2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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Mad Scientist
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#2732853 22-Jun-2021 22:56

Dratsab:
freitasm: "New Zealand’s Quarantine Free Travel from New South Wales to New Zealand will be paused while the source of infection of new cases announced in Sydney is investigated, says COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins."

And quite by coincidence tonights SYD-WLG flight (NZ248) which was scheduled to land at 5 minutes past midnight is now scheduled to land at 11:30pm tonight.

It's not a coincidence. That's how it works. You make some rules then others find ways around it. AU PM managed to find loop holes to meet NZ PM last time there was a Victoria lockdown and he was in Victoria iirc.

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#2732856 22-Jun-2021 23:49

Covid case travelled between Sydney Wellington

https://mobile.twitter.com/NSWHealth/status/1407297025377406985

mattwnz

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#2732857 23-Jun-2021 00:16

Batman:

It's not a coincidence. That's how it works. You make some rules then others find ways around it. AU PM managed to find loop holes to meet NZ PM last time there was a Victoria lockdown and he was in Victoria iirc.

I hate how people try an take advantage of loopholes. It is so selfish. If NZ gets cases as a result of not locking down the bubble earlier, I hope there will be an enquiry into it. NZ should have shut the border days ago based on the community transmission occurring in NSW. It is false economy having the border open in the first place, as a another lockdown in NZ as a result of cases coming through isolation free travel will far outweigh any economic benefits, so it was something they had to do very carefully, and make sure it was shut when the risk levels rose. Not this late, but maybe we got too cocky. Also noone is scanning, I was the only person tonight at my supermarket I saw scanning. Some people though were wearing masks, but I don't think they ever stopped

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#2732862 23-Jun-2021 05:45

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125524093/covid19-positive-sydney-case-flew-to-wellington-for-weekend-passengers-on-flights-are-close-contacts

I sincerely hope NSW have advised NZ of the places of interest in Wellington from when the individual arrived to their departure. (And that we will do something about it)

Edit. The more I think about it, why haven't MOH reacted overnight to at least get the notifications out there. Some people who possibly should be isolating but are totally unaware may quite happily head to work, school, the supermarket etc this morning.

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#2732868 23-Jun-2021 07:01

Damn better buy 500 rolls of toilet paper.

freitasm

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#2732869 23-Jun-2021 07:01

Covid-19: Positive Sydney case flew to Wellington for weekend, passengers on flights are 'close contacts' | Stuff.co.nz

All passengers on the two flights between Wellington and Sydney – QF163 on June 19 and NZ 247 on June 21 – were considered close contacts.

The Ministry of Health said, based on the time of symptom onset and CT score, it was likely the traveller contracted the virus in Sydney prior to visiting New Zealand. Genome sequencing was under way in Australia to determine if the case was linked to the existing outbreak in Sydney.

Four close contacts in New Zealand had been identified by the Ministry of Health, all were isolating.

I must admit I did visit Sydney last month for a small media presentation. But I still think this bubble shouldn't exist.

Handle9

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#2732870 23-Jun-2021 07:03

Fred99:
Efficacy isn't easy to measure. UK public health claim that 1x Pfizer or AZ only offer 33% protection. They claim that 2 x Pfizer and 2 x AZ offer 88 and 60% respectively, 96 and 92% reduced chance of hospitalisation.

Either of those exceed expectations from less than a year ago of what they thought could be achieved.

Despite the jump in cases the UK aren't seeing significant jumps in hospitalisation or deaths. They are lagging indicators so not reliable in real time. It does seem very promising for the vaccines being effective in preventing servious harm with Delta.

Newcastle upon Tyne has had England's biggest week-on-week case rise, up from 116.6 to 236.4 per 100,000.

But the city's director of public health, Prof Eugene Milne, said almost two thirds of the new cases were among largely unvaccinated under-25s and it was not resulting in problems for the NHS.

"Only 1.4 per cent of cases in Newcastle are among the more vulnerable over-65s and, critically, these rising infection rates are not resulting in any rapid increase in hospitalisations," he said.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/22/flu-pneumonia-deaths-now-ten-times-higher-covid/ - paywalled article from the telegraph.

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#2732872 23-Jun-2021 07:20

cshwone:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125524093/covid19-positive-sydney-case-flew-to-wellington-for-weekend-passengers-on-flights-are-close-contacts

I sincerely hope NSW have advised NZ of the places of interest in Wellington from when the individual arrived to their departure. (And that we will do something about it)

Edit. The more I think about it, why haven't MOH reacted overnight to at least get the notifications out there. Some people who possibly should be isolating but are totally unaware may quite happily head to work, school, the supermarket etc this morning.

We already know that close contacts are isolating already.

They can't just release locations of interest without telling those locations first. We've already been through that saga and the consequences multiple times hence the reason the current policy in place.

I don't honestly see why anybody is panicking. Further CT in NZ always has been inevitable, and this certainly won't be our last ever case. Anybody who isn't prepared for this quite frankly has nobody to blame but themselves.

tdgeek

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#2732873 23-Jun-2021 07:28

mattwnz:

I hate how people try an take advantage of loopholes. It is so selfish. If NZ gets cases as a result of not locking down the bubble earlier, I hope there will be an enquiry into it. NZ should have shut the border days ago based on the community transmission occurring in NSW. It is false economy having the border open in the first place, as a another lockdown in NZ as a result of cases coming through isolation free travel will far outweigh any economic benefits, so it was something they had to do very carefully, and make sure it was shut when the risk levels rose. Not this late, but maybe we got too cocky. Also noone is scanning, I was the only person tonight at my supermarket I saw scanning. Some people though were wearing masks, but I don't think they ever stopped

Yep

Positive side is that MoH didnt cave into this bubble months and months and months ago when other political parties banged on about it. But they caved in

What economic benefits?? Tourists spend money here but our travellers spend it there. Net benefit is plus or minus bugger all. The only worthwhile benefit is friends and family contact.

On the one hand we bleat for the bubble that will save everything and on the other we bleat about the low vaccination rate. Given the time Covid has been around and a few months to complete vaccination, shoulda waited.

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#2732875 23-Jun-2021 07:34

sbiddle:

We already know that close contacts are isolating already.

They can't just release locations of interest without telling those locations first. We've already been through that saga and the consequences multiple times hence the reason the current policy in place.

I don't honestly see why anybody is panicking. Further CT in NZ always has been inevitable, and this certainly won't be our last ever case. Anybody who isn't prepared for this quite frankly has nobody to blame but themselves.

I dont see any panic. And CT will very much be inevitable when we have a bubble and we have outbreaks at the same time. There is CT over there currently shopping at Coles and probably here at New World. I dont get all the pages of threads over our very low MIQ issues when we blatantly accept the risk we do with a bubble that is not fit for purpose. Playing with fire.

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#2732876 23-Jun-2021 07:36

tdgeek:

mattwnz:

I hate how people try an take advantage of loopholes. It is so selfish. If NZ gets cases as a result of not locking down the bubble earlier, I hope there will be an enquiry into it. NZ should have shut the border days ago based on the community transmission occurring in NSW. It is false economy having the border open in the first place, as a another lockdown in NZ as a result of cases coming through isolation free travel will far outweigh any economic benefits, so it was something they had to do very carefully, and make sure it was shut when the risk levels rose. Not this late, but maybe we got too cocky. Also noone is scanning, I was the only person tonight at my supermarket I saw scanning. Some people though were wearing masks, but I don't think they ever stopped

Yep

Positive side is that MoH didnt cave into this bubble months and months and months ago when other political parties banged on about it. But they caved in

What economic benefits?? Tourists spend money here but our travellers spend it there. Net benefit is plus or minus bugger all. The only worthwhile benefit is friends and family contact.

On the one hand we bleat for the bubble that will save everything and on the other we bleat about the low vaccination rate. Given the time Covid has been around and a few months to complete vaccination, shoulda waited.

I look at the bubble and see the exact opposite. The last two months has shown there was absolutely no reason why we should not have had a bubble in place before Xmas. We faced the very same risks then as we do now, and have the exact same framework in place for dealing with outbreaks that was developed last year. I have zero idea why you think anybody "caved in".

Based on the scaremongering and panic from people this morning I'm really worried about how NZ is going to move forward. Further cases of CT are still inevitable, and somehow we think we've invincible and that they'll never happen.

I know I've said it many times before but I just don't know how many NZers who have the "we beat Covid" mentality are going to cope with the concept of an endemic virus that is going to harm and kill people for years to come once we open up borders and have vaccinated everybody that wants to be vaccinated.

freitasm

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#2732878 23-Jun-2021 07:38

sbiddle:

I don't honestly see why anybody is panicking. Further CT in NZ always has been inevitable, and this certainly won't be our last ever case. Anybody who isn't prepared for this quite frankly has nobody to blame but themselves.

Including those who don't scan the QR codes. Keep scanning the damn QR codes people.

freitasm

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#2732879 23-Jun-2021 07:45

sbiddle:

I look at the bubble and see the exact opposite. The last two months has shown there was absolutely no reason why we should not have had a bubble in place before Xmas. We faced the very same risks then as we do now, and have the exact same framework in place for dealing with outbreaks that was developed last year. I have zero idea why you think anybody "caved in".

Based on the scaremongering and panic from people this morning I'm really worried about how NZ is going to move forward. Further cases of CT are still inevitable, and somehow we think we've invincible and that they'll never happen.

I know I've said it many times before but I just don't know how many NZers who have the "we beat Covid" mentality are going to cope with the concept of an endemic virus that is going to harm and kill people for years to come once we open up borders and have vaccinated everybody that wants to be vaccinated.

The problem is that with borders closed we know where the cases can come from. With a bubble to Australia, we are dependent on these people coming here without "control" and most certainly not following scanning and tracing (yes, a generalisation but so be it).

And yes, the whole "bubble" was pressure from some people - mostly people interested in getting money out of tourists.

You can't rationalise it by saying "getting infected is inevitable". It's only sensible when vaccination rates are way higher than now.

tdgeek

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#2732880 23-Jun-2021 07:46

sbiddle:

I look at the bubble and see the exact opposite. The last two months has shown there was absolutely no reason why we should not have had a bubble in place before Xmas. We faced the very same risks then as we do now, and have the exact same framework in place for dealing with outbreaks that was developed last year. I have zero idea why you think anybody "caved in".

Based on the scaremongering and panic from people this morning I'm really worried about how NZ is going to move forward. Further cases of CT are still inevitable, and somehow we think we've invincible and that they'll never happen.

I know I've said it many times before but I just don't know how many NZers who have the "we beat Covid" mentality are going to cope with the concept of an endemic virus that is going to harm and kill people for years to come once we open up borders and have vaccinated everybody that wants to be vaccinated.

Yes but inevitability is a world apart when we risk MIQ issues compared to the risk of bubble outbreaks. The lag between being a carrier and being found positive is the concern, let alone those that fail or delay a test

I dont see scaremongering, its questions as to why since April 19 is the news continually there about AUS outbreaks, illicit sneaky border crossing and the risk.

Endemic is correct, thats another story. I dont see anyone going an about beating Covid. We have a border block that has proven to be very effective.Stadiums show that. When we open up the border fully, only to vaccinated travellers and we are all vaccinated here, thats for another day. Thats no justification to play roulette in a non vaccinated country where we allow non vaccinated arrivals

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#2732882 23-Jun-2021 07:49

freitasm:

And yes, the whole "bubble" was pressure from some people - mostly people interested in getting money out of tourists.

Not entirely. One of the key drivers of the bubble was actually to free up MIQ capacity, because with 40% (and growing) of the capacity being used for TT travel it was having a major impact. We had no capacity to create space for people such as essential workers.

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