Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


Topic # 92200 28-Oct-2011 16:00
Send private message

Hi and thanks in advance for any constructive comments.
All my devices are Wireless N including Router, except my laptop which is wireless G. My question is will my router throttle everything down to G speed when it detects my laptop with my point being loss of data speed in real time to all my other N compliant devices.
If so would it be good to buy this dongle TM auction 418528116 and put it in my laptop so that everything is N compliant? Cheers 
 

View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
6176 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 241

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 538780 28-Oct-2011 16:17
Send private message

Hi, no dont worry about any throttling between G and N devices that will not happen so dont bother with the dongle. The same was not the case if b devices were about, this would slow a g or n system down.

Cheers
Cyril

8025 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 387

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539110 29-Oct-2011 22:22
Send private message
6176 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 241

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539411 31-Oct-2011 07:35
Send private message

Hi Ragnor, interesting read, I think I should support my comments by saying the following.

I see the article was written in 2007 all using draft n chipsets one would hope (maybe too optimistic) that by now the various vendors had worked out how to socalise together such that the 50% reduction was more common than 80%.

What is important is that unlike mixing b & g the throughput reduction only impacted when the AP was feeding simultaneously g and n sesions and would recover once the g device relaxed. With a b & g setup immediately the AP sees a b device in range (attached or not) it would pull back to mode b and stay there forever, or till rebooted. For a b & g mix that meant a potential 54Mb/s channel reduced to 11Mb/s or less thats waaayyy more than 50-80%.

As for the original poster, personally I would live with a g/n mix and not loose sleep over the momentary reduction while the g device pulls traffic, a g radio with a decent laptop screen antenna typically performs waaay better overall than a USB dongle on simple radio terms, and is way more convenient.

Other thing to consider is where is most of this traffic flowing, if its between your router and the internet rather than streaming multi gig files between internal lan machines then the speeds are limited by your internet connection which is still not going to be challenged by any noted reductions, if you are moving very large files between local machines then maybe a wired connection is what you should be using anyway.

Cheers
Cyril



91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 539449 31-Oct-2011 10:18
Send private message

cyril7: Hi Ragnor, interesting read, I think I should support my comments by saying the following.

I see the article was written in 2007 all using draft n chipsets one would hope (maybe too optimistic) that by now the various vendors had worked out how to socalise together such that the 50% reduction was more common than 80%.

What is important is that unlike mixing b & g the throughput reduction only impacted when the AP was feeding simultaneously g and n sesions and would recover once the g device relaxed. With a b & g setup immediately the AP sees a b device in range (attached or not) it would pull back to mode b and stay there forever, or till rebooted. For a b & g mix that meant a potential 54Mb/s channel reduced to 11Mb/s or less thats waaayyy more than 50-80%.

As for the original poster, personally I would live with a g/n mix and not loose sleep over the momentary reduction while the g device pulls traffic, a g radio with a decent laptop screen antenna typically performs waaay better overall than a USB dongle on simple radio terms, and is way more convenient.

Other thing to consider is where is most of this traffic flowing, if its between your router and the internet rather than streaming multi gig files between internal lan machines then the speeds are limited by your internet connection which is still not going to be challenged by any noted reductions, if you are moving very large files between local machines then maybe a wired connection is what you should be using anyway.

Cheers
Cyril


Thanks for your time cyril and Ragnor. It was that very article in the first place that got me thinking about my dilemma. The reason I push this topic is because I have 'All share' that samsung implement in their hardware for wireless media sharing (my Galaxy s2 and my LED TV). Basically what I am trying to say is I want to stream my content using my orcon genius  to all my devices over-the-air. 
So My smartphone, PC, TV and Router are all wireless N and my wifes laptop/smartphone is G so therefore  whenever she is using it only momentary fluctuations in speed will occur? I can live with that as I am only streaming TV episodes or my kids AVI collection from my PC; I was under the impression that it would be like what you said under wireless B conditions hence streaming would buffer content which we all hate. Also what is the the 20/40 MHz mode in my router setting, shall I leave it mixed or adjust it to 20 or 40?  something to to do with Channel bonding i think.

6176 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 241

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539455 31-Oct-2011 10:36
Send private message

Hi, I would leave it on 20/40 and it will auto bond as needed and suits each client, not too sure what mode options the Genius has but if you can have it just do g/n and exclude b then all should be good.

If you are living in close proximity to other APs about then its recommend that you set the channel such that you avoid others by the standard 6ch rule rather than auto, I would also recommend that you use wired connections for devices (ie server and TVs) that you are streaming media files between not wireless.

Cyril



91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 539475 31-Oct-2011 11:10
Send private message

cyril7: Hi, I would leave it on 20/40 and it will auto bond as needed and suits each client, not too sure what mode options the Genius has but if you can have it just do g/n and exclude b then all should be good.

If you are living in close proximity to other APs about then its recommend that you set the channel such that you avoid others by the standard 6ch rule rather than auto, I would also recommend that you use wired connections for devices (ie server and TVs) that you are streaming media files between not wireless.

Cyril


Ok cheers for this info I do have those options I think. And yeah at night I can see about 6 or 7 other radio connections amongst mine so will try the 6Ch setting thanks!

I enjoy the odd gaming session and with telecom I always seemed to get kicked off saying that my ping was too high. With Genius that problem has gone maybe it was the old wireless g router that telecom gave us that affected things I'm not sure.  I read that asking my provider to turn of interleaving would help as well or is it a waste of time in a gamers point of view that is?

6176 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 241

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539483 31-Oct-2011 11:19
Send private message

Interleaving off will give you around 20-30mS reduction in latency, and using a wired rather than wireless connection can save you similar amounts if not more, wireless is not appropriate for gaming or streaming, but fine for general browsing.

If you want to find the best channel to use try inssider it gives you a good visual of channel occupancy, but be aware it only works on Windows (not mac to my knowledge) and you really need either a N radio in that laptop or N compatible one to see 40Mhz services.

Cyril



91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 539494 31-Oct-2011 11:45
Send private message

Thanks will check that out. I would use cable but I short circuited my ethernet port when i was trying to clean my mobo :(   I don't game anywhere as much as I used to.
BTW cyril what's the beef about wireless, is it something to do with potential health risks or best practice? Sometimes I wonder about frying my kids brains with technology.hahaha
 

6176 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 241

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539515 31-Oct-2011 12:07
Send private message

Hi, as a RF engineer I dont have anything against WiFi its great for what its best at which is a convenience connection for general web browsing, but for anything that requires minimum latency and assured high throughput then use a wire, its cheaper less complex and workss 100% something a shared wireless medium cannot give you.

Cheers
Cyril

8025 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 387

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539564 31-Oct-2011 13:41
Send private message

Yep mixing G and N in your context (wife's laptop) probably isn't going to be a big issue.

However if it does turn out to be a problem, a typical N usb adapter is < $50... so easy to remedy.

8025 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 387

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 539566 31-Oct-2011 13:43
Send private message

These tables (also from Smallnetbuilder) are quite useful for explaining link rate vs approximate real world throughput...

Link Rate




Real World Throughput





91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 539591 31-Oct-2011 14:27
Send private message

Thanks Ragnor that chart is very interesting & cyril that inSSIDer is very geeky but very practical ( I lol to the Wi-Spy dongle).  I might as well test the hell out of my config this week, I'll borrow a mates usb N adapter and report back on what I find. Pity the Orcon genuis didn't implement the dual band 5ghz /gigabit ethernet into the mix, I read it's the way to go. Apparently even the household microwave runs at 2.4ghz as well as mrs bloggs next door & the rest sharing that frequency. I suppose you can tweak a fair bit these days.

172 posts

Master Geek


  Reply # 540133 1-Nov-2011 23:16
Send private message

cyril7: If you want to find the best channel to use try inssider it gives you a good visual of channel occupancy, but be aware it only works on Windows (not mac to my knowledge) and you really need either a N radio in that laptop or N compatible one to see 40Mhz services.

Cyril


If you have Mac OSX10.6 or 10.7 the WiFi page in System Information gives a substantial amount of information about local wireless access points. Just doesn't have the pretty graphical image of inSSIDer.

The main problem with Dual Band routers is the more limited range that you  seem to get with the 5Ghz frequency. Personally I found signal strength and speed to be lower than connecting on the 2.4Ghz frequency.

606 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 38


  Reply # 540146 2-Nov-2011 00:26
Send private message

To add to what Oldhat said, if you have an HP Touchpad or some other wireless linux device, try the iw* commands.
This one will give a lot of info about access points in range.

# iwlist eth0 scanning

Replace eth0 with the appropriate wireless interface name.
More info here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_tools_for_Linux
http://linux.die.net/man/8/iwlist




#include <standard.disclaimer>



91 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 540650 3-Nov-2011 11:11
Send private message

Ok as the topic starter here are my finding thus far...

Orcon genuis wireless N router now with 1TB usb HD attached to it. Interleaving turned off for gaming
(config: N only : Channel 6 : 20/40mhz) To Cyril thanks: I still see about 5 people in my vicinity though.

PC ASUS PCEN15 wireless N connected to my PC - adapter speed 300mbps (theoretically) very good card for the money I think. Browsing speed is near instant from 5 metres away with strength being excellent now.

Wife traded in her old notebook & got a Wireless N laptop can now stream 720p movies from the Orcon genius usb network drive without any dropouts so to the Samsung TV via Allshare no problems with all the movies working. Samsung Smartphone even though connected @ 65mbps I can stream movies via the PC only without issues via allshare.

Ping after getting interleaving turned OFF went down from 140 to around 70 -95 so not bad definately worth doing.

Connection now with all devices in N mode is good especiallly the range, also I get absolutely no kicked off messages whilst gaming. Especially when the wife uses her laptop - that used to happen with her wireless G connection.

Torrents were up with average downloads @ 1.5MBps up from 250-500kbps, Youtube has better streaming speeds too. Not sure what made those improve?

I made notes on all these aspects so the real world benefits of my connections containing wireless N are real, so problem solved and worth the effort for those wanting a a Wifi connection around the home.

Jbmoocs

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic

Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

N4L helping TAKA Trust bridge the digital divide for Lower Hutt students
Posted 18-Jun-2018 13:08


Winners Announced for 2018 CIO Awards
Posted 18-Jun-2018 13:03


Logitech Rally sets new standard for USB-connected video conference cameras
Posted 18-Jun-2018 09:27


Russell Stanners steps down as Vodafone NZ CEO
Posted 12-Jun-2018 09:13


Intergen recognised as 2018 Microsoft Country Partner of the Year for New Zealand
Posted 12-Jun-2018 08:00


Finalists Announced For Microsoft NZ Partner Awards
Posted 6-Jun-2018 15:12


Vocus Group and Vodafone announce joint venture to accelerate fibre innovation
Posted 5-Jun-2018 10:52


Kogan.com to launch Kogan Mobile in New Zealand
Posted 4-Jun-2018 14:34


Enable doubles fibre broadband speeds for its most popular wholesale service in Christchurch
Posted 2-Jun-2018 20:07


All or Nothing: New Zealand All Blacks arrives on Amazon Prime Video
Posted 2-Jun-2018 16:21


Innovation Grant, High Tech Awards and new USA office for Kiwi tech company SwipedOn
Posted 1-Jun-2018 20:54


Commerce Commission warns Apple for misleading consumers about their rights
Posted 30-May-2018 13:15


IBM leads Call for Code to use cloud, data, AI, blockchain for natural disaster relief
Posted 25-May-2018 14:12


New FUJIFILM X-T100 aims to do better job than smartphones
Posted 24-May-2018 20:17


Stuff takes 100% ownership of Stuff Fibre
Posted 24-May-2018 19:41



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.