What's the legality of using a auto signature machine NZ.

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jimbob79

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#151736 3-Sep-2014 16:14

My boss has requested me about getting an auto signature machine. I have not found a supplier here in NZ and I'm going to buy one from the USA. However I do not know the legality of such a machine, are they allowed? Is there are reason why I can't buy a auto signature machine here in New Zealand?

gzt

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#1121379 3-Sep-2014 19:37

What is it for?

sbiddle

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#1121381 3-Sep-2014 19:53

gzt: What is it for?

For signing documents - it's basically a machine that uses a pen, so it looks like a signature was done by a real person.

ObidiahSlope

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#1121382 3-Sep-2014 20:02

Are you printing letters. What about the signature line feature in MS Word?

The Yanks use check franking machines but I have never seen them used in new Zealand. Sheet feed blank cheques are available by arrangement from banks but cheques are a bit old hat.

If you want to prevent copies of documents circulating as originals you may have to resort to holographic or tamper proof stickers.

Obsequious hypocrite

jimbob79

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#1121458 3-Sep-2014 22:30

ObidiahSlope: Are you printing letters. What about the signature line feature in MS Word?

The Yanks use check franking machines but I have never seen them used in new Zealand. Sheet feed blank cheques are available by arrangement from banks but cheques are a bit old hat.

If you want to prevent copies of documents circulating as originals you may have to resort to holographic or tamper proof stickers.

We are not printing our own documents. There has been many times in the last few years and more frequently in the last few months where the one person who needs to sign a time sensitive contract (or similar) is out of the country and unable to sign the document. This is the reason for an auto signature machine.

gzt

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#1121464 3-Sep-2014 22:47

Ah. Hence the question of legality of autosigned documents in NZ.

nakedmolerat

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#1121466 3-Sep-2014 22:49

If it is 'legal' enough for US presidents to use it, it should be just fine and as acceptable here?

gzt

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#1121469 3-Sep-2014 23:02

I can only guess. I could assume in legal terms it is just the instrument of signing. If it is challenged in court it may stand because the person who 'signed' it will say I swear it is a true contract, I ordered the signing button to be pushed, and the other party also signed it and dated it to give it effect.

If a mod updates the topic title to something like is an autopened contract legally enforceable that might attract some lawyers. I expect someone with actual knowledge will drop by anytime now ; ).

Maybe until it is challenged in an NZ court nobody will know for sure.

That does seem to provide a loophole that if an autosign is used and the contract is invalid because the signature was 'forged', by someone in your employ this is very close to a denial and a handwriting expert is not going to help here. Ouch. Head hurts.

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jimbob79

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#1121475 3-Sep-2014 23:13

nakedmolerat: If it is 'legal' enough for US presidents to use it, it should be just fine and as acceptable here?

Somebody has been looking at wikipedia.

jimbob79

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#1121476 3-Sep-2014 23:18

gzt: I can only guess. I could assume in legal terms it is just the instrument of signing. If it is challenged in court it may stand because the person who 'signed' it will say I swear it is a true contract, I ordered the signing button to be pushed, and the other party also signed it and dated it to give it effect.

If a mod updates the topic title to something like is an autopened contract legally enforceable that might attract some lawyers. I expect someone with actual knowledge will drop by anytime now ; ).

Maybe until it is challenged in an NZ court nobody will know for sure.

That does seem to provide a loophole that if an autosign is used and the contract is invalid because the signature was 'forged', by someone in your employ this is very close to a denial and a handwriting expert is not going to help here. Ouch. Head hurts.

I feel that I have just fallen into a 'Legal Paradox'.

mattwnz

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#1121478 3-Sep-2014 23:28

gzt: I can only guess. I could assume in legal terms it is just the instrument of signing. If it is challenged in court it may stand because the person who 'signed' it will say I swear it is a true contract, I ordered the signing button to be pushed, and the other party also signed it and dated it to give it effect.

If a mod updates the topic title to something like is an autopened contract legally enforceable that might attract some lawyers. I expect someone with actual knowledge will drop by anytime now ; ).

Maybe until it is challenged in an NZ court nobody will know for sure.

That does seem to provide a loophole that if an autosign is used and the contract is invalid because the signature was 'forged', by someone in your employ this is very close to a denial and a handwriting expert is not going to help here. Ouch. Head hurts.

I don't think you could use it for a legal signature for an actual contract, as potentially anyone could use it. But maybe it is ok for a form letter, where normally it would be photocopied. But IANAL, so you should ask a lawyer for clarification. When someone signs something there are different weights and speeds that create the signature, so a machine may not be able to replicate that 100 percent.

Azzura

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#1121519 4-Sep-2014 08:00

My old boss - had a rubber stamp of his signature.

Bung

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#1121525 4-Sep-2014 08:14

You worked for Final Demand too?

chiefie

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#1121527 4-Sep-2014 08:20

I've recently had to use DocuSign for signing a contract and seems to work quite well.

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jimbob79

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#1121531 4-Sep-2014 08:26

chiefie: I've recently had to use DocuSign for signing a contract and seems to work quite well.

docusign does look good. Will need to trial it out.

chiefie

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#1121534 4-Sep-2014 08:28

jimbob79:
chiefie: I've recently had to use DocuSign for signing a contract and seems to work quite well.

docusign does look good. Will need to trial it out.

The contract I had to sign, is with an organisation that have to deal with many international companies too, so it seems like quite acceptable legit digital signature solution.

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