2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2717430 2-Jun-2021 20:16

sbiddle:

Handle9:

This should really be in the politics section. Is your argument tax paid should confer rights?

I've paid more tax in my working life in NZ than most New Zealanders will pay in their entire lifetime so I should have the right to everything even if I'm not a resident. By this logic non-resident citizens paying NZ tax should have the right to the NZ pension.

No it doesn't.. But we don't pay for the cost of people's plane flights home - why should we pay for their managed isolation?

Managed isolation is for your benefit, not theirs.

DS248

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#2717478 2-Jun-2021 22:27

Update on vaccination rates in NZ, AU & Singapore.

Perhaps more interesting is the differences in first and second doses given, largely due to AU using AZ, presumably with a ~12(?) wk gap between first and second dose.

While the proportion of the population that have received the first dose is 80% higher in AU than in NZ, only 2.1% there have received both doses vs 4.6% here in NZ.

First Second

NZ 8.5% 4.6%
AU 15.4% 2.1%
SG 38.7% 30.0%

Figures above are aggregate % of population vaccinated to 1 June.

mattwnz

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#2717493 2-Jun-2021 23:58

Oblivian:
Hmm. So the snippets on the news about Victoria and stuck kiwis along the lines of 'Pressure is mounting on the government to look into options for getting people home' and '..how it may work regarding quarantine, or if they can isolate at home...' as a result of the 7 day extension.

Uuuhhhmmm.

They took the risk by traveling during the middle of a pandemic, and should have contingency in place. The PM made it very clear that people would be on their own and would have to accept responsibility. The chance of this happening was very high. Not sure if any insurance company is covering it. But it is not as though they are such in a third world country. I am not going to Australia because I don't want to take the risk. IMO I am not convinced the bubble was a good idea, especially with the Indian varient as it increases the odds of it getting into NZ and the cost if we have another lockdown in Auckland or NZ will be huge. What is happening in Melbourne looks pretty bad and I can now see them being in lockdown for the next month which is likely one reason many over there will be wanting to come back.

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#2717499 3-Jun-2021 00:16

sbiddle:

cshwone:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/300322274/transtasman-bubble-only-20-per-cent-of-arrivals-scanned-for-fevers-at-our-biggest-airport

Complacency rules

Checking for temperatures is pointless and has been regarded as so for probably 12 months now. Unless somebody is actually highly symptomatic they are unlikely to have a fever.

This.

With what we know now, temperature checks for covid-19 are pretty much security theater.

I personally think we should be requiring a PCR test sample on arrival as a condition of green zone ex-aussie travel (managed isolation required if a citizen arrival doesn't aggree, Decline entry to non citizens who don't agree...)

Perhaps add a pre-departure test into the mix too, just for time periods that aust has covid-19 in the community.

cshwone

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#2717505 3-Jun-2021 06:01

sbiddle:

cshwone:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/300322274/transtasman-bubble-only-20-per-cent-of-arrivals-scanned-for-fevers-at-our-biggest-airport

Complacency rules

Checking for temperatures is pointless and has been regarded as so for probably 12 months now. Unless somebody is actually highly symptomatic they are unlikely to have a fever.

Did you read the whole article? Particularly the arrival procedures in S.Australia. Makes us look like total amateurs.

kiwiharry

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#2717509 3-Jun-2021 07:35

Senecio:
Daynger:

I admit to slacking off on the scanning, only a few weeks ago as i felt like i was the only one still doing it, but with the outbreak in Melbourne i have started to scan again.

I still feel like im the only one doing it, i very rarely if ever see anyone doing it.

I've gone the other way. Not that I could increase my scanning as I've religiously scanned since the app was released. But rather making more of a point of it so as to shame those around me into scanning.

I was heartened the other day when I entered my local New World. An elderly gentlemen approached the QR code in front of me and pulled out his phone. He must have been late 80s if not early 90s. He had a little bit of trouble locating and opening the App but I waited patiently behind him and he got there in the end. Two people side stepped us and approached the entrance without scanning. He politely called them out, something to the effect of "If you can't be bothered to scan for yourself, at least go to the effort of scanning for me". It worked on one of them as they promptly took their phone out and scanned. The other just ignored his request.

If there are several people at the entrance all waiting to scan the QR code, I admit I do bypass that queue and hope there are either additional QR codes in the store or at the checkout counter, otherwise I try it again on exiting the store. If that fails I do a manual entry. I must say that probably about 5-10% of the time QR code doesn't get read by my phone, mainly due to reflections when code is behind glass, so again make manual entry.

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#2717511 3-Jun-2021 07:43

DS248:

Update on vaccination rates in NZ, AU & Singapore.

Perhaps more interesting is the differences in first and second doses given, largely due to AU using AZ, presumably with a ~12(?) wk gap between first and second dose.

While the proportion of the population that have received the first dose is 80% higher in AU than in NZ, only 2.1% there have received both doses vs 4.6% here in NZ.

First Second

NZ 8.5% 4.6%
AU 15.4% 2.1%
SG 38.7% 30.0%

Figures above are aggregate % of population vaccinated to 1 June.

Lots of graphs online seem to mixing and matching data and are not necessarily accurate. IMHO it's also a bit confusing looking at a % of total population vaccinated as most countries are only vaccinating adults so with differing percentages of under 16's it's not necessarily comparing apples with apples. I do wonder if some sources are not necessarily checking that data either.

In Australia's for example their health minister announced over a week ago they'd hit 20% of the adult population who had received their first dose. Looking at the updated Excel spreadsheet for NZ from yesterday we hit 432,509 people who have had their first dose which makes 10.8% of the adult population (based off a 16+ population in NZ of just on 4 million).

235,602 have had their second dose which is around 5.8% of the adult population.

A lot of people seemed to get excited yesterday about the headline that we're "ahead of schedule" and focusing on the total number of vaccines but ignoring the fact we're now needing significant numbers of doses for the 2nd doses as we ramp up so the actual numbers of people receiving their first dose isn't increasing as quickly as some might think.

Australia is moving fairly quickly to Pfizer before their Moderna orders arrive so the 2nd dose numbers will increase fairly quickly now.

sbiddle

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#2717514 3-Jun-2021 07:54

cshwone:

Did you read the whole article? Particularly the arrival procedures in S.Australia. Makes us look like total amateurs.

I typically don't read anything written by that journalist now due to the pointless rubbish he writes and his general lack of understanding of many things travel related.

But yes I did read it, and it doesn't change the fact he wrote an entire article based on temperature checks when these are well known to be essentially be security theatre.

There are lots of things we could do here, but temperature screening isn't one that we should put any focus on.

dafman

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#2717515 3-Jun-2021 08:07

sbiddle:

No it doesn't.. But we don't pay for the cost of people's plane flights home - why should we pay for their managed isolation?

An analogy.

For the same reason government's don't make new taxes retrospective.

But once the new tax is introduced, you are liable from that point forward.

Batman

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#2717814 3-Jun-2021 17:53

Kiwis can return from Melbourne next week

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300324342/covid19-victoria-travel-bubble-paused-but-government-will-allow-some-kiwis-to-travel-home-without-going-into-managed-isolation

freitasm

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#2717818 3-Jun-2021 17:59

Batman: Kiwis can return from Melbourne next week

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300324342/covid19-victoria-travel-bubble-paused-but-government-will-allow-some-kiwis-to-travel-home-without-going-into-managed-isolation

"Travellers on these flights would need to have returned a negative Covid-19 test within the last 72 hours, and sign a declaration saying they had not been in a place of interest."

Yeah, right.

Anyway, posting the release in the appropriate trans-tasman bubble thread.

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#2717836 3-Jun-2021 19:33

How the bubble was going to work was well spelled out.

The bubble worked as spelled out.

Punters complained, its not fair, Govt capitulated.

At a time when vaccine roll out is hardly rolling out.

They’re coming back with limited controls.

Nuts.

NZ = Taiwan, watch this space.

freitasm

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#2717837 3-Jun-2021 19:50

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#2717990 4-Jun-2021 00:32

freitasm:

Batman: Kiwis can return from Melbourne next week

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300324342/covid19-victoria-travel-bubble-paused-but-government-will-allow-some-kiwis-to-travel-home-without-going-into-managed-isolation

"Travellers on these flights would need to have returned a negative Covid-19 test within the last 72 hours, and sign a declaration saying they had not been in a place of interest."

Yeah, right.

Anyway, posting the release in the appropriate trans-tasman bubble thread.

I can't believe that we are again trusting people to do the right thing, when that is what lead NZ to go into the first lockdown. The entire point of the 14 day MIQ system is to prevent this as some people will lie. . There was a huge list of places of interest, so they could easily have missed one and just blame human error. Not only that, but many people seem to get it while in the process of travelling back. This new strain looks to be very contagious, and some people seem to have caught it simply after walking past another person, which suggesting it is more airborne than normal. I would hate to see NZ, which as a country is almost entirely unvaccinated except for a small percentage, start to get community transmissions occurring, with a far more contagious strain, and during the middle of winter.

tdgeek

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#2718090 4-Jun-2021 07:22

mattwnz:

I can't believe that we are again trusting people to do the right thing, when that is what lead NZ to go into the first lockdown. The entire point of the 14 day MIQ system is to prevent this as some people will lie. . There was a huge list of places of interest, so they could easily have missed one and just blame human error. Not only that, but many people seem to get it while in the process of travelling back. This new strain looks to be very contagious, and some people seem to have caught it simply after walking past another person, which suggesting it is more airborne than normal. I would hate to see NZ, which as a country is almost entirely unvaccinated except for a small percentage, start to get community transmissions occurring, with a far more contagious strain, and during the middle of winter.

We went into the first lockdown because of Covid on March 26 not because of not trusting people. other than that I agree with your post.

Stuck in Oz, the propensity is to say what the authorities want to hear so we can come back, phew.So much for the "you will need to manage being stuck there yourself" We will bail them out instead and take the risk. Ive never bought into the "luck" we have had being why we have done well in our response, but that what it is now. Red or Black, spin the wheel. I guess if the bubble is apparently a good idea given AUS and NZ are largely unvaccinated, I guess we will go from the No.1 country as was published by an overseas service last week, to another Japan, Hong Kong, Victoria before long. From now on its luck. Admittedly when we are all vaccinated and its endemic, the same will apply as regards those that didnt or can't get vaccinated, but at least today we have a choice how to contain the virus, but we choose luck

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