Labour to ban Facebook if they don't pay more tax

Forums › ICT Policies and Regulation › Labour to ban Facebook if they don't pay more tax

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#976424 29-Jan-2014 08:37

Good on Labour. I fully support them on this one because it means they will get even less support in the next elections ...

nathan

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#976426 29-Jan-2014 08:43

You'd think a Finance spokesperson would know that companies pay tax on profits not turnover

Fred99

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#976428 29-Jan-2014 08:47

freitasm:

They are not doing tax evasion. They have very good accountants that know that by using companies in some places they can pay less tax. Legally.

This is probably true (avoidance rather than evasion) - but might not be. Profit shifting as a means to tax minimisation is illegal in most countries, but it's effectively unenforceable globally.
It's probably yet another example of a Wicked Problem which is going to continue to defy satisfactory resolution.
Worse, the general public seem to be more suspicious of the motives of governments and authorities such as the IMF and World Bank calling for reform, than the global corporates and "loose affiliation of millionaires and billionaires" who seem to be calling all the shots, rejecting all suggestions for reform.

MikeB4

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#976432 29-Jan-2014 08:52

NonprayingMantis:
KiwiNZ:
freitasm: Here is where you are wrong. These site's online activities are not illegal.

They are not doing tax evasion. They have very good accountants that know that by using companies in some places they can pay less tax. Legally.

Deal with it. It's not illegal. The government has a loophole in the tax system. Get the MPs to close it with a new reformed tax law. But don't come with crap about closing sites because it can be used for other things.

I was not referring to these sites, I was referring to non specific sites in response to your post re banning on the internet.

Clearly Googles and Facebooks activity is not illegal. I am saying that as with any part of society the legsl closure of illegal activity is a sanction the judiciary should have at its disposal.

Sounds nice in theory, but even aside from the 'slippery slope' argument there is also the problem that it is virtually impossible in practice to have a real impact

For a start, The Nz government has no jurisdiction to shut down websites hosted in other countries.

They could, in theory, get ISPs to filter out websites such as pirate bay, as they try in the uk, but actually getting that to happen will cost millions AND it won't work because anybody can use a VPN to get around any sort of ISP filtering.

Of course NZ Government can do squat about overseas based operations, but NZ sites and companies it can. EG a guy in say Utiku starts a web site peddling illegal porn, the judiciary should be able to take that site down.

freitasm

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Geekzone

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#976442 29-Jan-2014 09:05

I don't always share Kiwiblog posts, but when I do... http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/01/labour_jumps_the_shark.html.

freitasm

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#976443 29-Jan-2014 09:06

KiwiNZ: Of course NZ Government can do squat about overseas based operations, but NZ sites and companies it can. EG a guy in say Utiku starts a web site peddling illegal porn, the judiciary should be able to take that site down.

But the discussion is about tax evasion, not child abuse/pr0n. This sounds like trying to move the target away from the original quote.

Fred99

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#976445 29-Jan-2014 09:12

freitasm:
KiwiNZ: Of course NZ Government can do squat about overseas based operations, but NZ sites and companies it can. EG a guy in say Utiku starts a web site peddling illegal porn, the judiciary should be able to take that site down.

But the discussion is about tax evasion, not child abuse/pr0n. This sounds like trying to move the target away from the original quote.

Are you suggesting that tax evasion is "victimless" ?

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kiwitrc

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#976448 29-Jan-2014 09:15

I think he means Tax Avoidance

ghettomaster

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#976461 29-Jan-2014 09:32

“Fine print, he’s going to close down Facebook,” says Prime Minister John Key. “That’ll be interesting.”

Key is awesome. He always handles these things with class.

MikeB4

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#976463 29-Jan-2014 09:36

freitasm:
KiwiNZ: Of course NZ Government can do squat about overseas based operations, but NZ sites and companies it can. EG a guy in say Utiku starts a web site peddling illegal porn, the judiciary should be able to take that site down.

But the discussion is about tax evasion, not child abuse/pr0n. This sounds like trying to move the target away from the original quote.

I was following on from "Welcome to your new Labour Overlords, who will one day cull dissent by blocking sites and services. Oh sure, some folks will say it will never happen. Right."

Dratsab

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#976547 29-Jan-2014 11:12

As has been stated a few times, sites like Facebook and Google are not doing anything illegal. There legal means to avoiding tax in this country and many companies exploit this. Peter Dunne (MP) describes it as "legitimate tax avoidance".

Dratsab

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#976548 29-Jan-2014 11:12

ajobbins

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#976569 29-Jan-2014 11:48

The government should have the ability to block sites (or require ISPs to) only after a court order from a judge where they found guilty of (and continue to) illegal activity.

As soon as you give govt means to shut down what ever they feel or decided doesn't suit their interests, it leaves the door wide open for abuse. And as Mauricio pointed out, once you give them that power, good luck taking it away.

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JimmyH

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#976856 29-Jan-2014 18:55

Perhaps the Labour Party should take the moral high ground and lead by example - by removing its Facebook page, requiring all its MPs to surrender all their Apple devices, and changing the settings on its websites so that they are no longer indexed/searchable by Google?

No..... thought not!

Aredwood

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#976933 29-Jan-2014 22:06

Problem is, where do you stop?

Any overseas company that imports stuff has been doing this for years. Overseas HQ charges the NZ company (aka division) high prices for whatever products they import. This means the NZ company makes hardly any profit while the overseas HQ makes large profits.

There would have to be some sort of court. Whose sole purpose it to figure out if these prices charged between overseas companies and their NZ divisions are fair. Yet imagine the compliance costs that would create.

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