NZHerald running story on shoddy Chorus contractor installation work

Forums › New Zealand Broadband › NZHerald running story on shoddy Chorus contractor installation work

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#1586347 5-Jul-2016 12:22

DarthKermit:

Will this turn into another leaky homes type situation in the future? Probably.

Funny you should say that :-)

We've just moved back into our ex-leaky home. I was lying in bed last night when I had a real "DOH!" moment. When we had all the cladding off, I took the opportunity to get structured ethernet cabling installed throughout the house. I gave a cursory thought to the ONT location when we finally get Fibre in my street in 2018, but no more than that. What I SHOULD have done is had something installed to make it a doddle to blow the fibre up to where I want the ONT to be (2nd story office, directly above the curb-facing garage). Too late now, but I'm hoping they may be able to use the existing dedicated ADSL port to pull it through when the time comes.

In my defence, there were so many moving parts to this project, and such a tight budget to it too. And I am still smiling from ear to ear that I finally have decent structured cabling coverage throughout my house.

surfisup1000

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#1586352 5-Jul-2016 12:25

When I was working in a development lab, we'd do code checks and corrective training. You'd think that chorus would do something similar.... have some of their trusted expert employees (even better , external auditors) undertake random audits of installers. This is pretty simple stuff and I would question why they don't do the equivalent in their industry.

I bet it comes down to cutting costs as much as possible and cutting corners so long as it does not make the papers :)

chevrolux

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#1586489 5-Jul-2016 15:31

surfisup1000:

When I was working in a development lab, we'd do code checks and corrective training. You'd think that chorus would do something similar.... have some of their trusted expert employees (even better , external auditors) undertake random audits of installers. This is pretty simple stuff and I would question why they don't do the equivalent in their industry.

I bet it comes down to cutting costs as much as possible and cutting corners so long as it does not make the papers :)

There is definitely QA guys working for Chorus. I think even CFH have their own QA'ers too. But the fact is there something like 15-20,000 orders being processed each month so each install just won't be checked. Also, the actual standards are incredibly low.... things like exposed microduct along a fence is "totally fine" according to Chorus.

woody99

165 posts

Master Geek

#1586523 5-Jul-2016 16:28

I have a complaint in with Chorus. The cable from road to house is exactly as described in the article with it running along a fence then underground with no protection from lawnmower or weed eater. The internal install was rubbish with the "technicians" refusing in wall cable run - they wanted to drill a hole in my ceiling and run the cable to the ONT down the outside of the wall. I refused that so they installed the box in the garage and left. I have to run the cable in wall myself. Sadly they completed the external cable run while I was away from home otherwise I would have refused that also.

A friend has also refused to sign off the road to house run - they ran the cable above ground, threaded through a hedge.

mattwnz

20147 posts

Uber Geek

#1586560 5-Jul-2016 18:03

They were discussing this on Radio NZ, and one of the radio staff said that their fibre cable had only been installed a couple of inches underground, where their power and water were at least 50-100cm under. They had asked if they could pay to have it deeper, but they weren't allowed, as it was a free install. Then they had the consumer woman on to say that any cable that did fail due to being poorly installed, it would be covered by the CGA by the retailer, and should be repaired for free as the install work wouldn't have been done with due care etc. Don't know what happens though if you change ISP?

It is interesting, because it will be the consumer who ultimately ends up paying with higher fees. I don't think they should be getting installed on fences, as fences have a short life, up to 15 years before they need to be replaced and the cable will then need to be removed professionally so not to damage it, and reinstalled. If installed underground, it potentially has a 50 -100 year life. Sounds like bean counters have been involved in trying to get install costs down.,

mattwnz

20147 posts

Uber Geek

#1586561 5-Jul-2016 18:05

chevrolux:

surfisup1000:

When I was working in a development lab, we'd do code checks and corrective training. You'd think that chorus would do something similar.... have some of their trusted expert employees (even better , external auditors) undertake random audits of installers. This is pretty simple stuff and I would question why they don't do the equivalent in their industry.

I bet it comes down to cutting costs as much as possible and cutting corners so long as it does not make the papers :)

There is definitely QA guys working for Chorus. I think even CFH have their own QA'ers too. But the fact is there something like 15-20,000 orders being processed each month so each install just won't be checked. Also, the actual standards are incredibly low.... things like exposed microduct along a fence is "totally fine" according to Chorus.

I guess if the consumer isn't happy, they don't have to sign it off as being acceptable. It pays to be with an ISP who is with the TDR, so if there is a problem, it can be escalated up through them.

chevrolux

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#1586562 5-Jul-2016 18:09

The internal install was rubbish with the "technicians" refusing in wall cable run - they wanted to drill a hole in my ceiling and run the cable to the ONT down the outside of the wall. I refused that so they installed the box in the garage and left

That is fair I think. Running a cable in to an existing wall can be extremely tricky and sometimes just not possible without cutting GIB. For a free install an external cable run inside plastic capping/trunking is ok. I don't agree with stapling the bare fibre/hybrid cable down a wall.

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Linuxluver

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#1586563 5-Jul-2016 18:14

tehgerbil:

Ultra-shoddy broadband: exposed cables worry residents

"My biggest concern is the substandard installation and lack of accountability between Spark and Chorus for these installations," he said. "My fibre connection is now both my telephone line and internet access. It is essential infrastructure and should be treated in a similar way to water, power and previously copper telephone lines."

I'm glad I had my own ducting trenched in. over 130 metres. Chorus used that to bring the fibre up right under my house from the street.

They also said that stapling it to fences was very common.

_____________________________________________________________________

I've been on Geekzone over 16 years..... Time flies....

mattwnz

20147 posts

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#1586564 5-Jul-2016 18:23

Linuxluver:

tehgerbil:

Ultra-shoddy broadband: exposed cables worry residents

"My biggest concern is the substandard installation and lack of accountability between Spark and Chorus for these installations," he said. "My fibre connection is now both my telephone line and internet access. It is essential infrastructure and should be treated in a similar way to water, power and previously copper telephone lines."

I'm glad I had my own ducting trenched in. over 130 metres. Chorus used that to bring the fibre up right under my house from the street.

They also said that stapling it to fences was very common.

It is a bean counter decision, which in the end is likely to be false economy. Over a long period of time it will likely need replacing or professional attention when the fence gets replaced. You also have UV breakdown, and it is more prone to damage for all sorts of external events. But it comes down to cost, and it is the cheapest way to get the fibre in. It isn't pretty, but it is typical in NZ.

mattwnz

20147 posts

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#1586567 5-Jul-2016 18:24

Linuxluver:

tehgerbil:

Ultra-shoddy broadband: exposed cables worry residents

"My biggest concern is the substandard installation and lack of accountability between Spark and Chorus for these installations," he said. "My fibre connection is now both my telephone line and internet access. It is essential infrastructure and should be treated in a similar way to water, power and previously copper telephone lines."

I'm glad I had my own ducting trenched in. over 130 metres. Chorus used that to bring the fibre up right under my house from the street.

They also said that stapling it to fences was very common.

Maybe they should have given you a bit of a refund for making their job so easy. A pity it doesn't work like that. they are installing my fibre next week, and they could install it only a concrete block fence, but instead they are trenching it. So I think it all depends on who the sub contractor is. I guess the better the install they do, the less risk they will have to fix it at their cost in a few years time

sbiddle

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#1586585 5-Jul-2016 18:30

mattwnz:

Linuxluver:

tehgerbil:

Ultra-shoddy broadband: exposed cables worry residents

"My biggest concern is the substandard installation and lack of accountability between Spark and Chorus for these installations," he said. "My fibre connection is now both my telephone line and internet access. It is essential infrastructure and should be treated in a similar way to water, power and previously copper telephone lines."

I'm glad I had my own ducting trenched in. over 130 metres. Chorus used that to bring the fibre up right under my house from the street.

They also said that stapling it to fences was very common.

It is a bean counter decision, which in the end is likely to be false economy. Over a long period of time it will likely need replacing or professional attention when the fence gets replaced. You also have UV breakdown, and it is more prone to damage for all sorts of external events. But it comes down to cost, and it is the cheapest way to get the fibre in. It isn't pretty, but it is typical in NZ.

That ducting is extremely rugged. UV breakdown will not be an issue in anybody's lifetime, and it's extremely hard to damage even with a spade unless you're trying really hard.

Stapling cable to a fence is an approved method, and using cable clips internally along a wall is the standard method of install internally if access from underneath the house isn't possible.

woody99

165 posts

Master Geek

#1586594 5-Jul-2016 18:38

chevrolux:

The internal install was rubbish with the "technicians" refusing in wall cable run - they wanted to drill a hole in my ceiling and run the cable to the ONT down the outside of the wall. I refused that so they installed the box in the garage and left

That is fair I think. Running a cable in to an existing wall can be extremely tricky and sometimes just not possible without cutting GIB. For a free install an external cable run inside plastic capping/trunking is ok. I don't agree with stapling the bare fibre/hybrid cable down a wall.

They were heading for the "staple" option..

Cbfd

307 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1586616 5-Jul-2016 18:55

I do design for a certain LFC and can understand why chorus do the staple along fence option, as it's an easier option and a cheaper option, I would hate to see the uproar and wait times for installs to happen if installs had to go underground the wait would almost be 3-4 times longer then it already is, and can see a lot of installs going ahead due to cutting of driveways etc for locations of services b3forw drilling aND thrusting happen ..

Darren0

70 posts

Master Geek

#1586681 5-Jul-2016 20:18

Cbfd: I do design for a certain LFC and can understand why chorus do the staple along fence option, as it's an easier option and a cheaper option, I would hate to see the uproar and wait times for installs to happen if installs had to go underground the wait would almost be 3-4 times longer then it already is, and can see a lot of installs going ahead due to cutting of driveways etc for locations of services b3forw drilling aND thrusting happen ..

I'm quite happy a certain LFC doesn't do staples along the fence, from the customer perspective being told it's either going to be underground with near-zero visible impact or overhead alongside power is quite good. Staples are an atrocious option looking forward. Maybe I want to replace my fence because the wood is old? Well damn, looks like my fibre is going to be screwed.

DarthKermit

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#1586682 5-Jul-2016 20:20

Christ I'm so glad I did my own trench and all the conduit. I'd hate to think where the Chorus subbie would have looked for a short cut to install it otherwise. Not to mention he had to do the whole install on his own, as his offsider was at a funeral that day.

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