[Snap] Another angry and frustrated new Snap customer regretting switching to Snap!!!

Forums › 2degrees (including Slingshot, Orcon, Flip, Stuff Fibre, MyRepublic, 2talk and Vocus) › [Snap] Another angry and frustrated new Snap customer regretting switching to Snap!!!

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#904312 28-Sep-2013 20:34

These are the kind of little niggles I remember happening to Orcon when they were transitioning from quite a good ISP to maybe not so good...IMHO (and experience). Promises of phone calls and follow ups that never happened etc. I really hope SNAP doesn't end up going down that road, would be such a shame.

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#904364 28-Sep-2013 23:30

gjm: These are the kind of little niggles I remember happening to Orcon when they were transitioning from quite a good ISP to maybe not so good...IMHO (and experience). Promises of phone calls and follow ups that never happened etc. I really hope SNAP doesn't end up going down that road, would be such a shame.

This. Oh so very much this.

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#904366 28-Sep-2013 23:44

Sounds like growing pains to me. When a company is small you can get away with fairly fluid processes and have each CSR do that little bit more for your customers.

When you grow rapidly it's tough to keep things all organised and consistent. I fully understand the situation as I'm in the industry and know how the systems work so part of me feels for SNAP. Having said that I've seen first hand what happens when you over promise and under deliver, it never ends well. From day 1 your relationship with the customer will be on the back foot, and they remember the day you failed them!

Sometimes it's best not to say something will happen at a specific time when clearly the whole process is not under your control.

Lines like 'Based on the information we've received from our 3rd party installers, we believe your connection should be up and running on X date. In the unlikely situation that it does not work first time, give us a call and we'll investigate'.

It's communication 101, all CSRs who have been given proper training should be able to do that.

surfisup1000

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#904378 29-Sep-2013 00:40

baikal:
The problem is the new connection doesn't work!

To sum up this guys issues. . .
Modem took 30 days to deliver -- so what, he didn't need it because chorus hadn't connected the fibre anyway. (30 days after the Modem sent out email notification)
Snap phoned 1 day later than promised -- not ideal, but , another 'hate' thread for that? (Not 1 day later, no phone calls so far at all)
Dataplan dispute -- the website shows 50gb for $75 -- did the op negotiate a special one-off plan? He doesn't say. Could be miscommunication on either side. (Yes, a special one-off plan)

Maybe all of these problems are not a issue to you. But I never had any this kind of issues with Telecom, Vodafone and Orcon.
English is not my first language, sorry for that.

OK, good clarification. Just they way you originally described this didn't sound so bad. But, it seems your internet is still not working, snap said they would call yesterday but have not called at all. I agree, most annoying .

Good luck with getting things sorted.

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#904398 29-Sep-2013 09:13

Consumer guarantee act applies to services as well as products. I suggest you ask for a full refund since what you paid for hasn't been delivered within a reasonable time.

I was planning on signing up with Snap today or tomorrow, but seeing the rush of bad experiences with Snap in the past week has me hesitating. That Snap don't really give any response here doesn't help. Their 24 hour turnaround to usually simple presales questions (with the odd curly one) on the email helpdesk also suggests understaffing, or that they consider email queries less important than others. I ask multiple questions per email, and they never seem to answer all of them.

When people post here they want to tell others, but they also want help to get things working. Snap should do their best to give some information, though I guess they have to be careful about privacy.

PaulBags

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#904400 29-Sep-2013 09:16

InstallerUFB: Just to add a little bit of insight as to what sometimes happens when a customer requests a change in provider
A large proportion of connectons to homes have two circuits allocated (this was a commom practice is the 70s, 80s, 90s etc) so that you could have two lines one for the phone line and a secound for Dial up/ faxing etc.

The requirement for these two lines became redundent with the roll out of xDSL services but a large proporotion of these two circuits to a house still exisit.

Now comes to service swap over today -

- Provider A is connected to one of these circuits and you are happely useing that circuit for your xDSL etc in your house.
- Provider B requests a connection
- Circuit 1 is in use with provider A and hasnt been released for use by Provider B
- Circuit 2 is available for an 'intact' connection to the property (regardless of any rearrangements that may or may not be required to your household wireing to suit this connection)
- Provider B is connected to Circuit 2 and they are informed that there services have been connected to the house. (which 9x out of 10 is true)

As you are not or have not paid for a full install just what is called a self install then no tech will visit your house to rearrange the house wireing.

In the mean time dispite Your provider (B) saying you are connected and you assureing them that you aren't untill a service tech is requested or you check the connection yourself nothing will change.

- Unfortunatly this happens too often and it ends up with the fault serviceman that has to straighten the service out - Which is not a 'Fault' only on Chorus (as they are providing the service to the demarc as requested ) but poor communication of the common issues (between Provider, network supplier/s and THEIR Customers ) with provider change (and understanding of the physical network) at the help desk level at many ISPs

Interesting, and understandable I guess. But surely a change of provider request should imply that it should occur on the same line/first line/primary line? Are the procedures bad, or is the ISP requesting the wrong thing? And, could the ISP be requesting the wrong thing because a customer has asked for a connection and NOT for a change from one providor to another??

baikal: I signed up a 2-year contract so I thought I would received a full install from Snap. So bad.

I'm going to assume you signed up for a 2 year contract for UFB, which does come with install; and that the ADSL service you requested in the mean time may not be covered by the same contract.

Poor explanations and english as a second language. Fun times.

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baikal

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#904455 29-Sep-2013 12:32

Poor explanations and english as a second language. Fun times.

Although English is my second language, I am 100% sure Snap understood what I asked. :)

When I requested to move to Snap ADSL, Snap didn't mention the ADSL installation is a full install or not, neither in the email nor over the phone.

RalphFromSnap

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#905226 30-Sep-2013 16:35

Hi Baikal,

Thanks for your post, we are very sorry about your experience so far. I have had a chance to review your account and I'll try to explain what has happened here - unfortunately this looks like you’ve had terrible luck and it's hit all the nasty issues that could possibly happen, I'll address them one by one.

In regards to the delivery of your Fritz box: When you signed up on the Saturday we kicked off the process to place your order and send out your router. This was then sent with the next courier pick up on the Monday but unfortunately it was returned back on us following week by the couriers! We then contacted you and sent out the router again which for some reason took a little longer than normal to get to you, but good to hear it finally got there!

Second is your Fibre connection: this first went into what is called a consents stage, whereby Chorus need to gain a consent from your neighbours to install the fibre over a shared driveway. UFB consents is quite a big deal, and is something that is bound to pop up on Geekzone a lot, we are working hard with the LFC's on this and there may be changes in the pipeline, for the moment we are working on better process's to keep our customers up-to-date, as often we only update when there are changes (which may not happen often) we are looking to provide regular updates, even if it is "there is no update". Looks like your order cleared consents relatively quickly (must have nice neighbours!) and went into the scoping and design phase, which is where it has stalled. Chorus requires an Obstruction Plan to be provided by a third party in order to progress. The obstruction plan is basically an overview of anything and everything underground in the area they need to work in. Unfortunately being near a main road means that everything will go past (water, sewerage, gas, copper, fibre, cable, power etc), so they may need to be getting plans from several sources, and depending on the complexity, may also need visits to verify the plans. We have escalated this part of the order, as it seems to be taking longer than we would expect – though there isn’t a standard or agreed timeframe at this stage.

For your DSL, as indicated by installerUFB your line has been installed on the second pair – I have listened to the call and understand that our rep thought you had disconnected with your previous provider already, though he should have checked this manually anyway and so has logged a new connection for you. This is without wiring, because (assuming the line was recently disconnected) it should be intact. I can see the technician has been out today and got you online.

The good news is that our provisioning team ordered this as VDSL for you so that you can get a taste of fast speeds until fibre arrives. We normally wouldn’t do this for a temporary connection nor without full wiring (for quality guarantees – I’m sure you can find some GZ threads on that nugget!), but I see that one of the CSR’s has contacted you regarding that.

One final note, for your data packs, there was some confusion here as the CSR had meant you would get data from the fibre plan, however he implied that you would get the amount you had ordered (including an additional data pack) so this is what I have applied for you.

We'll let you know as soon as we can regarding an update on your fibre!

^MC

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baikal

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#905234 30-Sep-2013 16:57

RalphFromSnap: Hi Baikal,

Thanks for your post, we are very sorry about your experience so far. I have had a chance to review your account and I'll try to explain what has happened here - unfortunately this looks like you’ve had terrible luck and it's hit all the nasty issues that could possibly happen, I'll address them one by one.

In regards to the delivery of your Fritz box: When you signed up on the Saturday we kicked off the process to place your order and send out your router. This was then sent with the next courier pick up on the Monday but unfortunately it was returned back on us following week by the couriers! We then contacted you and sent out the router again which for some reason took a little longer than normal to get to you, but good to hear it finally got there!

Second is your Fibre connection: this first went into what is called a consents stage, whereby Chorus need to gain a consent from your neighbours to install the fibre over a shared driveway. UFB consents is quite a big deal, and is something that is bound to pop up on Geekzone a lot, we are working hard with the LFC's on this and there may be changes in the pipeline, for the moment we are working on better process's to keep our customers up-to-date, as often we only update when there are changes (which may not happen often) we are looking to provide regular updates, even if it is "there is no update". Looks like your order cleared consents relatively quickly (must have nice neighbours!) and went into the scoping and design phase, which is where it has stalled. Chorus requires an Obstruction Plan to be provided by a third party in order to progress. The obstruction plan is basically an overview of anything and everything underground in the area they need to work in. Unfortunately being near a main road means that everything will go past (water, sewerage, gas, copper, fibre, cable, power etc), so they may need to be getting plans from several sources, and depending on the complexity, may also need visits to verify the plans. We have escalated this part of the order, as it seems to be taking longer than we would expect – though there isn’t a standard or agreed timeframe at this stage.

For your DSL, as indicated by installerUFB your line has been installed on the second pair – I have listened to the call and understand that our rep thought you had disconnected with your previous provider already, though he should have checked this manually anyway and so has logged a new connection for you. This is without wiring, because (assuming the line was recently disconnected) it should be intact. I can see the technician has been out today and got you online.

The good news is that our provisioning team ordered this as VDSL for you so that you can get a taste of fast speeds until fibre arrives. We normally wouldn’t do this for a temporary connection nor without full wiring (for quality guarantees – I’m sure you can find some GZ threads on that nugget!), but I see that one of the CSR’s has contacted you regarding that.

One final note, for your data packs, there was some confusion here as the CSR had meant you would get data from the fibre plan, however he implied that you would get the amount you had ordered (including an additional data pack) so this is what I have applied for you.

We'll let you know as soon as we can regarding an update on your fibre!

^MC

Thank you very much!

Now I am online with VDSL, but Chorus didn't install a master filter so the speed is not that good.
Download : 10.5 Mbit/s
Upload: 6.5 Mbit/s

According to the technician, my house is only about 60 meters away from the exchange.

The Fritz!box VDSL settings has some problem, the VPI default value should be 0, but this doesn't work with my VDSL line, no internet access if set it as 0.

So I change VPI value to 1, it works perfect. Anybody knows why?

baikal

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#905253 30-Sep-2013 17:26

There are two lines to my house, Line A (Orcon ADSL) connected to my phone line. Line B (Snap VDSL) was disconnected, that's the reason I was not able to connect to Snap.

The technician disconnected Line A and connected Line B to my phone line this afternoon, then problem solved.
I just don't know why Chorus connected Line B to VDSL Exchange at the beginning, I never used Line B before.

The VOIP doesn't work, I think Snap will fix it soon

baikal

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#906697 2-Oct-2013 20:47

Maybe I am really unlucky, my fritz!box got 200+ phone calls from unknown number in last two days.
I think there is something wrong with the Firtz!box or the VDSL line.

Called Snap technical support today, hope they can fix it as soon as possible.

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paulst

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#910270 9-Oct-2013 10:25

chevrolux: Once again.... this is not Snap's fault.

If they say it should be going it means the job that they sent to Chorus has been completed. Something has most probably gone wrong on Chorus's side of things.

OH BULL!!! You are buying a service from Snap, not Snap and Chorus. Snap needs to manage their contractors, ie chorus, the same way Chorus should manage theirs instead of passing blame down the line. perhaps look up what a service is.. Snap just hands over work and expect it to be done, they never check to see it actually gets done on time and properly. This is the message from the Snap call center btw..
You also do know that you can't actually engage with Chorus right?? they tell you, very rightly, to go through your SERVICE provider.

vexxxboy

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#911284 9-Oct-2013 11:39

paulst:
chevrolux: Once again.... this is not Snap's fault.

If they say it should be going it means the job that they sent to Chorus has been completed. Something has most probably gone wrong on Chorus's side of things.

OH BULL!!! You are buying a service from Snap, not Snap and Chorus. Snap needs to manage their contractors, ie chorus, the same way Chorus should manage theirs instead of passing blame down the line. perhaps look up what a service is.. Snap just hands over work and expect it to be done, they never check to see it actually gets done on time and properly. This is the message from the Snap call center btw..
You also do know that you can't actually engage with Chorus right?? they tell you, very rightly, to go through your SERVICE provider.

you really dont get how it works do you, Chorus is not under Contract to Snap, they probably wish they were, then they could have more control over them. Snap has no control over what Chorus does after sending them the order, they just have to wait and see and if Chorus wont comunicate with Snap then how is Snap meant to tell you anything about whats happening with your connection. The only time Snap knows that Chorus mucked up and didnt turn up is when you ring Snap and tell them.

Common sense is not as common as you think.

hio77

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#911294 9-Oct-2013 12:12

vexxxboy:
paulst:
OH BULL!!! You are buying a service from Snap, not Snap and Chorus. Snap needs to manage their contractors, ie chorus, the same way Chorus should manage theirs instead of passing blame down the line. perhaps look up what a service is.. Snap just hands over work and expect it to be done, they never check to see it actually gets done on time and properly. This is the message from the Snap call center btw..
You also do know that you can't actually engage with Chorus right?? they tell you, very rightly, to go through your SERVICE provider.

you really dont get how it works do you, Chorus is not under Contract to Snap, they probably wish they were, then they could have more control over them. Snap has no control over what Chorus does after sending them the order, they just have to wait and see and if Chorus wont comunicate with Snap then how is Snap meant to tell you anything about whats happening with your connection. The only time Snap knows that Chorus mucked up and didnt turn up is when you ring Snap and tell them.

exactly.

thing is about the whole process with chorus, is its contracted out to subcontractors after that..

for snap to check up on the process, they need to poll for an update, and often they are told job complete.

a badly done install would require you to report it (given you shouldnt be required to, it should be done right the first time.. but this aint wonderland.), and then the correct channels can be gone through to get it resolved.

remembering, snap needs to put orders onto chorus, and thus the orders are passed on there... chinese whispers anyone?

or should it be expected that your provider sends someone out, to inspect that the job was done to the required standard? consider that overhead? technically, that would be sending out a second guy..

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PaulBags

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#911586 9-Oct-2013 19:36

F how it currently works, it should work. None of this twelve middle men who arn't responsible bull. ISPs, EQC, insurance companies, semi privatised SOEs, noise control, the police, politicians... the more needlessly complicated things become the less anything actually gets done. I'm absolutely sick of it, I wish we'd never crawled out of the sea. Or at least out of the trees.

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