2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2804052 30-Oct-2021 08:56

@tdgeek My daughter is a Doctor(MD)/Scientist(PhD) working in medical research overseas. I Facetimed with last night, She believes the experiment of living with Covid-19 is going to be a disaster. The Virus will mutate at a greater rate to a point where vaccines will struggle to keep up. The only real hope is effective treatments but just like treating the common cold and influenza these treatments are a very long time off and will not stop our medical infrastructure becoming overwhelmed globally. She believes the "opening up and living with it" is not based on any sound science, it is driven by dollars. The only answer at this time is separation of those with it from those without it be they vaccinated or not.

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#2804053 30-Oct-2021 09:19

With all due respect, she doesn't know that for sure. Nobody knows. Humans do what humans want to do, and we will adapt. I had prepared for my demise last year, still ever ready today.

Evolution means the human race will carry on. It is weird to me because all us evolutionists seem to not want evolution to do its thing and want to alter the course of the natural world.

MikeB4

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#2804054 30-Oct-2021 09:24

@Batman Of course she does not know for sure but she is better equipped than most to make a learned opinion. As for evolution, get real that occurs over thousands of years it does not occur in any measurable degree over a period of months or a few years. I am sorry evolution will not save us from Covid-19.

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#2804056 30-Oct-2021 09:33

Batman:

Evolution means the human race will carry on. It is weird to me because all us evolutionists seem to not want evolution to do its thing and want to alter the course of the natural world.

Evolution means death. That's why most of the species that have ever lived are extinct.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

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#2804057 30-Oct-2021 09:35

MikeB4:
@Batman Of course she does not know for sure but she is better equipped than most to make a learned opinion. As for evolution, get real that occurs over thousands of years it does not occur in any measurable degree over a period of months or a few years. I am sorry evolution will not save us from Covid-19.

Pfizer said they can make a new vaccine at the drop of a hat, so I'm pretty sure if that's what it takes that's going to happen.

arcon

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#2804059 30-Oct-2021 09:38

MikeB4:

@tdgeek My daughter is a Doctor(MD)/Scientist(PhD) working in medical research overseas. I Facetimed with last night, She believes the experiment of living with Covid-19 is going to be a disaster. The Virus will mutate at a greater rate to a point where vaccines will struggle to keep up. The only real hope is effective treatments but just like treating the common cold and influenza these treatments are a very long time off and will not stop our medical infrastructure becoming overwhelmed globally.

Well that's depressing. Molnupiravir is not too far away from having production scaled up globally, does she have thoughts on how that will help?

MikeB4

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#2804067 30-Oct-2021 09:59

Batman:
MikeB4:

@Batman Of course she does not know for sure but she is better equipped than most to make a learned opinion. As for evolution, get real that occurs over thousands of years it does not occur in any measurable degree over a period of months or a few years. I am sorry evolution will not save us from Covid-19.

Pfizer said they can make a new vaccine at the drop of a hat, so I'm pretty sure if that's what it takes that's going to happen.

I would love it if that were true but that sounds like something out of the marketing department following a plan to secure continuity of trade.

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#2804068 30-Oct-2021 10:03

huckster:

Batman: Sorry what get out clause? Cheers

Also if Auckland is on lockdown how hard is it to go door to door and bring the vaccine to people? It's not like they live miles apart away from civilization

That takes organisation and care. The fragile nature of mRNA vaccines is also a big factor. I discovered that the term "cold-chain" means today....

'cold chain refers to managing the temperature of perishable products in order to maintain quality and safety from the point of origin through the distribution chain to the final consumer'

mRNA needs to be really cold until close to point of use and then handled carefully.

The good news is that Pfizer have reformulated the Comirnaty pediatric vaccine for kids and the booster they have ready and both use the new formulation with a Tris buffer rather than the PBS buffer in the current vaccines that we have here. This means the shelf life is very different and the product can be stored in a normal refrigerator for up to 10 weeks.

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#2804069 30-Oct-2021 10:04

arcon:

]

Well that's depressing. Molnupiravir is not too far away from having production scaled up globally, does she have thoughts on how that will help?

She believes effective treatments hold more hope than vaccine but she also believes that vaccine at this time is one of the most powerful tools in the box but it is not a show stopper. Treatments are hard to develop for virus outbreaks and really we do not have a stellar track record with successful virus treatments. The hope now is that treatments will slow hospital and ECU admissions in order to slow collateral deaths.

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#2804071 30-Oct-2021 10:13

The Washington Post - Coronavirus Updates: FDA authorizes a vaccine for kids 5-11

breaking

On Friday, the Food and Drug Administration authorized Pfizer-BioNTech's vaccine for children 5 to 11 years old, nearly a year after the first shots were administered to adults.

The series is composed of two shots, three weeks apart, at a third of the dosage used for adolescents and adults. The shots are expected to roll out next week.

A clinical trial showed it was about 91 percent effective and didn't cause any serious complications.

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#2804123 30-Oct-2021 10:20

Great news regarding child vaccines. I have a nagging feeling though that these are going to be a hard sell.

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#2804128 30-Oct-2021 10:39

Good article on Stuff today about vaccinating kids.

Paediatric infectious disease specialist Tony Walls agrees. “The risk of severe disease in [healthy] children under 12 from Covid-19 is probably lower than from influenza. That does not apply for adults.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/126811054/covid19-should-we-vaccinate-the-kids

I'm fine with jabbing myself, I am 41 with some health problems and in group 3 I think I have a good chance of getting quite sick from C19. But my kids are very healthy and I'm not sure what benefit it has. The benefits of the vaccine increase with age.

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#2804132 30-Oct-2021 10:53

my family is vaccinated for everything under the sun. so i guess one more doesn't worry me too much. i tell them it's the same as training the immune system like they train for rocket league before a tournament.

tdgeek

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#2804135 30-Oct-2021 10:59

MikeB4:

@tdgeek My daughter is a Doctor(MD)/Scientist(PhD) working in medical research overseas. I Facetimed with last night, She believes the experiment of living with Covid-19 is going to be a disaster. The Virus will mutate at a greater rate to a point where vaccines will struggle to keep up. The only real hope is effective treatments but just like treating the common cold and influenza these treatments are a very long time off and will not stop our medical infrastructure becoming overwhelmed globally. She believes the "opening up and living with it" is not based on any sound science, it is driven by dollars. The only answer at this time is separation of those with it from those without it be they vaccinated or not.

Ok, what is the other option? Just leaves elimination, so Level 4 for NZ until it's gone. No one can come here for any reason. Imports can continue after the ships cargo has had 14 days to dissipate any virus. China enforcement of flouters and those a bit careless. All that will work, but is it a correct move?

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#2804138 30-Oct-2021 11:10

mattwnz:

I think part of the problem is that we are a victim of our success in eliminating covid last year. So we haven't seen the death that has been caused by Covid overseas, and some of these flouters just don't care about anyone but themselves. I have also heard many people say that Covid has only killed 28 people in the last year, and questioning how bad it actually is, when we know that it kills a lot of people overseas. It is only after people get sick or they see local cases, do people start to do the right thing again, but it then levels off again. This is proven by the spike in scanning, or spikes in vaccinations after a local case is detected in an area. I wonder if it also partly the 'ambulance at the bottom of the cliff thing' that NZ is good at. We are going to see quite a few daily deaths from covid in 2022, and hospitals full, and I don't think people realise this will happen. Long covid is also going to be a problem. But it will largely be an illness amongst the unvaccinated. We just have to look at other highly vaccinated countries to see how NZs numbers could look. I think we are going to be playing the traffic light game for a long time.

Just tell them to check the CDC website for the US mortality figures for 2020. 16% more people died last year in the US. Covid is the third highest recorded cause of death. If they care to dig deeper they will find that on average about 40,000 people die each year in the US from the flu. Last year 345,000 died from Covid in the US.

If they care to look there is plenty of evidence about the serious effects of Covid.

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