EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

1 | ... | 342 | 343 | 344 | 345 | 346 | 347 | 348 | 349 | 350 | 351 | 352 | ... | 771

1526 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 513

#2742215 10-Jul-2021 17:22

NorthernZone:
BTW, what about used imports of Tesla ex Japan?! I see Drive EV of Taupo are looking at that. Bring on the competition!!

Theres a couple on trademe now.

I wouldnt. It has the US charge port so you'll need an odd charger and chademo adapter, plus its still logically a japanese car , tesla nz will sell parts and repair but wont touch the software side. No warranty etc.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2742225 10-Jul-2021 17:38

RobDickinson:

And they talk about price parity...

I don't want to be seen as nitpicky, but is Tesla vs BMW apples vs apples?

What about Hyundai vs Tesla? Lada vs Maserati :-)

It needs to be Hyundai ICE vs Hyundai EV etc Or Honda or Toyota and so on

For climate change reasons it really needs to be the raft of pre owned EV's we can import vs the ICE equivalents of this same brands/models.

Batman

Mad Scientist
30014 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6217

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2742226 10-Jul-2021 17:41

if instead of putting fart sounds, Tesla put in a V8 / V10 / V12 sound track that would help it compete with the BMW

Scott3

4177 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2990

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2742227 10-Jul-2021 17:45

NorthernZone:

MG @ NZ new @ c $40K post new rebate or 2020 used import Leaf 40 @ $40-45K post smaller/used rebate is also surely a no-brainer now. Leaf prices are all headed for a fall!

BTW, what about used imports of Tesla ex Japan?! I see Drive EV of Taupo are looking at that. Bring on the competition!!

Some people won't consider the MG for ethical reasons because of it's country of origen.

Also the build quality, and efficiency isn't up to the standard we expect from Japanese cars. High spec models get things like bose audio, 360 degree camera etc which arn't offered on the MG... On the other hand the MG has better space, sweet moon/sun roof and a cooled battery pack.

Cheapest used import 40kW leaf on trademe is $29,950 +ORC in Christchurch. Unregistered so qualifies for $3450 rebate.

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/nissan/leaf/listing/3169330692

Cheapest unregistered in Auckland is $34k Incl ORC, but unregistered.

Cheapist 62kWh, 160kW nissan leaf on trade me is $44k + $495 ORC which qualifies for the subsidy

So still some value to be had in used import leaf's, but you are correct that many of the leaf's listed at the moment will need price adjustments to remain competitive against a brand new MG.

Regarding ex japan tesla, be aware that they get the north american single phase charge port, rather than the euro style 3 phase (and ccs on teh model 3) we get here.

Personally I would want a warranty with Tesla given their history, so new model 3 pricing ($3k price drop today) looks better than anything in the used market. Perhaps if one really wanted an S or X, value could be had from the used market, but personally I wouldn't go that route.

As a general note EV's arn't super popular in japan. This is due to a combination of:

Home charging being somewhat rare (either because many people don't have off street parking spaces or because the electrical capacity to their home is to low)
A Nuclear disaster tainting electricity image from both a reliability and environmental point of view.
Abundant availability of very efficient hybrids and kei cars.

NZ is getting close to saturating the used market in japan. Essentially this is why the likes of the clean car discount / clean car standard are so important. In order to get a decent percentage of our fleet electric we need new EV's to be cheep enough to sell in decent volumes, which in turn will hopefully mean new car brands will bring a decent number of models to our little market.

kingdragonfly

11992 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 12887

Subscriber

#2742245 10-Jul-2021 18:44

May give insight into upcoming Ford EV trucks. Also the Mustang has gotten excellent reviews for passenger safety, in which the battery box plays a amjor role.

First look at the Ford Mustang Mach-E Electric Battery

Munro Live

kingdragonfly

11992 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 12887

Subscriber

#2742273 10-Jul-2021 20:46

Going Plaid! Randy Pobst's Winning Run at "Pikes Peak International Hill Climb" 2021

Geekzone support

Support Geekzone with one-off or recurring donations Donate via PressPatron.

Technofreak

6657 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3477

Trusted

#2742282 10-Jul-2021 21:48

RobDickinson:

And they talk about price parity...

The fuel price comparison in that diagram isn't really comparing apples for apples in my opinion, when it comes to the cost of the actual fuel. Other than GST there are no taxes or levies on electricity like there is for motor spirit. The ICE owner is paying 70 to 80 cents per litre in taxes (excise and RUC etc), about 35% of the fuel bill, that aren't being paid by the EV owner. At some point the money raised by these taxes will have to come from somewhere. Either EV owners or other taxes on everyone.

Ev's are not just getting free RUC.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

Obraik

2167 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1347

#2742296 10-Jul-2021 22:49

Yeah, but they are at the moment until 2024.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

Obraik

2167 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1347

#2742297 10-Jul-2021 22:52

tdgeek:
I don't want to be seen as nitpicky, but is Tesla vs BMW apples vs apples?

Well, Tesla intends for the Model 3 to compete against the BMW 3 Series, so yes? It's like comparing the specs of the Audi A4 or the Mercedes C Class to the 3 Series.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

HarmLessSolutions

1230 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 812

Subscriber

#2742299 10-Jul-2021 23:12

Technofreak:
The fuel price comparison in that diagram isn't really comparing apples for apples in my opinion, when it comes to the cost of the actual fuel. Other than GST there are no taxes or levies on electricity like there is for motor spirit. The ICE owner is paying 70 to 80 cents per litre in taxes (excise and RUC etc), about 35% of the fuel bill, that aren't being paid by the EV owner. At some point the money raised by these taxes will have to come from somewhere. Either EV owners or other taxes on everyone.

Ev's are not just getting free RUC.

That's an interesting point and one I haven't seen raised before. The complication in replicating fuel excise and other taxes other than RUC isn't straightforward on EVs either as their 'fuel' can be generated by the EV owner by way of PV or other distributed generation methods, and due to that any tax levied on electricity for EV use (if that's even able to be segregated) will increase the viability of consumer generation, as does any increase in electricity prices.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

RobDickinson

1526 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 513

#2742327 11-Jul-2021 07:21

Technofreak:
RobDickinson:

And they talk about price parity...

The fuel price comparison in that diagram isn't really comparing apples for apples in my opinion, when it comes to the cost of the actual fuel. Other than GST there are no taxes or levies on electricity like there is for motor spirit. The ICE owner is paying 70 to 80 cents per litre in taxes (excise and RUC etc), about 35% of the fuel bill, that aren't being paid by the EV owner. At some point the money raised by these taxes will have to come from somewhere. Either EV owners or other taxes on everyone.

Ev's are not just getting free RUC.

It's comparing real apples, today and at least for the next 3 years.

New World

Shop on-line at New World now for your groceries (affiliate link).

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2742329 11-Jul-2021 08:06

Obraik:
tdgeek:

I don't want to be seen as nitpicky, but is Tesla vs BMW apples vs apples?

Well, Tesla intends for the Model 3 to compete against the BMW 3 Series, so yes? It's like comparing the specs of the Audi A4 or the Mercedes C Class to the 3 Series.

You can argue that BMW/Audi are superior quality cars to a Toyota. It depends if you feel Tesla as the same quality as a BMW/Audi, thats very arguable. Not talking specs, talking quality

MarkH67

522 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 320

#2742344 11-Jul-2021 09:22

tdgeek:

You can argue that BMW/Audi are superior quality cars to a Toyota. It depends if you feel Tesla as the same quality as a BMW/Audi, thats very arguable. Not talking specs, talking quality

You could also argue that the Tesla costs $16k less to buy and is cheaper to run (by more than $1k per year looking at fuel alone). Then you could add in the argument that the Tesla is better for the environment because it doesn't need to burn fossil fuels to run. I see this as a rather compelling case to buy a Tesla instead of a BMW.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2742356 11-Jul-2021 10:41

MarkH67:

tdgeek:

You can argue that BMW/Audi are superior quality cars to a Toyota. It depends if you feel Tesla as the same quality as a BMW/Audi, thats very arguable. Not talking specs, talking quality

You could also argue that the Tesla costs $16k less to buy and is cheaper to run (by more than $1k per year looking at fuel alone). Then you could add in the argument that the Tesla is better for the environment because it doesn't need to burn fossil fuels to run. I see this as a rather compelling case to buy a Tesla instead of a BMW.

The point was quality. Toyota vs Toyota or BMW vs BMW. There is a compelling case t buy an EV over an ICE, despite the artificially low running costs, i.e. RUC

But the point is if you compare cars compare equal quality cars.

RobDickinson

1526 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 513

#2742357 11-Jul-2021 10:46

Quality is quite subjective, the toyota will likely be built better than either of the other 2, the materials in the model 3 are good but the design is simple and clean. Not something you can say about the BMW imo.

This is a good comparison too...

1 | ... | 342 | 343 | 344 | 345 | 346 | 347 | 348 | 349 | 350 | 351 | 352 | ... | 771