Bain Compensation Denied

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networkn

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#199048 2-Aug-2016 13:43

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11685735

I have to say I am really pleased with this. I feel it's the right decision. Unlike some other cases recently I felt his case was pretty different, and I agree he isn't innocent beyond a reasonable doubt.

I really hope that is the end of it.

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#1602898 2-Aug-2016 13:44

I get the feeling this saga is not finished yet

ubergeeknz

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#1602907 2-Aug-2016 13:55

MikeB4:

I get the feeling this saga is not finished yet

The Herald:

In an unusual move, the Government has agreed to make an ex gratia payment to Bain in the interests of bringing closure to the long-running claim. A full and final payment of $925,000 has been accepted by Bain's team.

Seems pretty finished to me

MikeB4

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#1602909 2-Aug-2016 13:58

ubergeeknz:

MikeB4:

I get the feeling this saga is not finished yet

The Herald:

In an unusual move, the Government has agreed to make an ex gratia payment to Bain in the interests of bringing closure to the long-running claim. A full and final payment of $925,000 has been accepted by Bain's team.

Seems pretty finished to me

Sorry, I meant we will see documentaries and probably a movie and other stuff on TV for a while yet

networkn

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#1602910 2-Aug-2016 13:58

The fact he can carry on appealing that gives him $925K in GO the HELL away money is bad in my opinion.

For my money he should consider himself exceptionally lucky to be free at all.

networkn

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#1602911 2-Aug-2016 13:59

MikeB4:

ubergeeknz:

MikeB4:

I get the feeling this saga is not finished yet

The Herald:

In an unusual move, the Government has agreed to make an ex gratia payment to Bain in the interests of bringing closure to the long-running claim. A full and final payment of $925,000 has been accepted by Bain's team.

Seems pretty finished to me

Sorry, I meant we will see documentaries and probably a movie and other stuff on TV for a while yet

Oh please no!

nathan

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#1602958 2-Aug-2016 14:10

He hasn't been found innocent. This sets a terrible precedent.

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#1602963 2-Aug-2016 14:17

nathan: He hasn't been found innocent. This sets a terrible precedent.

No-one can ever be found 'innocent' just 'not guilty'.

The privy council threw out Bain's 'guilty' verdict.

He went to re-trial presumed innocent until proven guilty and the crown were unable to prove him guilty.

I'm not saying I personally think he is innocent. Only one person really knows that.

Mike

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#1602966 2-Aug-2016 14:20

nathan: He hasn't been found innocent. This sets a terrible precedent.

100% agree, he should have got $0

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#1602973 2-Aug-2016 14:25

Bain always claimed that his daddy clipped the whole family and made it look like poor David had done the dirty deed.

The burden of proof is on the one making the claim. I guess he couldn't back up his assertions with any compelling evidence so he gets $0.00

networkn

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#1602974 2-Aug-2016 14:29

DarthKermit:

Bain always claimed that his daddy clipped the whole family and made it look like poor David had done the dirty deed.

The burden of proof is on the one making the claim. I guess he couldn't back up his assertions with any compelling evidence so he gets $0.00

My understanding of it was that the original evidence used was enough to clearly and beyond reasonable doubt prove him guilty, but at his second trial, because evidence wasn't collected "properly" it was considered in-admissable and the jury had to decide based on the other evidence which wasn't strong enough.
I understand why these rules apply, but for my money is he guilty because if the evidence HAD been collected properly, he wouldn't have been allowed a retrial in the first place, and if he had, it would have been guilty a second time.

I am of the belief that if you are found guilty, and appeal, and are found guilty a second time, your sentence should be extended by the time it would take you to earn the money it's cost to hold the trial.

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#1602976 2-Aug-2016 14:32

networkn:

The fact he can carry on appealing that gives him $925K in GO the HELL away money is bad in my opinion.

For my money he should consider himself exceptionally lucky to be free at all.

Welcome to civilised society, where people are allowed to have access to the courts. If you want to avoid litigation, there is almost always a cost. The ex-gratia payment to me is a sensible way to end this affair - any further legal proceedings would just cost the taxpayers more money and prevent all the people concerned from moving on.

Let's not forget the diabolical contribution of one Judith Collins to this affair. She didn't like what Justice Binnie decided and then in a procedurally flawed way sought to get another opinion. The process became so ludicrously tainted that everything had to start again with this report by Callinan. If you want to complain about wasted money/bad use of taxpayers' money, don't forget Collins' contribution. There will always be people who find any result against Bain as somewhat tainted, in view of the shenanigans I described.

And you can wail and cry about people's right of appeal all you like. Under the likes of the International Covenant of Civil and Political Rights, for example (to which NZ is a signatory), if we were to implement the kind of proposal you were wanting, NZ will almost certainly be in breach of many of its provisions. Does the rule of law not matter to you?

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#1602979 2-Aug-2016 14:35

dejadeadnz:
networkn:

The fact he can carry on appealing that gives him $925K in GO the HELL away money is bad in my opinion.

For my money he should consider himself exceptionally lucky to be free at all.

Welcome to civilised society, where people are allowed to have access to the courts. If you want to avoid litigation, there is almost always a Ost. The ex-gratia payment to me is a sensible way to end this affair - any further legal proceedings would just cost the taxpayers more money and prevent all the people concerned from moving on.

Let's not forget the diabolical contribution of one Judith Collins to this affair. She didn't like what Justice Binnie decided and then in a procedurally flawed way sought to get another opinion. The process became so ludicrously tainted that everything had to start again with this report by Callinan. If you want to complain about wasted money/bad use of taxpayers' money, don't forget Collins' contribution. There will always be people who find any result against Bain as somewhat tainted, in view of the shenanigans I described.

Collins definitely didn't handle it well, but she truly felt Binnie was flawed in his approach and was vindicated in a second report. One article I read by someone well thought of in international legal circles SAVAGED Binnies report, covered everything in detail. It wasn't pretty.

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#1602981 2-Aug-2016 14:39

networkn:

Collins definitely didn't handle it well, but she truly felt Binnie was flawed in his approach and was vindicated in a second report. One article I read by someone well thought of in international legal circles SAVAGED Binnies report, covered everything in detail. It wasn't pretty.

And there are also people who criticised Justice Fisher's report, as well as the fact that the Crown sought to resile from its own concessions at the Privy Council during the process before Justice Binnie. You can't just pick and choose what suits your argument. The fact is that much of the disquiet, whatever the decision was for Bain's compo bid, was entirely created by Collins' decision to judge shop and then initially deny the Bain team copies of Fisher's report.

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#1602983 2-Aug-2016 14:45

It is a very tough one. You do reach a point where you just have to move on with your life, and that is probably what he has done. I wonder what happens if new information or evidence comes to light where he can 100% prove his innocence.

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#1602986 2-Aug-2016 14:46

nathan: He hasn't been found innocent. This sets a terrible precedent.

He was not found guilty either.

Our laws are meant to be Innocent until proven Guilty, not the other way around.

I dont care how anyone feels, what they believe, the fact remains the law has failed to prove guilt and has taken away 14 years of someones life. If this finding had been made right at the beginning then those 14 years would have been vastly different/better, that is what the compensation is for.

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