EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

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#2808053 5-Nov-2021 14:48

The $80k limit is there for two reasons, to push manufacturers into supplying cheaper cars, and to avoid accusations of funding EVs for wealthy people.

I kinda agree with both reasons, but you get a situation like with the model 3 where the AWD car with more range is $27k more than the entry model when it should really be a lot less, which means NZ ends up with some more shorter range cars than what it could potentially have

I'd rather this than nothing tho

Dingbatt

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#2808055 5-Nov-2021 14:49

The government isn’t funding it, the ‘polluters’ are.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

RobDickinson

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#2808071 5-Nov-2021 15:10

Dingbatt:

The government isn’t funding it, the ‘polluters’ are.

Right now that just isnt true.

Technofreak

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#2808109 5-Nov-2021 15:51

RobDickinson:

Dingbatt:

The government isn’t funding it, the ‘polluters’ are.

Right now that just isnt true.

So, we all got sold a dummy once again? How could that possibly happen?

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Obraik

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#2808111 5-Nov-2021 15:53

Technofreak:

So, we all got sold a dummy once again? How could that possibly happen?

If you chose not to read the full details of the roll out of the rebate and its transition into a feebate then that's on you.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

kingdragonfly

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#2808308 6-Nov-2021 08:30

The highway where trucks work like electric trains

Tom Scott

eHighway test project: overhead catenary wires, where electric trucks with pantographs can pull power directly from the grid.

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Dingbatt

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#2808388 6-Nov-2021 09:49

Obraik:

Technofreak:

So, we all got sold a dummy once again? How could that possibly happen?

If you chose not to read the full details of the roll out of the rebate and its transition into a feebate then that's on you.

But beyond the (now extended) transition phase that’s the way it’s supposed to work, right?

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Obraik

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#2808459 6-Nov-2021 12:33

Yes, it's meant to transition into a rebate funded by those buying vehicles above the emissions threshold.

Personally, I do agree with you @Dingbat. When it becomes self-funding then the price limit doesn't make a lot of sense.

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

kingdragonfly

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#2811238 11-Nov-2021 19:59

The surprisingly long history of electric cars

TED-Ed - Daniel Sperling and Gil Tal

Can electric cars reclaim their place on the road? Discover how developments in battery technology are making these cars more efficient and powerful.

afe66

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#2811571 12-Nov-2021 13:40

NYT
America Isn’t Ready for the Electric-Vehicle Revolution https://nyti.ms/3Cgnqrf

This got me.
China "now possesses about 90 percent of global capacity to process raw lithium, about 70 percent of cobalt and 40 percent of nickel. China also has almost all the manganese- and graphite-refining capacity."

So the west building lots of battery factories is stuffed if China decides to preferential supply its own manufacturers and the export completed cars.

Apparently the refining capacity is the difficult bit not just sourcing raw materials..

GV27

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#2811575 12-Nov-2021 13:49

Dingbatt:

Tapering the rebate off is effectively introducing a luxury car tax on vehicles that aren’t particularly luxurious. Someone who buys a Taycan or e-Tron GT* is still paying over $30000 in GST.

Hell of a spin to turn to getting a subsidy into 'being taxed' but good effort.

Someone who is buying a Taycan or E-Tron GT is paying hundreds of thousands of dollars for a car and doesn't need a subsidy from other taxpayers to buy it.

"Oh, I was going to buy an electric Porsche but I couldn't get the subsidy so I bought this MG ZS instead" isn't an argument I can say I've ever heard.

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HarmLessSolutions

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#2811577 12-Nov-2021 13:51

afe66: NYT
America Isn’t Ready for the Electric-Vehicle Revolution https://nyti.ms/3Cgnqrf

This got me.
China "now possesses about 90 percent of global capacity to process raw lithium, about 70 percent of cobalt and 40 percent of nickel. China also has almost all the manganese- and graphite-refining capacity."

So the west building lots of battery factories is stuffed if China decides to preferential supply its own manufacturers and the export completed cars.

Apparently the refining capacity is the difficult bit not just sourcing raw materials..

Might pay to fact check those claims. For example China is #4 in terms of lithium reserves so nowhere near "90%".

https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-metals-investing/lithium-investing/lithium-reserves-country/

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

RunningMan

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#2811581 12-Nov-2021 14:06

GV27:[snip]Someone who is buying a Taycan or E-Tron GT is paying hundreds of thousands of dollars for a car and doesn't need a subsidy from other taxpayers to buy it.

Every EV that is sold new instead of an ICE vehicle is good. No body needs the subsidy, it's the environment that needs it, so if that subsidy is the difference between a person buying a Taycan or buying the ICE equivilant, then just pay the subsidy. You could have exactly the same argument about subsidising a brand new MG ZS - if they can afford to buy a brand new MG then the taxpayer shouldn't have to subsidise it.

The subsidy is simply a way to incentive buying an EV over the ICE equivalent. If that person paying hundreds of thousands of dollars buys an ICE equivalent instead then we all lose.

Batman

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#2811582 12-Nov-2021 14:06

afe66: NYT
America Isn’t Ready for the Electric-Vehicle Revolution https://nyti.ms/3Cgnqrf

This got me.
China "now possesses about 90 percent of global capacity to process raw lithium, about 70 percent of cobalt and 40 percent of nickel. China also has almost all the manganese- and graphite-refining capacity."

So the west building lots of battery factories is stuffed if China decides to preferential supply its own manufacturers and the export completed cars.

Apparently the refining capacity is the difficult bit not just sourcing raw materials..

I think a lot of the world is stuffed if China decides to screw them, not just batteries.

But the main principal is profit.

They make a lot of money selling to Western EV makers.

People start to like EVs.

They sell their own EV for half the price, and as people like EVs thanks to the Western marketing, they buy Chinese EVs.

Win - win.

I don't think they have enough pulling power to just sell Chinese EVs without the exposure of the Western collabs. Eg if nobody builds Western EVs and nobody builds charging networks nobody would want to buy Chinese EVs without the networks. A lot of codependence.

wellygary

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#2811585 12-Nov-2021 14:15

HarmLessSolutions:

afe66: NYT
America Isn’t Ready for the Electric-Vehicle Revolution https://nyti.ms/3Cgnqrf

This got me.
China "now possesses about 90 percent of global capacity to process raw lithium, about 70 percent of cobalt and 40 percent of nickel. China also has almost all the manganese- and graphite-refining capacity."

So the west building lots of battery factories is stuffed if China decides to preferential supply its own manufacturers and the export completed cars.

Apparently the refining capacity is the difficult bit not just sourcing raw materials..
Might pay to fact check those claims. For example China is #4 in terms of lithium reserves so nowhere near "90%".

https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-metals-investing/lithium-investing/lithium-reserves-country/

The article is not talking about reserves, its talking about refining and processing

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