck and get a run down POS or move elsewhere. The govt doesn't actually owe you anything.

dejadeadnz - can you give info on Williams? I am well aware of them and get a lot of emails but have seen mostly positive things about them so curious to hear about these conditions.

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