Chorus fibre install in Auckland - are there alternatives?

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TeMorituri

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#254436 12-Aug-2019 10:28

Hi, I live central Auckland.Currently we pay a premium fee to Spark of $135 for VDSL but only get 25Mbps down and 3 Mbps up. As soon as fibre became available I ordered it from Spark (our ISP) on the 18th May 2019. What followed is a litany of shambolic incompetence and stonewalling denial from Chorus about how or even if fibre could be installed to my house.

At nearly 3 months later and many email and phone calls later my install has been "referred back to ROW consent" with a Visionstream subcontractor handling my case refusing to send out a technician because apparently there is a blockage in my telecommunications duct outside my boundary.

On Tuesday 16th July and Thursday 18th July I had Chorus technicians come out to check the patency of my telecommunications duct prior to fibre install on Friday 19th July (which never happened)

Neither technician brought the correct tools required to detect which phone line was mine at the power pole. Neither technician had the updated plan / duct information nor could either technician believe where my telecommunication duct actually lay after I had explained it to them.

I have complained and objected in writing but about every 3 weeks another email gets sent to me saying the install is being delayed / referred due to consent issues or blockage issues.

My reason for posting is this:

I know the Chorus subcontractors are hard pressed for financial compensation for doing jobs. Can I ask for the fibre install to be done at my cost ?

Can I ask another contractor (e.g Vector) to install my fibre?

Spark repeatedly decline to organise a tech callout but I would happily pay for the callout and even the install work if it means progressing the install

I just feel that I am stuck in a situation where there is a stonewalling monopoly and am wondering if anyone can suggest another option

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#2294608 12-Aug-2019 10:30

Maybe @ChorusNZ can add some value to this thread and no you asked another contractor to install the fibre

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#2294763 12-Aug-2019 13:42

:

I ordered it from Spark (our ISP) on the 18th May 2019. What followed is a litany of shambolic incompetence and stonewalling denial from Chorus about how or even if fibre could be installed to my house.

In pure Monty Python fashion, ooo you were lucky. My mother in law ordered it May 2018 (that is not a typo)!

:

Nor could either technician believe where my telecommunication duct actually lay after I had explained it to them.

The techs once bought out one of those long yellow cables on a spindle and pushed it up the existing duct. They exhausted the entire length of cable pushing it up. I then got them to lay it out above ground and the cable goes all the way up the drive and across the road and into the neighbours property. They said the duct must be going all the way there. There is a power pole on her property and you can quite clearly see the telecommunication line going down the power pole and directly into the ground (and somewhere down there, the duct). The pole is about 1/3rd the distance from where they claim the duct must be starting. I was left shaking my head in absolute disbelief.

Latest site visit will be this Thurs to try and get a scoped plan. I am going to watch this thread very carefully because it might just be worth stumping up the cash and bypassing Vision Stream altogether.

sbiddle

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#2294770 12-Aug-2019 13:54

To answer your two main questions you would not want to be paying for it - a complex ROW install will be into the thousands. If there is blucked duct it complicates things even more... And no Vector have nothing to do with UFB so they can't install anything.

Chorus techs for fibre wouldn't be expected to have a tone source for detecting copper. They work on fibre - not copper. If tracing ducts it'll be a professional cable locator that comes to do this, not an install tech.

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#2294816 12-Aug-2019 14:13

TeMorituri:

... Spark repeatedly decline to organise a tech callout but I would happily pay for the callout and even the install work if it means progressing the install ...

Bad idea. Last year the average actual cost of an uncomplicated UFB install was quoted as $1,350. 😮

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TeMorituri

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#2294840 12-Aug-2019 15:04

Thanks for the replies guys.

Its not a complex ROW fibre install ..I have a telecommunications duct solely for my house but the power pole ( drop off point ) does sit at the foot of a shared driveway. Ive already dug it up in 5 places looking for a possible "blockage" but cannot find anything suggestive.

If they had only stuck the probe down from the power pole end I would be a lot happier.

Ooh and I forgot to mention I know exactly where the duct lies because I had the personal "pleasure" of digging the entire bloody trench to 700mm from the edge of the drive to my house when we built in 2005.At the bottom lies my power and sewer then at about 450mm lies the water and the telecommunications duct

Some questions for the replies

Why would a scope visit tech not be able to identify my phone line / telecommunications duct at the power pole?There are actually 3 ducts at the base of the power pole ..surely they need to know which one the fibre is being installed to? Do they really routinely come out not having a device to detect which copper line they are intending to install fibre through ?

My query for an alternative installer e.g Vector ( ok bad suggestion). Obviously there must be some private telecommunications companies doing install work but Chorus has the government contract is that right? And I was under the impression they got approx $150 per fibre install for doing so hence the subcontracting and dealing with other companies tech all the time - Wilson Hurst , Vision Stream and so on.

Can I try and get Wilson Hurst or a subcontractor to do the job for cash...and really $1350? for a duct already in place with functional copper ? where can I google for that ?

sbiddle

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#2294854 12-Aug-2019 15:39

TeMorituri:

Can I try and get Wilson Hurst or a subcontractor to do the job for cash...and really $1350? for a duct already in place with functional copper ? where can I google for that ?

Nope. None of them run the fibre or have anything to do with the job. Chorus do the job. Period.

Complex UFB jobs can still be well over $3k+ upwards. $1,350 was an average price paid for an install across Chorus and I don't think they've been able to achieve any significant cost reductions to lower that. In North Power and UFF areas where the bulk of the network is overhead the costs are lower.

Without knowing your setup it's not really possible to comment further. Chorus techs aren't going to delay it if it really is as simple as you're making out and there are no ROW issues.

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#2294868 12-Aug-2019 16:02

sbiddle:

... $1,350 was an average price paid for an install across Chorus and I don't think they've been able to achieve any significant cost reductions to lower that. ...

The maths:

Total national UFB budget: NZD $1.5 billion and rising
Number of households that can be connected: 1 million and rising
Average cost per connection: aprx $1,350 and rising

This subsidy is indirectly a cost to the taxpayer.

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TeMorituri

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#2295102 12-Aug-2019 20:15

sbiddle:

Without knowing your setup it's not really possible to comment further. Chorus techs aren't going to delay it if it really is as simple as you're making out and there are no ROW issues.

I have just tried to skim read the FUG again and m not sure how much Im supposed to post so i will start with these two images below. I live at Number 38 ..the first house on the shared drive. Our duct is nowhere near any of the other houses services as we built our house last

and the duct runs :

I can give up more information but hopefully this paints some more of the picture.My services cross the drive and run into the house number 40 property where I have legal easement for services ( and the documentation to prove it ) before it connects to my house at 38. As I said before I dug the trench that runs up the side of number 40 to my house ( its not under the building) but there is a new fenceline at the front ( I coloured that part pink in my duct image ) and i am wondering if one of the fence posts is squashing my duct. I have actually already dug under the fenceline where my duct crosses. I cannot see any compression of the duct

TeMorituri

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#2295115 12-Aug-2019 20:26

Here is my digging so far :

and in this last one you can see the services sliding under the fence post if you look hard

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#2295132 12-Aug-2019 21:14

im pretty sure legal easement doesnt cover fibre, only copper. they will still require consent. you will also need consent of everyone else on the shared driveway.

blow/suck air through the duct and see if its all getting through or escaping.

TeMorituri

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#2295153 12-Aug-2019 21:53

Uhh legal easement for services is just that..all services mate.

All the people/ houses on the shared driveway have ordered fibre and given consent ..back in June.Initially I was the only one objecting because they planned to run the duct down the left hand side of the drive....( see big green pipe not even buried to 450)

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#2295157 12-Aug-2019 21:57

TeMorituri:

Uhh legal easement for services is just that..all services mate.

All the people/ houses on the shared driveway have ordered fibre and given consent ..back in June.Initially I was the only one objecting because they planned to run the duct down the left hand side of the drive....( see big green pipe not even buried to 450)

thats fine but i still dont believe fiber comes under easements

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#2295166 12-Aug-2019 22:14

Since you're not afraid of doing the work yourself, seemingly, I've got a pair of suggestions for you.

First and quickest for you would be to pop down to bunnings, buy a length of string, and run it through the pipe. If the pipe's continuous, you should be able to tie a plastic bag (but don't let the Government know!) to one of end of the string, and suck it through the pipe with a decent shop vacuum at the other end. I wouldn't recommend a house vacuum, but I also wouldn't stop you, just don't blame me if you get a vacuum filled with dirt.

Second option, and probably a tad more involved, would be to talk to the local contractor and advise them how much in length your total run from boundary to building is, and ask them how much microduct you'd need, then ask them if they'd kindly supply you with the microduct to pull through yourself. Once the microduct or a string is in, the contractors can come in, use the string to pull in ducting, or join the duct straight onto the network duct and blow the fibre. I can't think of many subcontractors that wouldn't let you do the hardest part of the job for free.

As for your Spark costs - I'm pretty sure there's cheaper plans available from them (unless you've got some extra stuff beyond Unlimited VDSL?), and I'd recommend touching base with them and asking to move to a cheaper plan in the interim.

As with all things, YMMV, but hopefully if you can swing one of my above suggestions, your life will get a lot easier.

Regarding your easement, as long as it's relatively up to date and refers to telecommunications, you should be right, but in all honesty I'd recommend just trying to avoid mentioning it at all to the contractors, as it'll make things more complicated potentially, and you'll probably need to supply a copy of the easement to the contractor/Chorus to proceed. Again, YMMV.

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TeMorituri

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#2295167 12-Aug-2019 22:16

Why would you say that ? I cannot get my head around the implication that fibre is something different from my power or sewer or water or..the telecommunications duct that is already in there .

Legal easement is just that : Either you have easement ...or you dont. I have documentation on the title of both properties confirming this easement and full Auckland City Council certification.

I paid the owner of Number 40 a decent amount of money for the privilege and have already discussed this issue with them. They know I will replace everything to their satisfaction once I find the "blockage"

Actually the blow air idea sounds good. I can disconnect the twist pair at my house and tape a vacuum cleaner to it ...that should at least tell me which one of the three telecommunications ducts at the pole is mine. But surely it would be easier for a tech to just come along with the tone device and say "thats the one" and then I or they could stick a probe down it from the power pole end.

Funny though..they got 30 metres from my house without even trying ..the whole damn duct is 41.9 metres to the pole so i figure there is a kink or something in the last 10 metres near the pole

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#2295168 12-Aug-2019 22:16

Jase2985:

TeMorituri:

Uhh legal easement for services is just that..all services mate.

All the people/ houses on the shared driveway have ordered fibre and given consent ..back in June.Initially I was the only one objecting because they planned to run the duct down the left hand side of the drive....( see big green pipe not even buried to 450)

thats fine but i still dont believe fiber comes under easements

In my (limited) experience Power, Sewage, Water usually come on one easement, and Telecommunications seems to have it's own individual easements. I'm certainly no expert, but it's an oddity I've come across a few times.

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