2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2469145 24-Apr-2020 12:03

https://www.france24.com/en/20200423-sunlight-destroys-coronavirus-quickly-says-us-agency

"Our most striking observation to date is the powerful effect solar light appears to have on killing the virus on both surfaces and in the air"

...

"It showed that the virus's half life -- the time taken for it to reduce to half its amount -- was 18 hours when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees Fahrenheit (21 to 24 degrees Celsius) with 20 percent humidity on a non-porous surface.

This includes surfaces like door handles and stainless steel.

But the half-life dropped to six hours when humidity rose to 80 percent -- and just two minutes when sunlight was added to the equation.

When the virus was aerosolized -- meaning suspended in the air -- the half-life was one hour when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees with 20 percent humidity.

In the presence of sunlight, this dropped to just one and a half minutes."

Not really surprising (nor new) re sunlight. It was being strongly promoted in 1918.

Technofreak

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#2469149 24-Apr-2020 12:10

kobiak:

Travelling within NZ is not as bad as it seems when you compare to other countries aka Europe (our entertainment and attractions mostly reasonable priced, including food), but there's one fundamental problem: accomodation. Or should I say lack of it. During any public holiday or summer months, if you did not book 3-4 months in advance - you are out of luck or pay ridiculous fees.

Visite south island over xmas holidays 3 times now and every time accomodation is nightmare to find. 3 years ago on Xmas eve and Xmas day we had to travel from ChCh to west coast because there was no accommodation available between ChCh (we did not want to stay in the city) and Mt Cook for under $1000 a night.

Winter in Queenstown, I would not comment on flights fees (midweek 2k return for 2 is ridiculous as it seems in August) but accomodation, nothing under $300-400 a night in hotels/motels (2 adults). AirBnB helped, but still just under $200/night for an ensuite room. We lived next to 2 motels which were empty as. But trip to ski fields was cheap as chips including rentals.

I hope attitude would change in favour of price flexibility, if they want my money.

It's been this way for about 4 to 5 years in a lot of areas. Tourism growth (particularly international) outstripped growth in accommodation. I think you'll find the Covid-19 international travel restrictions will fixed the availability problem for you and prices will have to come back if they want to attract what the average kiwi will be able to afford in the short to medium future.

Without kiwis and to some extent Aussies they will have no patrons for at least 12 months and then the increase will be most likely slow due to people being gun shy of international travelling and the economic hit many of our tourism sources will have taken.

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#2469152 24-Apr-2020 12:12

DS248:
https://www.france24.com/en/20200423-sunlight-destroys-coronavirus-quickly-says-us-agency

"Our most striking observation to date is the powerful effect solar light appears to have on killing the virus on both surfaces and in the air"

...

"It showed that the virus's half life -- the time taken for it to reduce to half its amount -- was 18 hours when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees Fahrenheit (21 to 24 degrees Celsius) with 20 percent humidity on a non-porous surface.

This includes surfaces like door handles and stainless steel.

But the half-life dropped to six hours when humidity rose to 80 percent -- and just two minutes when sunlight was added to the equation.

When the virus was aerosolized -- meaning suspended in the air -- the half-life was one hour when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees with 20 percent humidity.

In the presence of sunlight, this dropped to just one and a half minutes."

Not really surprising (nor new) re sunlight. It was being strongly promoted in 1918.

I was wondering about hanging used facemasks on the washing line for a week in the sun.

Sounds plausible as a disinfectant ?

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#2469159 24-Apr-2020 12:24

SepticSceptic:

I was wondering about hanging used facemasks on the washing line for a week in the sun.

Sounds plausible as a disinfectant ?

I've often heard it said, "Sunlight is a great disinfectant." Though now I think about it, the term may have been used in a different context. :)

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ezbee

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#2469161 24-Apr-2020 12:26

Globally PPE is a big problem.
UK's attempt to extract from Turkish company who promised PPE on 50% deposit, sending military aircraft, flew back mostly empty.

Canada is desperately seeking PPE, and hit by the problems getting acceptable quality.
Latest in a list of countries hit by this.
https://www.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/3081335/coronavirus-canada-says-1-million-k95-masks-china

USA has blocked export and has accepted PPE aid from other countries, and created a bidding war as states compete with each other
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/04/18/coronavirus-creates-ppe-bidding-war-states-like-illinois-new-york/5144652002/

This article from Hong Kong gives a review of the money printing empire PPE supply has become. Wild west of PPE.
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3080378/coronavirus-inside-chinas-wild-west-where-mask-machines-are

I get a bit nervous about our press conferences that bat away PPE problems, maybe we are especially lucky in being able to get supply when others can't ?
Though our severity of lock-down and extension has reduced our PPE consumption , if we had 10's K more patents in isolation.

To return services as we move down the from Level 4 to 3, and to 2 etc we are going to need to consume more PPE.

Testing centers will still burn PPE.
Elective Surgery returns to work, those workers will add to PPE requirements.
Dentists, will also need PPE they have not needed before this.
Your Doctor as more patients return for normal business more PPE.
Emergency workers as we return to more normal accident levels.
More factory workers working close together , especially in food, lower level PPE , but PPE none the less.
ETC.

While I admit getting distracted by the technical challenge of the Ventilator thing, its relatively modest MFG technology PPE thats more of a critical issue it seems.

debo

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#2469168 24-Apr-2020 12:33

SepticSceptic: I was wondering about hanging used facemasks on the washing line for a week in the sun.

Sounds plausible as a disinfectant ?

Takes too long. just pop them into the oven for 30 mins at 100ish.

UVC is great for disinfectant. The new 222nm tubes don't affect skin or eyes unlike the older, more common 254nm tubes (at the shorter wavelength it cannot penetrate the dead skin layer.

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#2469170 24-Apr-2020 12:34

SepticSceptic:

I was wondering about hanging used facemasks on the washing line for a week in the sun.

Sounds plausible as a disinfectant ?

It does. Probably not the UV but drying out the sac the virus lives in. metal or plastic it can last 3 days, cardboard 1 day as the sac dries out. Sunlight would dry it out real quick.

Batman

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#2469230 24-Apr-2020 12:51

DS248:
Batman: everybody is working on Covid. inc VU in Wellington

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/nz-scientist-behind-frontrunner-covid-19-treatment

Hmm, "... human trials in Brazil".

Yup

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#2469240 24-Apr-2020 12:55

DS248:

https://www.france24.com/en/20200423-sunlight-destroys-coronavirus-quickly-says-us-agency

"Our most striking observation to date is the powerful effect solar light appears to have on killing the virus on both surfaces and in the air"

...

"It showed that the virus's half life -- the time taken for it to reduce to half its amount -- was 18 hours when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees Fahrenheit (21 to 24 degrees Celsius) with 20 percent humidity on a non-porous surface.

This includes surfaces like door handles and stainless steel.

But the half-life dropped to six hours when humidity rose to 80 percent -- and just two minutes when sunlight was added to the equation.

When the virus was aerosolized -- meaning suspended in the air -- the half-life was one hour when the temperature was 70 to 75 degrees with 20 percent humidity.

In the presence of sunlight, this dropped to just one and a half minutes."

Not really surprising (nor new) re sunlight. It was being strongly promoted in 1918.

I'm aware of some discussion of this in medical circles in NZ and Australia. The joke started a few weeks ago that both countries are doing so well because of the Ozone hole!

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#2469252 24-Apr-2020 13:01

Press release:

The Government is protecting the integrity of New Zealand businesses correctly accessing the wage subsidy by prioritising the audit process for businesses where complaints have been laid.

A dedicated MSD investigations team is working with IRD and MBIE to ensure businesses using the scheme as intended are not undermined by the actions of a few, Finance Minister Grant Robertson and Social Development Minister Carmel Sepuloni say.

The scheme has paid out $10.4 billion to protect jobs and support the incomes of over 1.6 million New Zealanders. This has kept businesses connected to their workers during the lockdown, so they are in a good position to start up on the other side.

“We moved quickly to get support in place for businesses and workers early by designing a high-trust model for the wage subsidy to get money out the door,” Grant Robertson said.

“We knew the vast majority of New Zealand business owners would access the scheme as intended, to protect jobs, support workers’ wages and stay connected during the lockdown. It’s great to see these business owners doing right by their workers.

“We owe it to those workers and employers to make sure their good work isn’t undermined by anyone abusing the scheme. We also have a duty to all New Zealanders to ensure taxpayer money is going where it is intended to support the economy.”

From the start, applicants were told they would have to repay the subsidy if they provided false or misleading information in their application. They were also told they may be subject to civil proceedings for the recovery of any amount received that they were not entitled to, and/or prosecuted for offences under the Crimes Act 1961.

Assurance and audit processes put in place by MSD to support this work are overseen by a team of 104 fraud experts and investigators. The audit process will identify cases that may require investigation. So far:

MSD has completed 2,435 random and targeted audits. 2,252 of these have been resolved and additional reviews of 183 cases are being undertaken.
292 allegations have been received. MSD has resolved 88 of these allegations, with the balance still being worked on. As at 20 April, 1,170 complaints and allegations had been received across MSD, MBIE and IRD.
As at 21 April, 1,281 applicants had voluntarily advised they want to refund all or part of the subsidy. This has led to $16.2m of refunds requested and $6.9m has already been refunded.
As at 21 April our auditing had resulted in 56 applicants being asked to refund either all or part of their subsidy. A total of $1.25m has been requested from these applicants with $168,000 already refunded.
Any criminal prosecutions will be led by MSD in collaboration with other agencies.

“The vast majority of businesses are doing the right thing and don’t need to worry about the audit process,” Carmel Sepuloni said.

“For some businesses, circumstances change following receipt of the subsidy, including where insurance may have been received, or new revenue forecasts show the business won’t suffer a 30% drop. A number of businesses have come forward when this happens by offering to repay the subsidy, and we encourage any business who may have made a mistake to do the same.

“But New Zealand taxpayers and those who have accessed the scheme properly expect to see a fair process. If a business provides false or misleading information and knowingly commits a crime, they will held to account. That’s a given.”

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#2469256 24-Apr-2020 13:04

Five new cases today (two confirmed plus three probable). One death (Christchurch).

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#2469263 24-Apr-2020 13:22

freitasm:

Five new cases today (two confirmed plus three probable). One death (Christchurch).

Elimination is going to take a while. We seem to be stuck at around the 5 per day mark.

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#2469269 24-Apr-2020 13:24

I had to go to work yesterday and drove past a cemetery on my way home where there was probably 15 to 20 cars parked at the gates. I had to wonder what was going on and whether or not any bubbles were being burst.

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#2469271 24-Apr-2020 13:31

ezbee:

Globally PPE is a big problem.
UK's attempt to extract from Turkish company who promised PPE on 50% deposit, sending military aircraft, flew back mostly empty.

Canada is desperately seeking PPE, and hit by the problems getting acceptable quality.
Latest in a list of countries hit by this.
https://www.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/3081335/coronavirus-canada-says-1-million-k95-masks-china

USA has blocked export and has accepted PPE aid from other countries, and created a bidding war as states compete with each other
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/04/18/coronavirus-creates-ppe-bidding-war-states-like-illinois-new-york/5144652002/

This article from Hong Kong gives a review of the money printing empire PPE supply has become. Wild west of PPE.
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3080378/coronavirus-inside-chinas-wild-west-where-mask-machines-are

I get a bit nervous about our press conferences that bat away PPE problems, maybe we are especially lucky in being able to get supply when others can't ?
Though our severity of lock-down and extension has reduced our PPE consumption , if we had 10's K more patents in isolation.

To return services as we move down the from Level 4 to 3, and to 2 etc we are going to need to consume more PPE.

Testing centers will still burn PPE.
Elective Surgery returns to work, those workers will add to PPE requirements.
Dentists, will also need PPE they have not needed before this.
Your Doctor as more patients return for normal business more PPE.
Emergency workers as we return to more normal accident levels.
More factory workers working close together , especially in food, lower level PPE , but PPE none the less.
ETC.

While I admit getting distracted by the technical challenge of the Ventilator thing, its relatively modest MFG technology PPE thats more of a critical issue it seems.

You don't just buy PPE. You send armed guards to make sure your shipment boards the plane. This is how we did it. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120945873/coronavirus-armed-guards-hired-to-protect-ppe-destined-for-kiwi-frontline-workers

We also had some very smart rich people who helped the country at the start. Hopefully the country will pick up from where they left off, I think that is happening. MOH gives updates on the country's PPE stockpile regularly. https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120912415/coronavirus-how-tindall-morgan-and-fyfe-worked-to-ready-country-for-covid19-fight

GV27

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#2469274 24-Apr-2020 13:34

I suspect next week is going to a bit of a free-for-all for the first few days. It will be interesting to see where case numbers are at two weeks later, given that the lockdown apparently took two weeks to take effect.

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