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networkn

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#119291 27-May-2013 13:27
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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10886440

Reminds me of the Cru Twins. 

The solution to this problem is to imprison all those not co-operating until co-operation resumes. 

Sadly NZ is so soft on this type of things, miscarriages of justice will continue to occur. 

I still shake my head to understand how those two little boys could have been killed and no-one held accountable. I can't imagine covering up something like that for someone else. 




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johnr
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  #826173 27-May-2013 13:32
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Lock them up throw away the key til they speak

 
 
 

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networkn

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  #826185 27-May-2013 13:37
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johnr: Lock them up throw away the key til they speak


Entirely this. Then make sure that the first one to speak gets immunity unless they are the person who committed the crime, and everyone else gets obstruction charges and a mandatory 90 days in Jail.


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  #826389 27-May-2013 15:47
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You're familiar with the Prisoner's dilemma, right?



1080p
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  #826425 27-May-2013 16:07
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Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.

networkn

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  #826427 27-May-2013 16:08
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1080p: Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.


If you are saying you should be allowed to be silent to protect someone who has killed another, then let me help you pack.

Having said that, you are welcome to silence, you just need to do it sitting in a cell :)

Byrned
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  #826429 27-May-2013 16:10
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Perhaps if it can be proven that a crime was committed and all were evidence to it, but will not speak as to who did it, then they are all treated as having committed the crime?

Seems fair

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  #826453 27-May-2013 16:33
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Byrned: Perhaps if it can be proven that a crime was committed and all were evidence to it, but will not speak as to who did it, then they are all treated as having committed the crime?

Seems fair


I don't disagree, but the bottom line is the basic rights we all have enshrined in law including the right to remain silent, and the right to be considered innocent until proven guilty.

It's a hard one for the Government but believe they have to tackle it and soon.

 




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  #826463 27-May-2013 16:37
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1080p: Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.


In some countries (USA for example) you have the right to silence providing you would incriminate yourself by talking.

In any case, there's the option of the police saying these people are perverting the course of justice and legally get them behind bars.





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freitasm
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  #826476 27-May-2013 16:41
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scuwp:
Byrned: Perhaps if it can be proven that a crime was committed and all were evidence to it, but will not speak as to who did it, then they are all treated as having committed the crime?

Seems fair


I don't disagree, but the bottom line is the basic rights we all have enshrined in law including the right to remain silent, and the right to be considered innocent until proven guilty.


There's no "right to remain silent" here because they are not talking to the suspect. There's no right to considered innocent here because they're not talking to the suspect.

The whole thing is about getting witnesses to tell investigators their version of the facts. Not doing so is a way to block justice, and there's a law for that.





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  #826536 27-May-2013 18:12
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1080p: Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.


And I'll be on the same flight.

The right to silence is a long standing right established for pretty good reasons. Stopping, for instance, threats of jail time and torture being used to extract false evidence.

Maybe those left behind could then go the whole hog, and just allow the Police to pull out fingernails and beat confessions out of people with rubber hoses? They could hum the North Korean national anthem while they did it.

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  #826538 27-May-2013 18:21
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The Right of Silence (PDF, lawcom.govt.nz)






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networkn

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  #826547 27-May-2013 18:35
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JimmyH:
1080p: Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.


And I'll be on the same flight.

The right to silence is a long standing right established for pretty good reasons. Stopping, for instance, threats of jail time and torture being used to extract false evidence.

Maybe those left behind could then go the whole hog, and just allow the Police to pull out fingernails and beat confessions out of people with rubber hoses? They could hum the North Korean national anthem while they did it.


If you need help packing, or a ride to the airport, just let me know.  Seriously, there is a difference between the right to silence if you don't wish to incriminate yourself, and wasting police time, putting others at risk, and allowing a crime to go unpunished for the sake of protecting a guilty party. 

Your claims that it leads to police beatings for confessions is just FUD.



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  #826562 27-May-2013 18:52
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networkn:
1080p: Wow... I'll leave this country if my right to silence is ever taken away.


If you are saying you should be allowed to be silent to protect someone who has killed another, then let me help you pack.



Make that two of us. I will pay for his one way ticket

gzt

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  #826575 27-May-2013 19:22
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The victim is perfectly able to speak for himself/herself and has chosen not to. No one else wants to get involved in it. It is a classic domestic violence situation and not uncommon.

Yes, it is not far removed from the unsolved Chris & Cru murder/manslaughter/total negligence/whatever.

Focus on what needs to change to prevent situations like that. What you propose will have very little impact.

Taking away a basic right is not going to sort it out.

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  #826590 27-May-2013 19:46
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gzt: The victim is perfectly able to speak for himself/herself and has chosen not to. No one else wants to get involved in it.



ummm... the victim is dead.

 Witnesses to the death of a Whakatu woman, who died as a result of burns on Christmas Day, have closed ranks and will not tell police what happened.

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