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41 posts

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# 180489 10-Sep-2015 23:07
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Bought a Ryobi 18V One+ drill combo last weekend. Not bad by its own, good specs, good build quality, and good price. But I do feel it's a little in the heavy side, and the whole chuck has a little play, I mean the chuck is not 100% rigidly connected to the drill body. 

So I went back to the Bunnings and checked all the display drills' chuck. Here is my finding:

1,Ryobi, hiend BS model is very good. But lower models are not that good, just like mine. 
2,Green Bosch, all the display models are no better than Ryobi. 
3,DeWALT, worse than green Bosch. Big surprise to me.
4,Makita, very very rigid, almost no play.
5,AEG, second to Makita, better than all others. 

So I returned the Ryobi 18V set and swapped for a AEG 12V set for a little bit more budget. The reason I didn't think about a 12V is afraid it might be too weak. But it turns out the AEG 12V drill has 40NM torque which is even 2.5NM more than the Ryobi 18V. (Of course a higher end 18V would be higher than 40NM.) And I did some drill test back to home and can confirm this 12V does feel almost as powerful as the previous Ryobi 18V which is rated at 37.5NM.

It's interesting to know the build quality variation across the brands and that a good 12V could be quite powerful enough. :D


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gzt

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  # 1385311 10-Sep-2015 23:38
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There are several variables. For instance drills with a masonry hammer setting will tend to have more play. Iirc the typical dewalt has a hammer and the makita does not.

Then type and quality of chuck. Chucks are essentially a consumable and are replaced regularly in trade use. Good chucks are somewhat expensive, and typically the supplied chuck is not all that great. Edit: having said that unlikely a properly installed chuck is the source of any play so that is kind of off topic.

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  # 1385326 11-Sep-2015 01:44

Have a look at Hitachi drills as well. I have a 18v drill and impact driver combo. The drill can do 50nm and the impact driver 150nm. They also have a long warranty on the batteries. 4 years I think.





 
 
 
 


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  # 1385986 11-Sep-2015 22:39
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Aredwood: Have a look at Hitachi drills as well. I have a 18v drill and impact driver combo. The drill can do 50nm and the impact driver 150nm. They also have a long warranty on the batteries. 4 years I think.


AEG NZ has 6 years warranty (3 years on battery), I think that's the longest power tool warranty you can find in NZ.
In the US, it has life time battery warranty, as Ridgid brand. Being just a compact 12V drill, 40NM torque is quite something, also the 126NM on the impact driver.

But as discussed in my other threads, people don't think long warranty is directly connected to high quality. :D

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  # 1386428 13-Sep-2015 00:21
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Thanks for this. I was at the home show. Ryobi had a massive stand. I have been considering a power tools pack for basic around the house type maintenance (I am barely capable nor inclined but feel I should be more so). I have been keeping my eye out for a cordless drill that is small and LIGHT and still has lots of power. I don't want to spend the earth but budget is not my primary focus, size and power are.

I think I just need a basic drill, and I'd like a good electric screwdriver. I don't think I'd have much use for a hammer drill or impact drill, would that be fair to say?

What did the AEG set you back?

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  # 1386616 13-Sep-2015 12:57
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networkn: 

I think I just need a basic drill, and I'd like a good electric screwdriver. I don't think I'd have much use for a hammer drill or impact drill, would that be fair to say?



It depends what you're intending to do.  
These days basically everybody in trade uses impact drivers.  Screw fasteners have got cheaper, various tek screws are used for fastening from roofing sheets, decking, and in a wide range of other assorted fixing applications.
In some light engineering building related trade work I do, an 18v impact driver with small 1.5Ah battery will last a day on a charge  (wouldn't for a roofer etc -but fine for me).  As well as driving tek-screws etc, used with 3/8" drive adapter and sockets to tighten nuts and bolts, and for small diameter drilling, then hex mount drill bits (some care needed with these - they're expensive and a bit fragile).  Impact driver clips on my belt all day with bits etc in the pouch and is by far the most used power tool.  My other 18v tools  stay in the truck - have to go back and get them as needed.



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  # 1386645 13-Sep-2015 15:01
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I dont get how these brands can justify selling a 3 cell tool as 12v, while at the same time selling a 5 cell as 18v. You have a 10.8v tool there. Or the big one would be a 20v by the same rationale.




Richard rich.ms



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  # 1386647 13-Sep-2015 15:16
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richms: I dont get how these brands can justify selling a 3 cell tool as 12v, while at the same time selling a 5 cell as 18v. You have a 10.8v tool there. Or the big one would be a 20v by the same rationale.


It's actually very simple:

Compared to Ryobi 18V drill set, AEG 12V drill has more torque (40NM vs 37.5NM), considerably small size and less weight (1.8Kg VS 1.2Kg) and so on. Yes, the impact driver of AEG 12V has less torque than Ryobi 18V, 126NM vs 170NM, but as a home handyman you barely need a 170NM impact driver. The biggest advantage of 12V (or 10.8V) tools is the size and weight, while still keep enough torque capability. Of course most 12V drills have only 10mm chuck which is smaller than Ryobi 18V's 13mm, but for home handyman use I don't see the difference. 

As for the battery, Ryobi 18V set has 2 18V*1.3A battery, that's 23.4WH+23.4WH, for AEG 12V set you have 24WH + 48WH batteries which is considerably more beefy in capacity. 

No need to mention that AEG comes with 6 years trade warranty VS 2 years of Ryobi. 

So, my opinion is that a modern higher-end 12V is probably no worse than a mid-range 18V.  We don't need to include some low end 18V ones as many drills of them often has only 10-20NM torque. Simply compare voltage doesn't really count, and I made that mistake by not including the 12V tools before. 

ie, the retail price in Bunnings: Ryobi 18V set: $198; AEG 12V set: 259.

 
 
 
 


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  # 1386651 13-Sep-2015 15:26
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PPAP can you link me to the models you purchased? Sounds like AEG might be for me.

Dumb question, why would I buy an impact drill over a traditional drill? Mostly I'd go through gib, or into a nog behind gib.

Occasionally I might like to drive a screw into wood. 

Sorry I am about as green as you'll find for power tools.



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  # 1386662 13-Sep-2015 15:34
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networkn: Thanks for this. I was at the home show. Ryobi had a massive stand. I have been considering a power tools pack for basic around the house type maintenance (I am barely capable nor inclined but feel I should be more so). I have been keeping my eye out for a cordless drill that is small and LIGHT and still has lots of power. I don't want to spend the earth but budget is not my primary focus, size and power are.

I think I just need a basic drill, and I'd like a good electric screwdriver. I don't think I'd have much use for a hammer drill or impact drill, would that be fair to say?

What did the AEG set you back?


I was in the home show yesterday as well. The Ryobi booth was actually operated by Bunnines, also the price was no cheaper than their shop price as now. :-(

AEG 12V set: 1 drill, 1 impact driver, 1 2A battery, 1 4A battery, 1 charger, model no: BS12CKIT2-402B. 

The drill is very capable as the 40NM torque is actually more than a middle range 18V drill such as Ryobi set's. And being a 12V too, it is very small and light. 

If you will need to drive long or big screws into studs like I just did for my TV bracket install, you will much appreciate the impact driver which will be very easier to handle and less likely to damage the screw top. A drill can do that as well, but will require much force to handle from your body and more likely to flat the screw top. For the set price I would say why not to have a impact driver as well. :D

Price of AEG 12v set is 259 from Bunnings. Please be aware there is a older set model still being sold which is BS12CKIT2-202B. The old model has 2 2A battery rather than new model's 2A+4A. But the old models drill has battery status display while the new one doesn't. The impact drivers are exactly the same. The price of the old one is same as the new one. When I bought the old one last week, I asked them to give me 30 dollars discount because that's the price difference between a 2A battery and a 4A, they gave me 10% off.

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  # 1386663 13-Sep-2015 15:36
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Hmm that is a good deal. Very tempted.



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  # 1386664 13-Sep-2015 15:38
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networkn: PPAP can you link me to the models you purchased? Sounds like AEG might be for me.

Dumb question, why would I buy an impact drill over a traditional drill? Mostly I'd go through gib, or into a nog behind gib.

Occasionally I might like to drive a screw into wood. 

Sorry I am about as green as you'll find for power tools.


Please see my 2 replies. 

Bunnings website: http://www.bunnings.co.nz/aeg-12v-combo-impact-driver-kit-2pc-with-2-x-2-0ah-batteries_p00304349  It's the old model. Actually they are phasing out the old model, you are mostly like to find only the new model in the shop. 

AEG NZ website: https://aegpowertools.co.nz/products/combo-kits/12v-2-piece-combo-kit  It's the new model.

If you do buy a AEG, don't forget to register online to get a 6 year warranty. :D 

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  # 1386669 13-Sep-2015 16:06
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PPAP:

It's actually very simple:

Compared to Ryobi 18V drill set, AEG 12V drill has more torque (40NM vs 37.5NM), considerably small size and less weight (1.8Kg VS 1.2Kg) and so on. Yes, the impact driver of AEG 12V has less torque than Ryobi 18V, 126NM vs 170NM, but as a home handyman you barely need a 170NM impact driver. The biggest advantage of 12V (or 10.8V) tools is the size and weight, while still keep enough torque capability. Of course most 12V drills have only 10mm chuck which is smaller than Ryobi 18V's 13mm, but for home handyman use I don't see the difference. 

As for the battery, Ryobi 18V set has 2 18V*1.3A battery, that's 23.4WH+23.4WH, for AEG 12V set you have 24WH + 48WH batteries which is considerably more beefy in capacity. 

No need to mention that AEG comes with 6 years trade warranty VS 2 years of Ryobi. 

So, my opinion is that a modern higher-end 12V is probably no worse than a mid-range 18V.  We don't need to include some low end 18V ones as many drills of them often has only 10-20NM torque. Simply compare voltage doesn't really count, and I made that mistake by not including the 12V tools before. 

ie, the retail price in Bunnings: Ryobi 18V set: $198; AEG 12V set: 259.


Volts has nothing to do with torque.

3 x 3.6 = 10.8

5 x 3.6 = 18

I know that dewalt and black and decker decided to call their 20v max range 18v for outside the USA because of europe being europe about things, and I dont see why they get to call these other tools 12v when its competing against the correctly labled 10.8v bosch range. Not even called 12V MAX like dewalt do.

Its as BS as putting PMPO on stereos.




Richard rich.ms



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  # 1386683 13-Sep-2015 16:23
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richms:
PPAP:

It's actually very simple:

Compared to Ryobi 18V drill set, AEG 12V drill has more torque (40NM vs 37.5NM), considerably small size and less weight (1.8Kg VS 1.2Kg) and so on. Yes, the impact driver of AEG 12V has less torque than Ryobi 18V, 126NM vs 170NM, but as a home handyman you barely need a 170NM impact driver. The biggest advantage of 12V (or 10.8V) tools is the size and weight, while still keep enough torque capability. Of course most 12V drills have only 10mm chuck which is smaller than Ryobi 18V's 13mm, but for home handyman use I don't see the difference. 

As for the battery, Ryobi 18V set has 2 18V*1.3A battery, that's 23.4WH+23.4WH, for AEG 12V set you have 24WH + 48WH batteries which is considerably more beefy in capacity. 

No need to mention that AEG comes with 6 years trade warranty VS 2 years of Ryobi. 

So, my opinion is that a modern higher-end 12V is probably no worse than a mid-range 18V.  We don't need to include some low end 18V ones as many drills of them often has only 10-20NM torque. Simply compare voltage doesn't really count, and I made that mistake by not including the 12V tools before. 

ie, the retail price in Bunnings: Ryobi 18V set: $198; AEG 12V set: 259.


Volts has nothing to do with torque.

3 x 3.6 = 10.8

5 x 3.6 = 18

I know that dewalt and black and decker decided to call their 20v max range 18v for outside the USA because of europe being europe about things, and I dont see why they get to call these other tools 12v when its competing against the correctly labled 10.8v bosch range. Not even called 12V MAX like dewalt do.

Its as BS as putting PMPO on stereos.


I see. Yeah you are right. I even thought why they have 3 cells and have 12V, shouldn't be a DCDC converter inside as too expensive and potentially low efficiency. 

But just before hitting the Post Reply button, I did a voltage test of the battery output (no load) using multi meter, it is 12.49V for both 2 batteries. So it is 12V and maybe there is DCDC inside? No....... Or may be it's normal for this kind of power lithium battery to have a slightly higher voltage when fully charged. 

I agree with you it's a market thing.


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  # 1386714 13-Sep-2015 17:26
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Fully charged and straight off the charer will be 4.2 for a lithium, it will drop to 4ish pretty quickly. A 18v lithium straight off the charger will be over 20v which is why B&D and dewalt and a few others market theirs as 20v Max in the USA. Also helps people tell them apart from the nicad 18v range which is a huge problem here with hitachi and dewalts changing their designs for liion range but still calling them 18v despite the packs not fitting.

3.6 is the nominal voltage (or 3.7 depending who you ask) because that across its discharge curve gives you the correct amount of watt hours from the amp hours rating give or take a bit. Same way that a nominal alkaline 1.5v actually starts off at 1.7-1.8 and is dead at 0.8v.




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  # 1386715 13-Sep-2015 17:28
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Also the more I play with a friends AEG/ridgid tools the more I regret going all-in on ryobi ones. Nothing "wrong" with the ryobi's, but the AEGs just feel nicer.

Plus at the homeshow I was very very dissapointed that the bunnings/ryobi stand didnt have their new brushless one on it. Was hoping to have a play with it since you cant do that in the stores.




Richard rich.ms

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