Nissan LEAF - General

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#2329982 5-Oct-2019 11:54

Good video debunking "Auto Expert" John Cadogan's video Nissan Leaf 'don't buy' warning ($33k battery replacement bill)

Low end replacement quote
US $8,500
AU $12,500

High end replacement cost
US $10,000
AU $14,800

Australian quote
63% of new 2012 Leaf car price.
perhaps crooks / didn't know about Nissan subsidy
US $22,300
AU $33,000

GV27

5979 posts

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#2329991 5-Oct-2019 12:23

Here's the thing: A fuel pump for a 2007 Mini Cooper S is apparently $2k. Why? Because it's an older car and no one holds that stock anymore. Poor part availability and high prices for out-of-production models isn't a reason to completely abandon the internal combustion engine as a concept.

The red flag should have been raised when the supposed price of the battery replacement is more than the 2nd hand Gen 2 2017-on Leaf. You know, for the whole car. You can have one of those for $40K.

kingdragonfly

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#2330011 5-Oct-2019 13:24

I know Nissan has very little incentive, but it would be nice for a manufacturer to make the power/battery management application interface known.

That way in 20 years, people can replace their batteries with OEM parts.

I'm not saying make the entire modules open-source. Just publish what's needed to communicate.

It's not unprecedented. From WIki:

A Controller Area Network (CAN bus) is a robust vehicle bus standard designed to allow microcontrollers and devices to communicate with each other in applications without a host computer. It is a message-based protocol, designed originally for multiplex electrical wiring within automobiles to save on copper, but can also be used in many other contexts.

...The [CAN BUS] OBD-II standard has been mandatory for all cars and light trucks sold in the United States since 1996. The EOBD standard has been mandatory for all petrol vehicles sold in the European Union since 2001 and all diesel vehicles since 2004.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN_bus

DimaExtreema

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Flip the Fleet

#2331300 6-Oct-2019 09:30

Jeeves:

afe66: Now you've got the dongle sign up with flip the fleet which enables you to keep track of trends but also compare with other nz leafs.

Just be aware that they don't follow NZ Spam laws and do not have an unsubscribe link or instructions on how to unsubscribe in their emails. I've had to resort to marking it as spam to stop the emails.

Hi Jeeves - I'm Dima, co-founder of Flip The Fleet. Afe66 has passed your comment on to me via an email channel. Sorry to read what you have wrote! You're partially correct, but we're not breaking any laws....

Flip The Fleet operates two types of emails: Transactional, and, Marketing.

Transactional: these are the core emails used by the project to communicate with you. For example, if you forget your password and reset it - you'll receive a transactional email. A reminder to contribute your data (i.e. the reminder to do the core part of the project, it's main objective) is transactional. When you email yourself a report from within the system - that's a transactional email. It's like receiving your invoice from a phone company by email - those are transactional too. For obvious reasons, you can't unsubscribe from those - otherwise, the service can't reach you. How do you receive a password reset link by email if you've unsubscribed?

Marketing: these are optional emails, like our monthly driver updates, and, one-click surveys. There's an unsubscribe button nice and big on each one of those. We just haven't sent any out recently...

So - if you wish to exit the project - I'm more than happy to deactivate your account. Most people that can't participate any more (lost the passion, moved overseas, sold their EV, etc) just email me and say "Can you please remove my account, I no longer wish to participate". Please flick me an email by replying to any of our notifications and we'll take care of it for you :)

Again, sorry to cause a negative response for you. It's not our intention at all... Dima

TheMungus

24 posts

Geek
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#2331439 6-Oct-2019 16:42

Hi all - we have a 2011 imported LEAF which we use around town. It’s a great car, bar the obvious range limitations and uncertainty around battery replacement down the road. I don’t have LEAFSpy yet but still have a 10 bar (possibly 9, I need to look) pack.

What I do need is an English stereo conversion. If anyone knows where I can get this done (I’m in the Manawatu) and how much it’s likely to cost, I’d be grateful!

jonathan18

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#2331578 6-Oct-2019 21:58

I had the dealer (in Taupo) swap the head unit for a US model before he sent the car down (I also live in the Manawatu). Think that cost $700.

Here’s a thread that discusses the conversion of the Japanese head units:

https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=162&topicid=248688

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TheMungus

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Geek
+1 received by user: 3

#2331581 6-Oct-2019 22:00

jonathan18:
I had the dealer (in Taupo) swap the head unit for a US model before he sent the car down (I also live in the Manawatu). Think that cost $700.

Here’s a thread that discusses the conversion of the Japanese head units:

https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=162&topicid=248688

Many thanks! Now, if only I was confident I could make it to Taupo between fast chargers...

bazdakiwi

2 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2331698 7-Oct-2019 08:30

EVs Enhanced in Christchurch can do SD card based English conversions on these cars. You can do the conversion at home. They are $569

baplaski

28 posts

Geek
+1 received by user: 7

#2331754 7-Oct-2019 10:40

TheMungus: Hi all - we have a 2011 imported LEAF which we use around town. It’s a great car, bar the obvious range limitations and uncertainty around battery replacement down the road. I don’t have LEAFSpy yet but still have a 10 bar (possibly 9, I need to look) pack.

What I do need is an English stereo conversion. If anyone knows where I can get this done (I’m in the Manawatu) and how much it’s likely to cost, I’d be grateful!

Do you have an S model Leaf? If so, you can just swap out the stereo. If it's one of the other models there are a couple of people who have just started doing stereo conversions for about $500ish. Your best bet will probably be Steve from Drive EV, as he tours around doing firmware upgrades and things (I recently had him do a firmware update/dash conversion in Wellington).

Edit - I'm wrong, you can get it done via the post - https://drive-ev-ltd.myshopify.com/collections/nissan-leaf-2011-2012-ze0-gen-1/products/nissan-leaf-english-language-conversion-for-2011-2015-x-and-g-head-units

wellygary

8828 posts

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#2331769 7-Oct-2019 11:04

Speaking of Leafs, with the September EV registration data out an interesting trend is emerging... "Peak Leaf"

For the last 2 quarters (2019 Q2 and Q3), imports of used leafs from Japan have been lower than a year earlier..

in 2018 Q2,866 used leafs were registered, in 2019 it was 852,

in 2018 Q3 it was 935.... in 2019 Q3 it was 883....

On the other hand, sales (and imports) of new EVs are growing significantly. albeit from a low base .. and this was evident even before the model 3 flood in the last 2 months)

Jeeves

301 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 90

#2331784 7-Oct-2019 11:23

I'd say that's because the NZ second hand market is now starting to mature and a lot of people who want a leaf can now get an ok one that is not NZ new anymore, thus no need to have one imported. I'm not far off from selling my leaf, which I bought for $15k with 12 bars almost 2 years ago. It's down to 10 bars, and has only lost 13 or so real world KM in capacity, and I think I'll be lucky to get $9k for it.

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Jeeves

301 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 90

#2331789 7-Oct-2019 11:27

DimaExtreema:

Jeeves:

afe66: Now you've got the dongle sign up with flip the fleet which enables you to keep track of trends but also compare with other nz leafs.

Just be aware that they don't follow NZ Spam laws and do not have an unsubscribe link or instructions on how to unsubscribe in their emails. I've had to resort to marking it as spam to stop the emails.

Hi Jeeves - I'm Dima, co-founder of Flip The Fleet. Afe66 has passed your comment on to me via an email channel. Sorry to read what you have wrote! You're partially correct, but we're not breaking any laws....

Flip The Fleet operates two types of emails: Transactional, and, Marketing.

Transactional: these are the core emails used by the project to communicate with you. For example, if you forget your password and reset it - you'll receive a transactional email. A reminder to contribute your data (i.e. the reminder to do the core part of the project, it's main objective) is transactional. When you email yourself a report from within the system - that's a transactional email. It's like receiving your invoice from a phone company by email - those are transactional too. For obvious reasons, you can't unsubscribe from those - otherwise, the service can't reach you. How do you receive a password reset link by email if you've unsubscribed?

Marketing: these are optional emails, like our monthly driver updates, and, one-click surveys. There's an unsubscribe button nice and big on each one of those. We just haven't sent any out recently...

So - if you wish to exit the project - I'm more than happy to deactivate your account. Most people that can't participate any more (lost the passion, moved overseas, sold their EV, etc) just email me and say "Can you please remove my account, I no longer wish to participate". Please flick me an email by replying to any of our notifications and we'll take care of it for you :)

Again, sorry to cause a negative response for you. It's not our intention at all... Dima

Thanks for your reponse Dima. I won't derail this thread with a semantic/UX argument, but I'd suggest to put instructions on how to remove oneself from transactional as well as marketing emails. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what their origin, purpose or legality is, if a user wants emails to stop, then it's always good practice to provide instructions on how. :)

Guilliman

80 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 27

#2331794 7-Oct-2019 11:38

afe66: Now you've got the dongle sign up with flip the fleet which enables you to keep track of trends but also compare with other nz leafs.

I have signed up and entered my data for September, I couldn't seem to see anywhere to upload or enter any information from Leafspy logs.

I'm looking through my first couple of logs and I wanted to check on the battery temps, the resources I've looked at so far didn't seem to clarify where this data is in the logs.

I suspect this is shown under the rows 'Pack Tx F/C' [Fahrenheit and Celsius?], I also see there are no values under T3 because for my 2016 model there are 3 sensors rather than 4?

"Lose it. It means go crazy. Nuts. Insane. Bonzo. No longer in possession of one's faculties. Three fries short of a happy meal...WACKO!" - Col O,Neill

afe66

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Lifetime subscriber

#2331816 7-Oct-2019 12:06

I must admit that I haven't looked into the logs.
When its the end of the month and time to record data, I plug my dongle in and connect to leaf and run leaf spy pro to get latest data. Then disconnect.

I'll note some data on a bit of paper which leaf spy doesn't collect such as odometer, average km average efficiency then reset those last two. Then head to ftf input page and enter the data online. This page also explains where to look for temperature etc.

Guilliman

80 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 27

#2339770 17-Oct-2019 14:07

I just ran through some numbers I have to see how much of a difference there has been in running costs, focusing on petrol/electricity only.

My previous car was a 2008 Toyota Blade 2.4L. From what I could see it appears to me that the highest fuel economy is 13.4km/L. I've been able to nudge the Leaf up to 8.1km/kWH for my average weekly commutes.

Odo was 19000km when I bought it which I will assume is legit, as of my log today in the morning before takeoff it was 51426km.

So I worked out I've added 32426km. At the extant efficiency that seems to be around 4003.21kWH used to date to charge.

If I use our current home rate of 26.76c/kWH that seems to be a spend of $1071.26 to date. If I instead go with my current EV off-peak rate through Mercury of 5.352c/kWH that would be $214.25. I don't remember that I requested the EV package from Mercury straight away so the value would be somewhere in between. This also doesn't account for the four long trips I've taken with multiple ChargeNet top ups.

Using the 13.4km/L I worked out I would have used 2419.85L over the same period and overall distance travelled. If I go with the AA average petrol price in Jan 19 of $2.149/L that appears to work out at $5200.26.

There's probably some things I've missed and certainly fluctuating petrol prices could affect things [plus I tended to use 98 in my Blade] but I thought I could get at least some kind of idea of the difference. Clearly any gains went towards paying off the car [worked out my own financing with a relative] but it's still good to have them.

"Lose it. It means go crazy. Nuts. Insane. Bonzo. No longer in possession of one's faculties. Three fries short of a happy meal...WACKO!" - Col O,Neill

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