Should people like this be helped?

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#2084153 5-Sep-2018 08:02

While it's good enough has been raised to bring this woman back, it's disappointing (although not surprising) that Simon Bridges is trying to gain politically from it.

allio

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#2084170 5-Sep-2018 09:01

https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018661082/nzer-in-coma-in-bali-didn-t-declare-medical-condition-to-insurer

Travel insurer is Cover-More (Air New Zealand) and Mrs Hartley did not disclose her pre-existing condition. Hence the family's subsequent decision not to name or blame the insurer.

There has been a lot of assumptions made in the absence of information, which I think unfortunately has contributed to the issue being politicised. I wonder if those calling on the government to step in because she did "everything right" would have taken the same positions had they known this.

Not a big fan of Simon Bridges being involved either. I don't really blame him for accepting the opportunity when presented with it (he needs all the positive publicity he can get), but why would the anonymous donor choose to go through him? No reason whatsoever except to give Bridges a boost.

quickymart

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#2084175 5-Sep-2018 09:12

If he was actually in the Government I doubt he would have helped like he says he would. Otherwise, it sets a precedent (IMO).

MikeAqua

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#2084177 5-Sep-2018 09:18

quickymart: If he was actually in the Government I doubt he would have helped like he says he would. Otherwise, it sets a precedent (IMO).

His comment on that was "precedents are broken all the time"

Of course it's much easier to say that in opposition than in govt.

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allio

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#2084192 5-Sep-2018 09:44

MikeAqua:

quickymart: If he was actually in the Government I doubt he would have helped like he says he would. Otherwise, it sets a precedent (IMO).

His comment on that was "precedents are broken all the time"

Of course it's much easier to say that in opposition than in govt.

Yup - like when Labour campaigned in opposition to have Keytruda funded, despite Pharmac determining the evidence wasn't there.

It's easy to call for things for which there is a sympathetic cause when you're not the one ultimately responsible for the precedent being set. When the next cause comes along asking for help - it's not your problem.

Lias

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#2084288 5-Sep-2018 12:50

So if the Radio NZ article is accurate, she had a pre-existing _bowel_ condition, and did not declare it.. Not an apparently unrelated breathing condition as some said.

What little sympathy I had for her has pretty much entirely evaporated. Pity the gullible public have funded her gambling.

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#2084298 5-Sep-2018 13:12

Still hard to judge. To the media, everybody dies of a heart attack just because the heart is the last thing to stop that by definition is the moment when death occurs. A bowel condition in the media means nothing to me. Someone that farts a lot has a bowel condition.

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#2084325 5-Sep-2018 13:44

Batman: Still hard to judge. To the media, everybody dies of a heart attack just because the heart is the last thing to stop that by definition is the moment when death occurs. A bowel condition in the media means nothing to me. Someone that farts a lot has a bowel condition.

Insurance companies specialise in finding ways to deny claims. It's what they do.

That's why you have to declare everything.

I have difficulty getting life and travel insurance, due to pre-existing conditions. I usually end up with a choice between exclusions and higher premiums. PITA and insurer's aren't consistent between trips and don't place any weight on having insured me on previous trips. Each trip I have to shop around. On a trip to the US, a doctor's appointment and meds for a minor illness cost an order of magnitude more than the travel insurance premium for the whole trip.

Mike

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#2084341 5-Sep-2018 14:02

Lias:

So if the Radio NZ article is accurate, she had a pre-existing _bowel_ condition, and did not declare it.. Not an apparently unrelated breathing condition as some said.

What little sympathy I had for her has pretty much entirely evaporated. Pity the gullible public have funded her gambling.

Hard to argue there. Maybe too much emphasis on insurance companies, who in this case appear to have done nothing wrong at all

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#2087244 11-Sep-2018 07:00

Woman has died in Bali according to news.

FWIW I did a trial booking of Bali flights with Air NZ. There is ONE click box where it says if you buy travel insurance you're covered immediately. There is no line to declare any pre existing conditions. There is no warning, no request, in fact NO WAY to declare anything at time of purchase (not even a tick box). There is some vague mention about something about if you're under 65 being covered if you meet the terms and conditions. Doesn't explicitly say what they are. There is a very very small print of a link to the policy brochure. But that is about 10 times smaller font than the words that says covered immediately.

I'd put the blame right on the insurance company, the tick box, Air NZ.

You don't get away with these fine prints on a McDonald's ad or a telephone provider.

DarthKermit

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#2087246 11-Sep-2018 07:13

Sad that she has died. Hopefully the give a little will have raised enough to pay for her hospital bills, now that they wont have to pay for a medivac flight.

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#2087247 11-Sep-2018 07:15

Batman:

Woman has died in Bali according to news.

FWIW I did a trial booking of Bali flights with Air NZ. There is ONE click box where it says if you buy travel insurance you're covered immediately. There is no line to declare any pre existing conditions. There is no warning, no request, in fact NO WAY to declare anything at time of purchase (not even a tick box). There is some vague mention about something about if you're under 65 being covered if you meet the terms and conditions. Doesn't explicitly say what they are. There is a very very small print of a link to the policy brochure. But that is about 10 times smaller font than the words that says covered immediately.

I'd put the blame right on the insurance company, the tick box, Air NZ.

You don't get away with these fine prints on a McDonald's ad or a telephone provider.

IF that was the case.

Did you read the T+C's?

Edit The reason I say this is that the insurance company has been blameless from the start. If there was any grey area, the family would have raised that publically, and pressure would have been applied. I feel it is a lesson to those with pre existing conditions to dot the i's and cross the T's. Everyone else can tick the box and travel. I do agree that what you have showed is poor. All it needs is a link to show here is what is covered, what is not covered, and further tickboxes to add or exclude cover. Seems that at the moment its more a revenue generator than true insurance.

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#2087253 11-Sep-2018 07:30

Batman:

Woman has died in Bali according to news.

FWIW I did a trial booking of Bali flights with Air NZ. There is ONE click box where it says if you buy travel insurance you're covered immediately. There is no line to declare any pre existing conditions. There is no warning, no request, in fact NO WAY to declare anything at time of purchase (not even a tick box). There is some vague mention about something about if you're under 65 being covered if you meet the terms and conditions. Doesn't explicitly say what they are. There is a very very small print of a link to the policy brochure. But that is about 10 times smaller font than the words that says covered immediately.

I'd put the blame right on the insurance company, the tick box, Air NZ.

You don't get away with these fine prints on a McDonald's ad or a telephone provider.

The "See what this policy covers" hyperlink is in the same font size as the text above and takes you to the pdf of the policy wording.

When you tick the box you are declaring that you agree to the terms and conditions. As with all insurance policies it is up to the person taking out the poilicy to read the policy wordng.

There is also a 14-day money back guarantee if you are unhappy with the T&C's.

I don't think the insurance company or Air NZ is to blame.

If you can't laugh at yourself then you probably shouldn't laugh at others.

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#2087273 11-Sep-2018 08:36

So the ACT idiot Seymour has responded blaming the Govt. It must be his fortnightly need to get on the news

What about the others?

"Ardern said this was not an isolated case. There are 3000 people seeking MFAT help and 280 medical emergency cases, she said."

Where is Seymour's bill to fund all that and ongoingly???

Tactless getting his oar in at this time

MikeB4

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#2087278 11-Sep-2018 08:50

Who here can honestly say they read ALL the Terms and conditions of the likes of Insurance policies?

Who here can say they understand them?

Who here can say they understand the implications relating to them?

Who here can remember and document all the sore throats, stomach aches, aching back, head ache, sore leg,infected cut etc they have experienced in the last 5-10 years?

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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