EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

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#2985893 21-Oct-2022 16:09

I think Tesla removing ultrasonic sensors is a mistake. It's probably driven by Musk' strong opinion that only vision is ever needed.

While they are three font cameras on the front, they are grouped pretty close together. You could argue our eyes are close together also, but more separation means better depth perception.

It's going to be hard to beat than 1% to 3% accuracy of ultrasonic sensors. Also, the existing ultrasonic sensors are perfectly placed for parking, low and on the bumpers.

It maybe why self-parking on other luxury cars are now better and more consistent than Tesla; Tesla used to be #1 at self-parking.

Without the low-lying ultrasonic sensor, there's now blind spots near the car, no camera coverage. That means if a tricycle is behind close to a parked Tesla, it won't be seen. So pets and kid are at greater risk of getting backed over. I see lawsuits in Tesla's future.

Tesla removing their ultrasonic sensors

Munro Live

Tesla's decision to remove ultrasonic sensors from their vehicles, offering pros and cons from safety and cost perspectives.

wellygary

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#2985896 21-Oct-2022 16:20

kingdragonfly: I think Tesla removing ultrasonic sensors is a mistake. It's probably driven by Musk' strong opinion that only vision is ever needed.

While they are three font cameras on the front, they are grouped pretty close together. You could argue our eyes are close together also, but more separation means better depth perception.

It's going to be hard to beat than 1% to 3% accuracy of ultrasonic sensors. Also, the existing ultrasonic sensors are perfectly placed for parking, low and on the bumpers.

It maybe why self-parking on other luxury cars are now better and more consistent than Tesla; Tesla used to be #1 at self-parking.

Without the low-lying ultrasonic sensor, there's now blind spots near the car, no camera coverage. That means if a tricycle is behind close to a parked Tesla, it won't be seen. So pets and kid are at greater risk of getting backed over. I see lawsuits in Tesla's future.

Backing is not the big worry as there is a reversing camera, ( if its got a wide enough lens you should get pretty got coverage) - but agree there is still a risk ,

The big one is frontally, there is simply no forward ground vision below the bonnet, now if you are moving forward you can probably use views from 5 secs ago, along with the side view cams to deduce that there is nothing there....

BUT

The kicker is if you get into a parked car that is rear in and drive forward out of a parking spot, you potentially have no visibility directly in front of the car, as all of the cameras have been off while the car is parked... ( unless they are going to have them on while the car is parked)

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#2987529 24-Oct-2022 23:29

Newshub tonight have a story with the headline "'Complete waste of money': Govt pays out over $30m in clean car rebates to Tesla owners". In it they are covering the feebate.

Focusing on Teslas having gotten more money than Leafs, but leaving out that it is because the Teslas have been getting the new car rebate and the Leafs the used car rebate.

They also say that ".. the Government is now recalibrating the scheme because it's dished out too many discounts."

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#2987536 25-Oct-2022 05:58

Could have just as easily said,
“Ford Ranger buyers pay majority of ‘Ute Tax’”. Purely because they outsell their rivals.

My fear is that this is a PR step to ‘adjust’ the scheme, and not for the better.

All Tesla buyers (and anyone who bought an EV for more than about $60K) paid more in gst than they got rebated.

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#2987541 25-Oct-2022 06:53

so is rebate ending i wonder

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#2987543 25-Oct-2022 07:19

I see the headline was changed on that article since the original post. Arguably the subsidy applied to Tesla's is better value for money and more environmentally friendly (in comparison to Leaf) because of longer range meaning more likely to be used to replace extensive petrol/diesel travel and the far longer expected battery life with active cooling system.

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#2987550 25-Oct-2022 08:09

The more EV that is bought the more second hand the more stock everywhere, the more EVs the more chargers, the more attractive to get more EVs....

Something something critical mass something something...

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#2987554 25-Oct-2022 08:28

The government needs to subsidize Solar PV, eBikes and public transport. They should invest more on public transport specially trains. A lot of freaking trains. Interconnect cities with trains. Those with $ will buy an EV regardless as their next car most likely with cost of fuel on going up. Not sure which average joe that can afford a $76k Tesla in the first place, really needs help offsetting their purchase with $8.5k. EV's do not solve traffic congestion.

Do whatever you want to do man.

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#2987557 25-Oct-2022 08:56

billgates:

The government needs to subsidize Solar PV, eBikes and public transport. They should invest more on public transport specially trains. A lot of freaking trains. Interconnect cities with trains. Those with $ will buy an EV regardless as their next car most likely with cost of fuel on going up. Not sure which average joe that can afford a $76k Tesla in the first place, really needs help offsetting their purchase with $8.5k. EV's do not solve traffic congestion.

agree, EV is for the rich, not the rest, at the current price point too expensive for most.

what you suggest makes a lot of sense but these things should have been in place for decades and they have not.

Technofreak

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#2987559 25-Oct-2022 09:01

billgates:

The government needs to subsidize Solar PV, eBikes and public transport. They should invest more on public transport specially trains. A lot of freaking trains. Interconnect cities with trains. Those with $ will buy an EV regardless as their next car most likely with cost of fuel on going up. Not sure which average joe that can afford a $76k Tesla in the first place, really needs help offsetting their purchase with $8.5k. EV's do not solve traffic congestion.

Yes, trains in the city areas but otherwise we don't have the population to sustain a viable intercity train network. Needs to be high speed (well faster than current trains) and frequent. Faster means significant upgrading of infrastructure. Frequent needs more people. Just look at the white elephant between Hamilton and Auckland to see how well the interconnection between cities is working out.

I agree with your comments about whether or not EV buyers really need a rebate in order for them to decide to buy and that it doesn't help sove traffic congestion in the cities. That's where the train money needs to be spent. Otherwise the money that might be spent on intercity trains is probably better spent on rebates or similar as much as I don't like them.

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wellygary

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#2987567 25-Oct-2022 09:34

Batman:

so is rebate ending i wonder

No Its not ending, it will be reviewed and potentially adjusted as it was always intended,

Below is the indicative rebate table in the cabinet paper, showing phase down in 2023 , (granted the rebates in the table were not the final ones approved, but the plan was always to have the value of the rebate decline over time)

https://www.transport.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/CabinetPaper-CleanCarDiscount.pdf

Basically as EV popularity and demand and supply grew the pool of money in each year would be subsidising more vehicles so would have to be reduced on a per vehicle basis,

Now granted, this has not been well publicised, but it is a feature of the scheme.

BUT I think for political reasons they will keep the pure EV rebate closer to its current level ( maybe $7K- ish)

There is an election in 2023 after all...

Obraik

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#2987592 25-Oct-2022 10:21

The scheme also gets a boost next year when the Clean Car Standard takes effect for dealers. All dealers whose average CO2 across their sold fleet is higher than the threshold will need to pay a fee (on top of what buyers are paying to purchase said cars). The likes of Ford could end up paying a significant amount to counter all the Rangers that they sell.

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#2987594 25-Oct-2022 10:28

Obraik:

The scheme also gets a boost next year when the Clean Car Standard takes effect for dealers. All dealers whose average CO2 across their sold fleet is higher than the threshold will need to pay a fee (on top of what buyers are paying to purchase said cars). The likes of Ford could end up paying a significant amount to counter all the Rangers that they sell.

And clean car manufacturers like Tesla will earn CO2 credits on their clean cars which they can sell to the likes of Ford, which should earn Tesla significant revenue.

https://www.transport.govt.nz/area-of-interest/environment-and-climate-change/clean-cars/

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#2987599 25-Oct-2022 10:34

Obraik:

The scheme also gets a boost next year when the Clean Car Standard takes effect for dealers. All dealers whose average CO2 across their sold fleet is higher than the threshold will need to pay a fee (on top of what buyers are paying to purchase said cars). The likes of Ford could end up paying a significant amount to counter all the Rangers that they sell.

quite a few ICE cars are getting a rebate with this scheme (as well as quite a few will pay a tax)

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#2987675 25-Oct-2022 12:29

Batman:

Obraik:

The scheme also gets a boost next year when the Clean Car Standard takes effect for dealers. All dealers whose average CO2 across their sold fleet is higher than the threshold will need to pay a fee (on top of what buyers are paying to purchase said cars). The likes of Ford could end up paying a significant amount to counter all the Rangers that they sell.

quite a few ICE cars are getting a rebate with this scheme (as well as quite a few will pay a tax)

I would hope that the next iteration of the scheme removes any rebate for ICE vehicles (including motorbikes).
Then in 2025 (maybe 2026), rebates for non-plug-in Hybrids go, and by 2027/28 no rebates for PHEVs either. At the same time, the floor at which a car import becomes liable for a carbon tax should be lowered. This moves the whole scheme towards favouring low- or zero-carbon and taxing higher-carbon vehicles

We need to move our private and at least light commercial vehicle fleet to BEV as fast as we can

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