2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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1402 posts

Uber Geek

#2811345 11-Nov-2021 23:04

MileHighKiwi:
Forced vaccination is a step too far.

Every Russian born in Soviet Union in the last Century bears a scar on their left shoulder.
Nobody asked opinion of our mothers: "would you like your kid to be vaccinated, miss?"
They just did it.
And not one, but many vaccines.

MileHighKiwi

782 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#2811354 12-Nov-2021 06:55

RUKI: every Russian born in Soviet Union in the last Century bears a scar on their left shoulder

Ah, Russia, a bastion of democracy. I'd be inclined to take the jab too if the alternative was 24 months hard labor in a Siberian gulag.

I understand the sentiment, but it will never happen in a western democracy.

sbiddle

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#2811361 12-Nov-2021 07:25

mattwnz:

sbiddle:

We know right now that masks are going to be part of our life for the quite some time particularly in crowded indoor environments and on public transport. Once we move to green those requirement for masks are gone everywhere except for planes - so until we're at a point in the future where mask use is deemed unnecessary we aren't moving to green.

I think a lot of people are still really struggling to comprehend how difficult 2022 could well be for us all, particularly the first half of the year.

If masks are going to be an important tool, then surely we should be moving to proper medical masks which are better at reducing spread than cloth ones. Some of NZs experts have been calling for this change. Apparently the polypropylene medical ones can be washed 10 times and reused. Some peoples mask wearing is almost just taking the piss.

While surgical masks as a whole provide a better level of protection compared to a typical cloth mask they are still pretty average when compared to a properly fitted P2/N95/KN95 mask or a well fitted cloth mask with a P2/N95/KN95 insert filter.

SJB

2945 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#2811444 12-Nov-2021 09:12

MileHighKiwi:
RUKI: every Russian born in Soviet Union in the last Century bears a scar on their left shoulder

Ah, Russia, a bastion of democracy. I'd be inclined to take the jab too if the alternative was 24 months hard labor in a Siberian gulag.

I understand the sentiment, but it will never happen in a western democracy.

Never say never.

This is happening in Austria.

Covid: Austrians heading towards lockdown for unvaccinated - BBC News

Who would have thought, until recently, a democracy would try to stop a large number of their citizens from living the same way as everybody else in the country.

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2811451 12-Nov-2021 09:26

SJB:

Who would have thought, until recently, a democracy would try to stop a large number of their citizens from living the same way as everybody else in the country.

You mean how some daycares won't take kids who haven't had their immunisations?

cshwone

1070 posts

Uber Geek

#2811455 12-Nov-2021 09:34

GV27:

SJB:

Who would have thought, until recently, a democracy would try to stop a large number of their citizens from living the same way as everybody else in the country.

You mean how some daycares won't take kids who haven't had their immunisations?

Aren't over 12's a little bit old for daycare?

Edit. Just realised you weren't specifically talking about CV-19

SJB

2945 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#2811463 12-Nov-2021 09:43

GV27:

SJB:

Who would have thought, until recently, a democracy would try to stop a large number of their citizens from living the same way as everybody else in the country.

You mean how some daycares won't take kids who haven't had their immunisations?

That's not government mandated though is it?

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GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2811468 12-Nov-2021 09:59

SJB:

That's not government mandated though is it?

Does it matter? There isn't rioting in the street because some places won't let you expose your kids to insane risk of catching infectious diseases.

The point is we accept it as being not an outrageous assault on our kid's human rights.

Similar to how some countries require you to have immunisation certificates before you can enter.

This isn't a new thing, people crapping their pants because they're being asked to conform with something that isn't a new idea at all are totally beyond my comprehension.

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2811472 12-Nov-2021 10:12

Six cases in Taranaki, who weren't scanning and only got tested when they got the sickest they'd ever been before.

Colour this Aucklander unimpressed.

itxtme

2102 posts

Uber Geek

#2811473 12-Nov-2021 10:13

This is a confronting piece - https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-glen-eden-father-of-seven-dies-at-home-daughter-says-he-tried-to-get-help/BEKTBLTD3QY4FJEWHKCEJTPORQ/

The whole premise of phone assessments only is a massive clinical risk. Putting the onus on a family who is calling with concern to make medical decisions with no clinical assessment capabilities is madness. They seem to be taking a symptom only response. What about heart rates, what about blood pressures, what are the inflammatory markers indicating? More people will die at home if they are not going to be clinically assessed.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#2811479 12-Nov-2021 10:44

MileHighKiwi:
RUKI: every Russian born in Soviet Union in the last Century bears a scar on their left shoulder

Ah, Russia, a bastion of democracy. I'd be inclined to take the jab too if the alternative was 24 months hard labor in a Siberian gulag.

I understand the sentiment, but it will never happen in a western democracy.

There were no implied alternative as you suggested. Simply put, at that time people believed in what was right thing to do. They also had common goal of "building bright future" It was illusive, but they believed in it and worked hard to achieve set up goals at a time, meeting and exceeding expectations..

sbiddle

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#2811481 12-Nov-2021 10:50

itxtme:

This is a confronting piece - https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-glen-eden-father-of-seven-dies-at-home-daughter-says-he-tried-to-get-help/BEKTBLTD3QY4FJEWHKCEJTPORQ/

The whole premise of phone assessments only is a massive clinical risk. Putting the onus on a family who is calling with concern to make medical decisions with no clinical assessment capabilities is madness. They seem to be taking a symptom only response. What about heart rates, what about blood pressures, what are the inflammatory markers indicating? More people will die at home if they are not going to be clinically assessed.

The sad part of this is that we're realistically going to see more cases like this.

You have to give a massive amount of credit to Andrew Little for his TV interview on Wednesday where he admitted very frankly that the home isolation system is overwhelmed. It's just incredibly sad that rather than actually preparing our health system for this that the government chose to not to anything.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/11/health-minister-andrew-little-admits-home-isolation-system-wasn-t-ready-for-current-number-of-covid-cases.html

ezbee

2405 posts

Uber Geek

#2811490 12-Nov-2021 10:56

MileHighKiwi, RUKI

In New Zealand vaccination at school was common too. Probably UK, Aussie as well.
Back when one could see the odd child with a metal brace on their leg
as last remaining cases of Polio.
No one made an issue of it at my High School.
Nothing to do with political ideology , just necessity.

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2811491 12-Nov-2021 10:57

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/126931324/mandate-to-get-covid19-vaccination-not-a-breach-of-bill-of-rights-high-court-judge-rules

Justice Palmer dismissed their application and said mandatory vaccination fell within the scope of the Bill of Rights.

Owned.

alexx

867 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2811504 12-Nov-2021 11:36

SJB:
Never say never.

This is happening in Austria.

Covid: Austrians heading towards lockdown for unvaccinated - BBC News

Who would have thought, until recently, a democracy would try to stop a large number of their citizens from living the same way as everybody else in the country.

The people who are vaccinated get a reasonable degree of freedom and the people who aren't vaccinated get less. Arguably much fairer than a system where everyone in an entire region gets locked down except for anti-vaxxers, who protest in the Domain with very few consensuses.

Plus it's a partial lockdown, you can still shop for food/essentials, go to work and go out for exercise.

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