2degrees Touch2Pay with Snapper FAQ

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#619291 4-May-2012 09:20

freitasm:
hebegb: Fried Snapper anyone!

Hey Mauricio,

Remember last night we tried to read the balance off my Snapper, unsuccessfully?

I had to walk home last night :)

The Snapper reader on the bus said, 2 devices detected from simply holding the card up by itself!

Still fried this morning. I hope it doesn't do it to all snapper happys!

I will try the snapper team to fix it.

Cheers

Yep, sent an email to Snapper when I saw J's comment on Twitter. You can call in anyway to get a replacement.

Interesting we were just trying to read it...

Hmm wonder if mine still works.....

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otari

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#619295 4-May-2012 09:22

Right, so if I have a One X and get a T2P sim from 2degrees, I should be able to use the phone to pay at snapper terminals right now?

freitasm

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#619298 4-May-2012 09:23

Not yet. Not all Android API are born equal apparently. Always follow the chart.

davidcole

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#619299 4-May-2012 09:24

otari: Right, so if I have a One X and get a T2P sim from 2degrees, I should be able to use the phone to pay at snapper terminals right now?

No, I believe there are specifics in the LG phone firmware that allow it to be used for payment.

otari

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#619309 4-May-2012 09:32

Oh, gotcha. Thanks for the info!

lchiu7

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#619322 4-May-2012 09:46

freitasm: I have the app installed on a HTC One X and managed to read some cards.

I have the same phone available here and tried and didn't manage to read the same two cards. I guess they are pretty old cards.

[Update] I found a card that I could read with the GN so all is well. I could even top it up but since it wasn't mine I was not going to :-)

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hebegb

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#619323 4-May-2012 09:48

The sim and antenna device that were shown briefly last night?

i.e. where a SIM has an attached antenna

Can that make any phone NFC capable?

If the the antenna was to fit under the back cover, would that be a usable option now?

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BlueShift

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#619336 4-May-2012 10:13

lchiu7:
I tried reading my building access card :-) and it rightly complained that the card was not a Snapper card so the app appears to be working okay.

Slightly O/T, but does anyone know if NFC can be persuaded to emulate a prox card? If I get an NFC phone, can I get an app that will let me wave my building access card against it, copy the signal, and repeat it when I wave the phone near my office door? Probably huge security issue for the Cardax people to worry about there, but dead convenient for me...

SaltyNZ

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#619370 4-May-2012 10:44

BlueShift: Probably huge security issue for the Cardax people to worry about there,

Which is why the real ones don't work that simply any more. The chips will hold a unique ID number and a crypto algorithm. The system will generate a random number, pair it with the ID it holds, and run it through the algorithm to generate an answer.

It will send the same random number to the chip on the card, which does the same thing, and should therefore come up with the same answer, which it sends back. If they match, the door opens.

You won't be able to deduce the ID on the prox card simply by watching the chatter, even if you know the crypto algorithm. Or at least that's the theory, it's very hard to make it properly. But even it's broken it should not be a matter of simply replaying the last chat.

If that DOES work you need to have a word with your security people about buying a new security system.

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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

groynk

234 posts

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#619371 4-May-2012 10:50

Slightly O/T, but does anyone know if NFC can be persuaded to emulate a prox card? If I get an NFC phone, can I get an app that will let me wave my building access card against it, copy the signal, and repeat it when I wave the phone near my office door? Probably huge security issue for the Cardax people to worry about there, but dead convenient for me...

Thats how I imagined phone NFC would be used since I heard about it. Like you say there are surely security/technical issues to work out, but from a user perspective I just want to load all my 'NFC' cards in my wallet as virtual cards on my phone and then ditch the wallet.
Then we can eventually move off cash to the 'cred' system from [generic sci fi movie or game]

From the touch2pay implementation it seems like the nfc sim is acting as a snapper card right? this is then read into android for the balance managing stuff. That is why you can read any (new) snapper card into android for the balance stuff too.
Then when getting onto a bus the reader is acyually just reading the snapper account off the NFC sim card.
so... (if 2degrees weren't just giving free swap outs) you could just tape your snapper card to your phone, ala brett mackenzie's camera phone!

oxnsox

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#619406 4-May-2012 11:37

SaltyNZ:
BlueShift: Probably huge security issue for the Cardax people to worry about there,

Which is why the real ones don't work that simply any more. The chips will hold a unique ID number and a crypto algorithm. The system will generate a random number, pair it with the ID it holds, and run it through the algorithm to generate an answer.

It will send the same random number to the chip on the card, which does the same thing, and should therefore come up with the same answer, which it sends back. If they match, the door opens.

You won't be able to deduce the ID on the prox card simply by watching the chatter, even if you know the crypto algorithm. Or at least that's the theory, it's very hard to make it properly. But even it's broken it should not be a matter of simply replaying the last chat.

If that DOES work you need to have a word with your security people about buying a new security system.

Clearly you need to watch more television Salty...
You're letting actual facts mess with our distorted realities

pwner

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#619418 4-May-2012 11:54

from memory snapper uses SmartMX the new ones might use SmartMX2 from NXP. these can be used by security systems as well if you load the applicable app/token onto the card depending on the vendor of your security system. it would be interesting if Gallagher (Hamilton Based) who do Cardax could look at integrating this into the sim card as well. Theorectically possible, but in reality it may just be too hard or there is no economic driver.

Any posts are personal comments and not that of my employer

lanks

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#619459 4-May-2012 13:07

Just downloaded the app on my smartphone to read my Hop card. It reads the balance and the bus rides on my card which is cool.

It also has the topup option, but it seems like you can only topup the cash balance and not the bus rides. Anyone know if there are plans to support topping up bus rides?

hebegb

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#619461 4-May-2012 13:10

freitasm:
hebegb: Fried Snapper anyone!

Hey Mauricio,

Remember last night we tried to read the balance off my Snapper, unsuccessfully?

I had to walk home last night :)

The Snapper reader on the bus said, 2 devices detected from simply holding the card up by itself!

Still fried this morning. I hope it doesn't do it to all snapper happys!

I will try the snapper team to fix it.

Cheers

Yep, sent an email to Snapper when I saw J's comment on Twitter. You can call in anyway to get a replacement.

Interesting we were just trying to read it...

Just got a shiny new snapper card as a result!

They see me rollin, they hatin!

old3eyes

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#619464 4-May-2012 13:14

hebegb: The sim and antenna device that were shown briefly last night?

i.e. where a SIM has an attached antenna

Can that make any phone NFC capable?

If the the antenna was to fit under the back cover, would that be a usable option now?

I remember seeing a month or two ago on BBC TV's Click program just such a device that allowed a normal fone to use NFC by putting a addon under the SIM card with a NFC transceiver on it..

Regards,

Old3eyes

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