Z-wave in-wall switch behaviour?

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kryptonjohn

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Topic # 216643 6-Jul-2017 10:44

Been looking at the wiring for these devices, that link into the wall switch. You rewire so the z-wave device controls the load, but the existing wall switch is wired into the z-wave device so the manual control is still available.

Say the wall switch is on, and you use the controller to switch the load off, the wall switch is still on the on (down) position. If you then want to manually switch the light on do you change the switch to 'up'? Like having a double switch arrangement with one at each end of a hall - it means that up-off down-on doesn't apply anymore and it toggles the load state? Or would you have to move the switch off and on again?

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Reply # 1813646 6-Jul-2017 10:47

Just toggle the manual switch again, and it will toggle the light. So yes, just like a double-switch arrangement. But once you have automated them you will never use the manual switch ;).

reven

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Reply # 1813658 6-Jul-2017 10:50

I would replace those toggle switches with pushbutton ones like these

http://zwave.com.au/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=56

can even get them with LED indicators showing on/off

https://www.clipsal.com/Home-Owner/Products/Powerpoints-Switches/Styles/Impress-Push-Button

I bought a bunch of these for my old house (which are now sitting in a box, seeing the price of these, I may throw them up on trademe), they worked well. I've now switched to wemo switches though.

reven

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Reply # 1813662 6-Jul-2017 10:51

SumnerBoy:

Just toggle the manual switch again, and it will toggle the light. So yes, just like a double-switch arrangement. But once you have automated them you will never use the manual switch ;).

light rules are very very very hard to get perfect, and chances are you will be using them manually. thats why I like the wemo switches, you can do long press, double click or single click. Now amazon echos are out, ive found myself using "Alexa, turn on/off" way more than physical switches though.... yeah im lazy.

SumnerBoy

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Reply # 1813673 6-Jul-2017 10:51

Yep - those push button switches are ideal. You just have to remember to configure the in-wall Z-Wave module to expect that switch type (i.e. momentary instead of bi-polar).

@reven you prefer Wemo switches to Z-Wave?

kryptonjohn

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Reply # 1813676 6-Jul-2017 10:55

We have reasonably new wiring in the house, some are push button style with led that also dim/brighten with a long press. Others are conventional. I think the actual switch is a pop-out in the housing so can be replaced easily?

They're neither clipsal nor pdl though - the led is in the lower right corner of a square button.

reven

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Reply # 1813677 6-Jul-2017 10:56

SumnerBoy:

Yep - those push button switches are ideal. You just have to remember to configure the in-wall Z-Wave module to expect that switch type (i.e. momentary instead of bi-polar).

@reven you prefer Wemo switches to Z-Wave?

I find wifi more reliable than zwave. also I can link alexa etc directly into the wemos instead of through openhab/vera or something. and I like hold press to turn off all lights down stairs, double click to turn on the table lights (instead of ceiling), hold to open/close curtain etc. theyre not perfect, sometimes they restart on you (very seldom, but does happen) and you cant use the switch while theyre "booting up" (about 30seconds).

im still using zwave for some things, roller shutters, doors locks, a few in wall power sockets (behind kids tvs to auto turn off, monitor tv state to auto close curtain (stop window glare on tv)).

ive bought some of the sonoff wifi switches that im planning on trying out (have to flash custom firmware on them to use mqtt instead of the sonoff cloud). those are nice and cheap at $15usd with free shipping, just requires some small modifications....

kryptonjohn

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Reply # 1813682 6-Jul-2017 11:02

Are the wemo switches all replacement switches or do they make in-wall modules that control the existing switch. I would prefer all the switches to stay looking the same even if some are controlled and some are still 'dumb'.

SumnerBoy

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Reply # 1813686 6-Jul-2017 11:05

reven:

ive bought some of the sonoff wifi switches that im planning on trying out (have to flash custom firmware on them to use mqtt instead of the sonoff cloud). those are nice and cheap at $15usd with free shipping, just requires some small modifications....

Yeah I have a few of these. Flashed them with Homie and they work well. But their form factor just isn't as nice as an Aeotech Smart Switch 6, which you can get for $70-80 from memory. Sure a lot more expensive but a lot safer and certified as well.

reven

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Reply # 1813688 6-Jul-2017 11:06

nah, its a complete switch, and theyre very hard to find now (been replaced in the US with dimmers, but not for sale anywhere else). so I had to replace basically all switches in my house. some I couldnt (waste disposal/dishwasher double switch).

but all lights I replaced. only one I had trouble with was the stairway 2 way. they dont support these so I had to use a 3rd party program wemo-server.jar running on a server that listens to when one switch state changes, and changes the other to match. this server seems pretty rock solid, and only had to be restarted a couple of times over the last year.

davidcole

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Reply # 1813689 6-Jul-2017 11:06

I have a few of these (the fibaro ones), like a double switch you just throw it the opposite way to turn it on, you stop paying attention to if it's down or not.

Since mine are outside lights etc (and the blinds are down) you can't actually see the result of one of them. But I've put in a rule that says, when the alarm is armed and it's night time, turn it on for 15 mins, then off. THis is for leaving the house. But since we night arm the alarm, it has the advantage that if someone has left the outside lights on they're turned off after 15 mins of us going to bed. Handy

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reven

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Reply # 1813692 6-Jul-2017 11:08

SumnerBoy:

reven:

ive bought some of the sonoff wifi switches that im planning on trying out (have to flash custom firmware on them to use mqtt instead of the sonoff cloud). those are nice and cheap at $15usd with free shipping, just requires some small modifications....

Yeah I have a few of these. Flashed them with Homie and they work well. But their form factor just isn't as nice as an Aeotech Smart Switch 6, which you can get for $70-80 from memory. Sure a lot more expensive but a lot safer and certified as well.

need something inside the wall behind wall mounted tvs. but then I found I had some zwave ones left over, so using those now. the nz certified thing did cross my mind, and why I'm still using the zwave ones.

SumnerBoy

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Reply # 1813694 6-Jul-2017 11:10

reven:

need something inside the wall behind wall mounted tvs. but then I found I had some zwave ones left over, so using those now. the nz certified thing did cross my mind, and why I'm still using the zwave ones.

Fair enough. I have a few sitting there that I can use if I find a need to control something which is out of reach of little children.

davidcole

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Reply # 1813696 6-Jul-2017 11:10

reven:

SumnerBoy:

reven:

ive bought some of the sonoff wifi switches that im planning on trying out (have to flash custom firmware on them to use mqtt instead of the sonoff cloud). those are nice and cheap at $15usd with free shipping, just requires some small modifications....

Yeah I have a few of these. Flashed them with Homie and they work well. But their form factor just isn't as nice as an Aeotech Smart Switch 6, which you can get for $70-80 from memory. Sure a lot more expensive but a lot safer and certified as well.

need something inside the wall behind wall mounted tvs. but then I found I had some zwave ones left over, so using those now. the nz certified thing did cross my mind, and why I'm still using the zwave ones.

yeah I'm picking if lights were more DC based (rather than ac), Id have no issues with the sonoff gear. But not for 240v ac.

Blanch

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Reply # 1813890 6-Jul-2017 14:56

reven:

I would replace those toggle switches with pushbutton ones like these

http://zwave.com.au/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=56

can even get them with LED indicators showing on/off

https://www.clipsal.com/Home-Owner/Products/Powerpoints-Switches/Styles/Impress-Push-Button

I bought a bunch of these for my old house (which are now sitting in a box, seeing the price of these, I may throw them up on trademe), they worked well. I've now switched to wemo switches though.

I'd be interested in zwave gear, I also have a few 2 and 3 gang boxes and face Plates for the wemos.

kryptonjohn

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Reply # 1813955 6-Jul-2017 15:38

It annoys me how expensive z-wave is in NZ/AU... $45 for a dimmer switch in the US, $100 here!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aeon-Labs-Aeotec-Z-Wave-Micro-Dimmer-2nd-Edition-DSC27103-ZWUS-/332154819722?epid=691318913&hash=item4d55f8548a:g:OtwAAOSwol5YyL93

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