2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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BDFL - Memuneh
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#2667255 3-Mar-2021 11:11

MikeB4:

@freitasm that really has nothing to do with religion as such. Those two are pseudo religious scam artists. Their actions would be the same no matter what they were currently into.

Sorry, @mikeb4 I disagree... It is religion. It is treated as religion. People believe it as religion.

CruciasNZ

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#2667258 3-Mar-2021 11:13

freitasm:

Anyone defending religion at this point... Destiny Church leaders Brian and Hannah Tamaki leave Auckland on eve of level 3 lockdown

Sure, leaving before the lockdown at 6am wasn't "illegal" but completely against the spirit.

We desperately need legislation to allow fines to be levied against people that game the system or flee lockdown. They wouldn't catch everyone, but idiots that announce it on social media (like the Tamaki's) would be easy wins. Also would allow aggrieved locals to dob in people visiting holiday homes or motorcamps....

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antonknee

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#2667259 3-Mar-2021 11:16

CruciasNZ:

As a country we've done remarkably with respect to COVID, but that track record and the endemic Kiwi attitude to risk ("she'll be right") is working against us. The current crop of morons who have spawned the current lockdown are a prime example (visiting isolating people, feeling unwell, getting tested, going to public places after the testing).

I think this is exactly it. People who don't scan, or put false info on contact tracing at businesses, people who refuse to wear a mask on public transport, people who breach isolation rules or bend them, not getting tested when you probably should, testing and then doing stuff which could spread the disease, travelling on a plane when you're ill, etc etc.

The list goes on, and as time goes by people seem to care less and less - even as each little outbreak has gotten 'worse' in a sense, which you might think would make people more vigilant.

She'll be right, right up until she isn't.

MikeB4

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#2667260 3-Mar-2021 11:17

@freitasm Based on that then politics should be got rid of, along with other scams. Oh and of course get rid of Shortland Street which would be a public service. I am not defending religion it can do that themselves I just don't believe those two snake oil salespeople should be in any way associated with a religion /charity as that would legitimise their other scam their tax status.

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#2667262 3-Mar-2021 11:20

CruciasNZ:

freitasm:

Anyone defending religion at this point... Destiny Church leaders Brian and Hannah Tamaki leave Auckland on eve of level 3 lockdown

Sure, leaving before the lockdown at 6am wasn't "illegal" but completely against the spirit.

We desperately need legislation to allow fines to be levied against people that game the system or flee lockdown. They wouldn't catch everyone, but idiots that announce it on social media (like the Tamaki's) would be easy wins. Also would allow aggrieved locals to dob in people visiting holiday homes or motorcamps....

The problem with the Tamaki family is they would shout "We are being persecuted" or "The government is making us pay a fine to silence us and silence you" and so on, leading their followers to stop abiding by regulations that keep us all safe.

But yes, these people deserve nothing from us, except scorn.

MikeB4

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#2667263 3-Mar-2021 11:23

The government needs to look at how they impose lockdown changes. Giving 12-24 hours notice allows time for idiots to plan their stupidity. We have been doing this often enough now for businesses etc to put their plans into action quickly. Maybe two to fours hours notice should be enough.

Benoire

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#2667267 3-Mar-2021 11:26

I think the problem lies with the public order creation and it needing a certain time to come active. Ideally they would have sealed the order for 6am to allow for people to get home from events without being prosecuted but allowed the shutdown of the exits/entries in to Auckland but that would likely have not complied with the order; would have been the best outcome for the rest of the Country.

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sen8or

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#2667273 3-Mar-2021 11:37

Its a slippery slope to disallow destiny church its religous status, where does it end, who decides what is and what isn't a legitimate religion. I am in no way defending what they do (or what they purport to do), just that once you start declaring what is and what isn't through no measure other than perception, its a dangerous path.

And isnt Sanitarium still owned by a church and don't they enjoy tax free status even as a commercial operation, aside from a potentially broader spread of the profits from the commercial operation than the Tamakis, how is it different?

sbiddle

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#2667275 3-Mar-2021 11:48

And now we have yet another side to the whole "should they have been at isolated or should they not have been isolating story" with the DHB basically confirming that the advice they were given was that there was no need for other family members of the Papatoetoe high school student to isolate, and that the rules changed after the KFC and Kmart family members had been to work.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/124415308/covid19-ministry-post-says-kfc-worker-was-not-required-to-isolate-despite-pms-claims

It's pretty clear that that all of the messaging is nowhere near as clear as it needs to be, and that the information that is available on DHB, MoH websites and social media channels needs a huge revamp because there is incredibly mixed messaging out there regarding isolation and testing.

Oblivian

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#2667280 3-Mar-2021 12:11

Nice single Flyer. Pointing to, Or simply leading with - a repository where only someone like the head of MoH can make the change. Done

But then you will get the 'we don't have internet', 'we don't trust the government sites'

Silos/multi faceted paths relying on data being disseminated properly is clearly not working. Especially when it comes to printed memos. It covers a butt only as far as that coverage is able to be recalled, or gets scrapped when revised. As you can see by the lvl1 base leafelts still being handed out (which DO say, or directed by officer of health. Which he yesterday confirmed at press conf any verbal or order directive given on tv over-rides and takes pace as that disclaimer intends) someone isn't issuing clear recalls.

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#2667308 3-Mar-2021 13:39

cokemaster:
@handle9 - Thanks for posting that, does shed a new angle on this.

The sidebar comments that have been coming out from the government regarding this outbreak and the previous 'employer forced employee to work with symptoms' may very well discourage folks from being completely honest out of fear of being thrown under the bus. There are ways and means of dealing with these breaches without waving red meat to the crowd.

It sounds like the government (through the MoH) may have A. miscommunicated the expectations and B. failed to choose the right media to communicate their messages. It would be my expectation that at a bare minimum, phone calls or 2 way text messages would be used (with acknowledgement) rather than letters.

Speaking of buses - I did see an AT Metro bus yesterday evening. Bus driver had no PPE/Mask and the disembarking passenger did not either. Is Auckland getting tired of the restrictions (given nearly 1K of them went to a west Auckland beach)?

Something about MOH/covid response Facebook contradicting other official channels specifically regarding household members

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/124415308/covid19-ministry-post-says-kfc-worker-was-not-required-to-isolate-despite-pms-claims

JaseNZ

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#2667310 3-Mar-2021 13:41

Perhaps they should have gone to level 4 shut it all down, no in and or outs.

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dafman

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#2667370 3-Mar-2021 14:23

Tax Sanitarium and all churches. Slippery slope problem solved.

Sanitarium in particular. The NZ Herald investigated them some years back and discovered they had tens of millions invested in offshore companies. But, hey, they run the cute kids marathon each year, so lets give them a break and ignore the fact that they avoid paying any income tax.

MikeB4

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#2667373 3-Mar-2021 14:45

dafman:

Tax Sanitarium and all churches. Slippery slope problem solved.

Sanitarium in particular. The NZ Herald investigated them some years back and discovered they had tens of millions invested in offshore companies. But, hey, they run the cute kids marathon each year, so lets give them a break and ignore the fact that they avoid paying any income tax.

Not that simple and probably a topic for a new thread in the Politics section

dafman

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#2667377 3-Mar-2021 15:01

MikeB4:

dafman:

Tax Sanitarium and all churches. Slippery slope problem solved.

Sanitarium in particular. The NZ Herald investigated them some years back and discovered they had tens of millions invested in offshore companies. But, hey, they run the cute kids marathon each year, so lets give them a break and ignore the fact that they avoid paying any income tax.

Not that simple and probably a topic for a new thread in the Politics section

I reckon it is that simple, but agree this is not the thread to discuss further.

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