Home workstation - build vs buy, brand or component recommendations

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#2454539 4-Apr-2020 18:02

As I've bored you guys previously, did the following -

Fractal design R5

ASRock X570 Steel Legend

Ryzen 3700X

Samsung 970 EVO 500GB M.2

Gigabyte GeForce GTX1660 Super

Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB 3600 Memory

Corsair RM750 PSU

Noctua NH-12a

The R5 has space for 8xHDD's plus 2xSSD's plus 2x5.25"

The mobo seemed to have more SATA ports than most - 8 vs 6.

Bout 4 -4.5 times as fast as my old i5-4570 in Handbrake.

Prices of the above do tend to add up though...

“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” -John Kenneth Galbraith

rb99

timmmay

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#2454551 4-Apr-2020 18:21

I had faulty memory modules on my current machine. I noticed some file corruption, it took me ages to track down the actual problem. Memtext x86 couldn't detect the problem, but HCI Memtest could. Replaced it, everything is fine again. This is why I'm thinking ECC memory might be worthwhile, even if it's a bit slower and more expensive than standard memory. On the other hand if it's a really bad idea I can test the heck out of it when I get it. Opinions welcome.

Due to the corruption I'm currently running ReFS mirrored volumes for data, as it does checksums. I don't think ReFS is supported under Windows Pro any more, plus I think it's the reason my computer seems to use / leak a lot of memory. Before I had ReFS I just suspended it, these days I have to reboot most days or the base level of RAM used is really high. So I'll be looking for some other way to do redundant internal disks. This doesn't replace backups.

R5 case looks interesting thanks @rb99. How is it for volume? How's that Noctua for size as well? My current one is ENORMOUS and means I can't use slots. How's the motherboard, plenty of SATA, plenty of space to put card (USB, large video card) into the computer with the CPU cooler fitted? Not that I need expansion cards right now, but I did with the current machine when the USB ports started failing. Unfortunately I can't fit my USB card at the same time as my video card, and working from home right now I had to take out the USB card so I could run two monitors. What kind of cost was it?

Interested in opinions on which Ryzen CPU as well. I don't need massive number of threads, just decent single thread performance and say 8 cores? Even 4 might be ok, but I'm used to 8 on my current.

I tend to have the OS SSD small so I can easily image it to restore the OS if I need to. I could potentially partition a larger M2 SSD into a OS drive and a data / cache drive - is that a good idea with SSDs?

Handle9

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#2454580 4-Apr-2020 18:41

I used this Antec case. It’s massive but lots of drive bays and is incredibly quiet.

The Ryzen 3600 may be ok for you. They are 6 cores but 12 threads. I use the 2600 as an UNRAID server running dockers and VMs etc. It eats it and my windows VM is snappy with 4 cores and 8GB of RAM.

I’d use a different motherboard if I did mine again.

You may not need a third party cooler, the Wraith Spire coolers are pretty decent and very quiet. I haven’t bothered with an aftermarket cooler but you may have a different use case.

timmmay

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#2454595 4-Apr-2020 19:08

Ryzen 5 family seems good (comparison). I don't need X, standard is fine, but the G with built-in graphics might save a bit of money and it's ok. Though I'm looking for something good for a while, so 3600 plus a modern but low end video card might do the job.

What kind of motherboards are people liking? Are there different sizes / tiers / chipsets of motherboards? @Handle9 what did you get, and why don't you like it? My gigabyte has worked well, other than the USB ports wearing out and failing after 6 years (I replaced the earlier one because I thought it was faulty).

TwoSeven

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#2454596 4-Apr-2020 19:09

The big changes for this year are thunderbolt 3 (40Gbps) WiFi 6, Bluetooth 5, 2.5/10Gbe ethernet and usb 3.1 gen 2 (10Gbps)

for me, the big deal is thunderbolt 3 as it allows lots of external devices to be attached.

I wont use SSDs now as 512Gb And 1TB m.2 cards are in the ballpark and many mainboards will support a couple.

i would also put in a minimum of 32Gb but 64Gb as standard.

I don’t think cd/dvd drives are used anymore, but one can always pick up an external one.

i think the Intel z390 chipset may support some of that, but the z490 (not sure if this uses the new socket or not) shouldn’t be too far away now that the new mobile processors are out. Not sure about AMD boards, don’t really follow hardware much these days, tend to focus on standards.

Also, I understand DisplayPort 2.0 is out later this year, I understand that along with the traditional DisplayPort cable, it may also support USB-C cables. I think it also brings support for HDM 2.1. So probably may see graphics cards and monitors make the shift as well.

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timmmay

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#2454602 4-Apr-2020 19:16

I don't really do external devices, other than USB3 backup disks, that's why I have a big case :) I don't use WiFi on the workstation, don't use Bluetooth, have gigabit router. So I don't much need this years changes :)

16GB (not Gb btw) is more than enough memory for what I do, 32GB would be overkill. I'd rather pay $170 odd for 16GB than double that for memory that won't help me. Good point re DVD, useful to have but I don't even think the one in my PC is connected.

I'm really trying to build a solid midrange workstation that should last a long time, rather than a speed demon. Good quality RAM, good motherboard, decent CPU.

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#2454606 4-Apr-2020 19:22

timmmay:

Ryzen 5 family seems good (comparison). I don't need X, standard is fine, but the G with built-in graphics might save a bit of money and it's ok. Though I'm looking for something good for a while, so 3600 plus a modern but low end video card might do the job.

What kind of motherboards are people liking? Are there different sizes / tiers / chipsets of motherboards? @Handle9 what did you get, and why don't you like it? My gigabyte has worked well, other than the USB ports wearing out and failing after 6 years (I replaced the earlier one because I thought it was faulty).

I used this one. It’s actually good but I should have bought one with more SATA ports so I use a PCI card. I’m using it as server and need the ports.

rb99

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#2454618 4-Apr-2020 19:45

R5 is big (and heavy), decent space too me. There's a R6 now, but that has less storage so went for R5. Like that it has 5.25 bays as I have 2 BR drives to occupy them. Two SSD bays are round the back behind the mobo. Cost $199, thing they're about $230 now.

Cooler is big but smaller than Noctua's NH-D15 thingies. Fits OK far as I can tell to me, doesn't cover slots or ram. Not a fan (so to speak) of the colour scheme, but they seem to like it. Bit of a fiddle to install mainly because I used the stock cooler first and got the Noctua after a month or two and swapped while it was still in the case without removing even the graphics card. Cost about $200. Like I say, it adds up.

Apart from the graphics card, its got a TV tuner card, a 4 port card and I think a 4 port SATA card (just small ones, not RAID type stuff). Those HDDs used up the mobo SATA connectors pretty quick.

A picture paints a thousand words (unless the pictures rubbish) -

“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” -John Kenneth Galbraith

rb99

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#2454621 4-Apr-2020 19:56

I was planning a similar spec build prior to the current unpleasantness. "Just wait", I told myself, "you're a mug if you buy anything from PBtech at full price, it won't be long before they have a PC parts sale." That worked out well for me! Would have been nice to have all the parts while being locked in.

In any event, it has given me more time to obsess over reviews and comparisons for various componentry.

I'm currently aiming for a Ryzen 3600/X, but might stretch to a 3700 if the price is right. The 4000 series was due at some point this year but that is anyone's guess now.

For a Ryzen of that spec, you probably want a B450 motherboard (X570 has PCIe 4 so faster NVME read in theory, but I don't think I would notice it). And for that many USBs and drives, you probably want full ATX. One of the MSI options seems to be the consensus pick for B450 - probably a tomahawk.

For cases, Gamers Nexus on Youtube has some extremely thorough case reviews. Steve is Very Keen on cooling. Which seems somewhat incompatible with quiet, but they do go to the extreme of normalised decibel readings.

timmmay

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#2454632 4-Apr-2020 20:30

I remember how much of a PITA it is to read motherboard specifications and compare them now...

Ryzen 5 3600... ok

MSI B450... ok

16GB RAM... ok, have to work out which ones are marked compatible.

Video card costing as much as the CPU... not ok given I need no acceleration, just an adapter that lets me get video out to the monitors. Geforce 710 silent might do me.

Case... will take some research.

Thanks all for thoughts so far. If anyone has a complete Ryzen build they're happy with please tell me what motherboard / ram / video / etc you got :)

Handle9

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#2454633 4-Apr-2020 20:38

I got the same RAM as rb99. It's good and reasonably priced.

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#2454634 4-Apr-2020 20:44

mdf:

I was planning a similar spec build prior to the current unpleasantness. "Just wait", I told myself, "you're a mug if you buy anything from PBtech at full price, it won't be long before they have a PC parts sale." That worked out well for me! Would have been nice to have all the parts while being locked in.

In any event, it has given me more time to obsess over reviews and comparisons for various componentry.

I'm currently aiming for a Ryzen 3600/X, but might stretch to a 3700 if the price is right. The 4000 series was due at some point this year but that is anyone's guess now.

For a Ryzen of that spec, you probably want a B450 motherboard (X570 has PCIe 4 so faster NVME read in theory, but I don't think I would notice it). And for that many USBs and drives, you probably want full ATX. One of the MSI options seems to be the consensus pick for B450 - probably a tomahawk.

For cases, Gamers Nexus on Youtube has some extremely thorough case reviews. Steve is Very Keen on cooling. Which seems somewhat incompatible with quiet, but they do go to the extreme of normalised decibel readings.

The bright side is now you have the time to spend ridiculous amounts of time watching reviews and reading benchmarks :)

timmmay

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#2454635 4-Apr-2020 20:45

Thanks. ECC memory is more difficult to find, bit more expensive ($260 vs $200), and a touch slower (2%).

I'll probably wait for a PBTech sale, after the lockdown finishes. I'll look at newegg but not sure it's worth the bother. Oddly enough I have much less time available during lockdown as we both work and our toddler isn't in daycare.

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#2454636 4-Apr-2020 20:46

most newer pieces of video/image editing software will let your GPU do the heavy lifting, and its generally a heap faster than using even a 8 core 16 thread CPU. so i wouldn't totally throw away the idea of low/mid range gfx card

a 1660 is $400. not that much in the scheme of things.

i would also get a 1tb nvne drive for the boot drive

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#2454639 4-Apr-2020 20:59

rb99: A picture paints a thousand words

A .jpg paints 1024 :-)

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