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sbiddle
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  #2824838 6-Dec-2021 07:12
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Handle9:

 

sbiddle:

 

Sup:

 

Just on the Aircraft thingy and the public transport system.

 

Planes have super duper air flow ventilation systems.

 

Buses and trains do not.

 

That is why of the thousands of flights coming into New Zealand carrying Covid, there is minimal on spread in a air cabin. And that included the old days....before pre departure testing, however there was some spread....long haul flights with your mask off to eat cannot prevent every infection.

 

 

And the one documented case of the Emirates plane to NZ was the subject of quite a few details articles in NZ media (one such example here from Newsroom and there was another written by Siouxsie Wiles that was in the Spinoff).

 

All theorised about how spread could have occured onboard, but presumably due to their lack of understanding of how aircraft operate didn't take in or mention a key aspect that was reported overseas and that was that the APU was switched off something like 30 mins while the plane was on the ground refuelling at Kuala Lumpur. Nobody left the plane during this time, and the significance of the APU being shut down is that there would have been no air circulating in the cabin which is clearly the perfect scenario for spread.

 

 

Not necessarily. If it was on a GPU and PCA stand, which is when the APU is normally switched off, then that is taken over by airport supply.

 

 

In this case there it was confirmed no A/C was running for ~30 mins of the 2 hour ground stop for refuelling in one of the reports into this... So it really was the perfect scenario for spread being stuck in a plane with no moving air!

 

 

 

 

 

 




freitasm
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  #2824840 6-Dec-2021 07:33
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@Sup:

 

Handle9:

 

I'd suggest you stop on the politics now.

 

 

I will take that under advisement. Covid is the enemy here. Some people have opinions, others have a health advisory, that is probably the relative weighting for each of us consider in these calls to scrap MIQ and Green light Auckland right now.

 

Auckland is red because it has been a very long tail. And even though we are living with Covid, we need to raise the temperature slowly on the whole thing.

 

 

Please take it seriously. Politics is not allowed in this thread. There's a specific thread in the Politics sub-forum here: The politicisation of NZ's covid response (geekzone.co.nz)

 

Posting politics will lead to account being locked out of this topic.





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Batman

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  #2824848 6-Dec-2021 08:18
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All our politicians now fully vaxxed. Good for setting example.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-90-project-all-new-zealands-mps-are-now-fully-vaccinated/SXI4Z6B74SAXITMDYEGOX36S44/

Sorry I just read the post above this... Oops lol ;)



freitasm
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  #2824849 6-Dec-2021 08:23
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@Batman: All our politicians now fully vaxxed. Good for setting example.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-90-project-all-new-zealands-mps-are-now-fully-vaccinated/SXI4Z6B74SAXITMDYEGOX36S44/

Sorry I just read the post above this... Oops lol ;)

 

 

The post is not about politics but policy. I am surprised you being one of the most active in this topic have not seen the many warnings.

 

A reminder that it comes without warnings. 

 

"Ain't Nobody Got Time For That"

 





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Scott3
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  #2824869 6-Dec-2021 09:30
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I understand that the last segment in the youtube video was first posted on December 1.

Dec 3 update on her facebook page:

 

"Day 17 in Covid today 
Day 15 news was my oxygen levels sat at 80% my lungs deflated I was struggling to get them up 
Plan of attack is to sleep on my stomach for at least 2 hours a day this opens up my lungs from the back FUNFACT most of your back is where your 🫁 majority sits the least is in from by the ribcage..
Doing this bought my oxygen levels down to 50% huge improvement its still a slow process Docs say but its progress 
@37 years of age 2 options 
DO OR DIE 
Well diing isnt an option now is it 🙄
FF to this morning I just had my morning asthma pump and  usually its hard for me to do a deep inhale without it being sore but it wasnt so sore this morning the pain is like a knife piercing my throat when i deeply inhale.. usually today was about out of 10 a 7 so much easier..
I am trialing this covid meds for the docs atm which mayaswell guinea pig me 🤷🏽‍♀️
I have had so much time to think in here its not funny lol 
I have been reflecting on all the beautiful people I have growin to love and known all my life that when a tragedy hit I had nothing but love surrounding myself and whanau there was never any room for animosity to enter this beautiful bubble I have surrounded my whanau and I with
THANK YOU FOR ALL THE THOUGHTS THE PRAYERS THE CONSTANT LOVE MESSAGES PHOTOS THOUGHTS 
I AM HUMBLED AND WILL NEVER FORGET ANY OF YOU EVER MY ARMS AND DOORS ALWAYS WILL AND ARE OPEN 
MORENA WHANAU ITS A GREAT DAY"

 

May be an image of 1 person

 

 

 

Absolute credit to her, for sharing all this stuff this publicly. I don't think I would be brave enough to do so. I wish her the best.

 


Sup:

 

Scott3:

 

Hamilton mother Karina Haira, has (pretty bravely I think) disclosed her identity provided what I think is the most detailed & gripping personal account of being sick with covid-19 delta strain in NZ.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkFOSvvvDuo

 

 

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/12/new-zealand-mother-claimed-her-covid-wasn-t-as-bad-as-the-flu-now-she-can-t-breathe-without-oxygen.html

 

 

 

Amazing woman.

 

I thought at the start of the video that I was looking at someone who had recovered from Covid (I missed the day six thing). So based on watching her have to take big breaths between speech I thought, well lady you look like your lungs copped a bit a of hiding.

 

Not knowing at the time that in fact i was looking at someone on the way down.

 

Scary to count her Resps in bed there while talking, the flushed face, nasal O2 in situ, looks stable. The anticoagulant therapy, pretty serious stuff.

 

You can see how by watching her breathing, that if she was not on oxygen, and still at home, that she wold probably be toast.

 

Ahh ok she just took out the Nasal high flow therapy as I type....and cripes this is a patient in the acute phase of Respiratory failure. 

 

Not good not good.

 

 

 

 

Absolutely. Likewise, I initially watched the youtube video without knowing what it contained. Likewise assumed the first segment was as bad as it was going to get - but how wrong was I.

 

Pretty hard (but griping) to watch what she was going through. Her removing the high flow nasal thing was quite telling.


wellygary
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  #2824906 6-Dec-2021 10:23
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Scott3:

 

Absolutely. Likewise, I initially watched the youtube video without knowing what it contained. Likewise assumed the first segment was as bad as it was going to get - but how wrong was I.

 

Pretty hard (but griping) to watch what she was going through. Her removing the high flow nasal thing was quite telling.

 

 

it is videos like this that will do the most to persuade the "hesitant" that COVID is real and the vaccination is the best preventative, 

 

 

 

The daily run of cases around 100 is also very positive, High vax rates are slowing the spread of embers as they leave Auckland, 

 

If we can get cases down further maybe 50-70 before the 09 border opens  it would be a great result...


quickymart
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  #2824910 6-Dec-2021 10:27
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If she gets the vaccine after she recovers. she'll be protected still, right? Or is the protection best/strongest for people who have never had coronavirus?


 
 
 

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Scott3
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  #2824915 6-Dec-2021 10:32
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quickymart:

 

If she gets the vaccine after she recovers. she'll be protected still, right? Or is the protection best/strongest for people who have never had coronavirus?

 

 

 

 

I think the protection from the vaccination stacks on top of natural immunity from the virus itself.

 

Vaccination is recommended even after infection. Boris Johnson & Donald trump are high profile examples that got vaccinated even though they got infected.

 

Obviously better if the vaccination comes prior to the infection, to minimise potential harm...

 

 

 

In NZ, having been infected with covid-19 doesn't make you eligible for a vaccine pass. (but you can get a temporary exemption while you infection is acute).


DS248
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  #2824917 6-Dec-2021 10:34
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quickymart:

 

If she gets the vaccine after she recovers. she'll be protected still, right? Or is the protection best/strongest for people who have never had coronavirus?

 

 

Most research I have seen shows the combination of prior infection + vaccine provides higher levels of antibodies etc than either alone.

 

Of course, you need to survive the prior infection.  And the vaccine will not fix any Long Covid health impacts from a prior infection.


Batman

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  #2824918 6-Dec-2021 10:41
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quickymart:

If she gets the vaccine after she recovers. she'll be protected still, right? Or is the protection best/strongest for people who have never had coronavirus?



If you are going to play the all blacks how many training camps will you need?

If you are going to face coronavirus, how many training sessions will you give your immune system?

tieke
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  #2824941 6-Dec-2021 11:11
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DS248:

 

...Of course, you need to survive the prior infection.  And the vaccine will not fix any Long Covid health impacts from a prior infection.

 

 

While it can't take away many Long Covid symptoms, it can sometimes have a beneficial effect.

 

Jez Brown's Living with Long Covid, found on this page was written in August, and is a great first-person example of the long-term effects Covid can have. I found it really interesting and extremely well written, and one of the things I remember is that he did have an improvement in some of those symptoms after an Astra-Zenaca shot. 


Sup

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  #2824969 6-Dec-2021 11:49
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DS248:

 

quickymart:

 

If she gets the vaccine after she recovers. she'll be protected still, right? Or is the protection best/strongest for people who have never had coronavirus?

 

 

Most research I have seen shows the combination of prior infection + vaccine provides higher levels of antibodies etc than either alone.

 

Of course, you need to survive the prior infection.  And the vaccine will not fix any Long Covid health impacts from a prior infection.

 

 

What we need to know is whether this process works in the reverse sequence i.e. a vaccinated person who catches Covid in a break through event.

 

This is the likely answer to the pandemic long term hey.

 

For a time, people like Karina in the video, who get Covid, and then get vaccinated, develop the strongest immunity possible, by some distance.

 

A so called super immunity, or as most scientists seem to describe it, hybrid immunity.

 

A recent article in Nature describes how the precise mechanism is still a mystery, however there is a dramatic rise in antibody production and this includes B cells, which are able to deal with mutations across all Corona viruses it is thought.

 

In vitro studies using a gain of function viral technique to test hybrid immunity against a Frankenstein version of Covid spike protein (20 induced mutations)  was published in Nature in September.

 

The Frankenstein Virus escaped antibodies from vaccination, and from natural immunity, however it could not maintain resistance against hybrid immunity in the study participants.

 

This is where a pan immunity to all Corona viruses were seen.

 

There is speculation that this is what we may see from the third vaccine shot, which we know confers many times higher antibody production than two shots.

 

What is hoped, is that the six month dose interval mirrors the window of time and marries up with the prompting of the immune system seen in hybrid immunity, whereby the lymph nodes go into aggressive overdrive and produce much higher loads of antigen specific B cells and therefore have a broad spectrum blocking of the Corona virus family.

 

This is all of course if the B cell theory is correct, even though it seems clear from in vitro studies which used isolated B cells against the virus, however as I am sure we have all learned, the immune system is complex and works based off complex interrelationships of its many branches and layers.

 

Indeed in some ways this would be the holy grail of medicine, a cure for the common cold.....well there are many holy grails in medicine...most grail quests dreamed of in labs are in search of the cure for the big C.

 

Part of the reason that we have not collated as much data on the immune system, and how it responds to the sequence of Vaccine first then break through infection, is that beak through infections on a large scale, are relatively new.

 

It is easier to track people who have a predictable variable....such as these hybrid immune people....who you can look at sample groups...based off the timing of their Covid shot following infection, a nice controlled variable.

 

Break through sequences throw out more independent variable challenges, especially the baseline immune function of individual participants.

 

There is obviously a correlation between known impaired immunity and the incidence of these break throughs....so we are talking about something that is a bit trickier.





Just keep swimming...


Scott3
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  #2824970 6-Dec-2021 11:52
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'Worrying': Omicron doctor reveals variant's terrible toll on kids, teen's death

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/covid-19-omicron-outbreak-children-hospitalised-with-moderate-to-severe-symptoms/QCNS4VJU3H2WEN3UOJU5PEZXYM/

 

 

 

Obviously still limited info around this, but it seems that initial indications of Omicron being mild, may be false (or at least it may be serious enough to overload hospitals).

 

Positive news is that anecdotally, "all" the 12 - 18 year old children hostilities were not vaccinated despite being eligable. Suggests that the vaccine may be effective against the hospitalization from the omicron strain.


Sup

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  #2824972 6-Dec-2021 11:53
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Please take it seriously. Politics is not allowed in this thread. There's a specific thread in the Politics sub-forum here: The politicisation of NZ's covid response (geekzone.co.nz)

 

Posting politics will lead to account being locked out of this topic.

 

Thanks for the warning, again apologies for creating extra work. Thanks for the link too. I think I will stay out of there for the same reason I should not have posted in here the same theme, these arguments are very circular and they tend to overwhelm the focus on the pandemic.





Just keep swimming...


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