GCSB Bill and withdrawl of services by Microsoft,Google,Yahoo

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#873947 8-Aug-2013 15:41

Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ: The reality is the loss of the NZ market place for those Corporations would have a minute impact on the bottom line.

So nz is going to end up in the dark with no support or updates for Windows and no access to Goggle,Gmail,Youtube,Yahoo and Yahoo Mail?

I don't have a crystal ball, the threats maybe bluff or they may decide that it's just not worth the hassle to do business here.

They already have to comply with the NSA in the USA and the GCHQ in the United Kingdom.Don't see why they can;t do the same with the GCSB.

Compliance with any statute takes human, material and fiscal resources, if they are drawing minimal returns from NZ then they may decide to cut and run. The UK and US market places are huge compared to NZ, we are equivalent to a rounding error.

If they do there's going to be alot of ****ed off Windows,Google and Yahoo users in nz!

Could well be.

But ****ed off users=bad PR and i thought Microsoft and the others want to avoid that?

We are just not a significant market place, these Corporations exist to generate profit for the owners, if market revenue returns are negative then they will exit.

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#873948 8-Aug-2013 15:42

KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ:
Techwarrior:
KiwiNZ: The reality is the loss of the NZ market place for those Corporations would have a minute impact on the bottom line.

So nz is going to end up in the dark with no support or updates for Windows and no access to Goggle,Gmail,Youtube,Yahoo and Yahoo Mail?

I don't have a crystal ball, the threats maybe bluff or they may decide that it's just not worth the hassle to do business here.

They already have to comply with the NSA in the USA and the GCHQ in the United Kingdom.Don't see why they can;t do the same with the GCSB.

Compliance with any statute takes human, material and fiscal resources, if they are drawing minimal returns from NZ then they may decide to cut and run. The UK and US market places are huge compared to NZ, we are equivalent to a rounding error.

If they do there's going to be alot of ****ed off Windows,Google and Yahoo users in nz!

Could well be.

But ****ed off users=bad PR and i thought Microsoft and the others want to avoid that?

We are just not a significant market place, these Corporations exist to generate profit for the owners, if market revenue returns are negative then they will exit.

Okay but that's giving competition a free run.

Techwarrior

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#873980 8-Aug-2013 16:15

So based on the replies to my thread should i starting thinking about an alternate email service and internet browser in case Google and yahoo withdraw services from nz?

Ragnor

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#873991 8-Aug-2013 16:35

It's saber rattling on both sides.

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#873999 8-Aug-2013 16:44

Ragnor: It's saber rattling on both sides.

Why do you think it's saber rattling and not Microsoft,Google and Yahoo being dead serious on withdrawing services from nz if the GCSB Bill passes the third reading and signed into law?

SaltyNZ

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#874044 8-Aug-2013 18:09

For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

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blakamin

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#874046 8-Aug-2013 18:15

SaltyNZ: For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

But they won't make a profit if they have to put more resources into it, and if there's no money, why bother?

They already want to be able, in the US, to publicly tell people when they get served with NSA requests, but they can't at this stage.
They publicly report all the other requests.

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Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.

SaltyNZ

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#874056 8-Aug-2013 18:19

If you believe their margins are so razor thin this will sink them, then you certainly should be worried about their service. But not because of this. The next global financial hiccup should be more than enough to send them packing.

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Techwarrior

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#874058 8-Aug-2013 18:21

SaltyNZ: For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

Could you provide a couple of examples where nobody quits nz when compliance costs go up?

surfisup1000

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#874061 8-Aug-2013 18:24

Techwarrior: Hello all,
In a stuff.co.nz article Microsoft,Google and other internet services say they may be forced to withdraw services from nz if the GCSB Bill passes.So will they really do that and leave everyone in nz who uses Windows,Google,Youtube and Yahoo without support and access to their services?

The thing is, to comply with NZ law means they have to break US law.

That is an interpretation i read somewhere.

But, this will never eventuate. John key would look like a real donkey if this happened.

SaltyNZ

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#874062 8-Aug-2013 18:25

Techwarrior:
SaltyNZ: For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

Could you provide a couple of examples where nobody quits nz when compliance costs go up?

They didn't quit NZ the last time corporate tax rates were raised.

iPad Pro 11" + iPhone 15 Pro Max + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

Techwarrior

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#874064 8-Aug-2013 18:25

SaltyNZ:
Techwarrior:
SaltyNZ: For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

Could you provide a couple of examples where nobody quits nz when compliance costs go up?

They didn't quit NZ the last time corporate tax rates were raised.

Thanks for the example.

Techwarrior

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#874067 8-Aug-2013 18:27

surfisup1000:
Techwarrior: Hello all,
In a stuff.co.nz article Microsoft,Google and other internet services say they may be forced to withdraw services from nz if the GCSB Bill passes.So will they really do that and leave everyone in nz who uses Windows,Google,Youtube and Yahoo without support and access to their services?

The thing is, to comply with NZ law means they have to break US law.

That is an interpretation i read somewhere.

But, this will never eventuate. John key would look like a real donkey if this happened.

But how would they be breaking US law if they already comply with NSA requests?
That's what i just can't figure out.

SaltyNZ

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#874070 8-Aug-2013 18:32

Techwarrior:
SaltyNZ:
Techwarrior:
SaltyNZ: For the same reason that nobody quits NZ when any other kind of compliance cost goes up. As long as they make a profit, they stay. It's simple. And if you compare wht they charge here for the same service in the US -- often served OUT OF the US -- you KNOW they're making a big fat profit.

Could you provide a couple of examples where nobody quits nz when compliance costs go up?

They didn't quit NZ the last time corporate tax rates were raised.

Thanks for the example.

Ok, if you insist: company taxes were raised in 1985 and GST was introduced in 1986. Microsoft has been selling stuff in NZ since 1981. Are you happy now? They're NOT going to leave.

iPad Pro 11" + iPhone 15 Pro Max + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

blakamin

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#874072 8-Aug-2013 18:34

SaltyNZ: If you believe their margins are so razor thin this will sink them, then you certainly should be worried about their service. But not because of this. The next global financial hiccup should be more than enough to send them packing.

It won't sink them, it's more like "why bother".
Why doesn't NZ have devices in the google play store?
We have it in Aussie... couldn't be that much harder, but they don't because it's not worth the effort for that little profit.
NZ has a population the size of Melbourne (as you know).
Google make money from ads.. how many more ads do they have to serve to cover the GCSB crap? 2x? 3x? Who pays for them?
How much profit you really think there is? Millions isn't a big profit to these global companies.. Tens of millions is probably pocket change.

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