Driving an automatic - do you use one foot or both?

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#1870364 21-Sep-2017 16:06

Rikkitic:

The foot is on the footrest or the floor in front of the brake when not in use. Honestly. I don't understand why people here have such a hard time getting that. Maybe it is difficult for you. It is not for me.

That's probably the real issue. How far does a vehicle travel at 100kmh in the time it takes you to lift your foot off the footrest, over and on to the brake and apply pressure. With a very real risk of leaving your right foot down.

Versus lifting off the throttle, over and down. As I said, if you've never had an incident, then that's testament to your current driving. But there is probably data somewhere showing performance of such a test.

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#1870367 21-Sep-2017 16:14

Coil:

kiwifidget:

When I first started driving automatic cars the left foot was used to operate the floor mounted headlight-dip switch.

I don't know why it still isn't down there.

My car now has auto-dip though, love that feature.

What car is that on

@Coil its a Mazda CX-5 (2012 model), and Himself's Ranger Wildtrak has it too.

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#1870421 21-Sep-2017 17:41

Coil:

mudguard:

Coil:

I will pay good money to anyone who can keep a straight face while driving my car with 2 feet.

Well one of the cars you need one foot, and the other two!

Mines an auto, The point is that the brake even thou it is a wider pedal is still hard to the right and you can see how the clutch is far to the left. The above comment which suggested the clutch was in the same position as the brake is not correct. As displayed in my photo comment.

Makes ya wonder.

Wonder no more. It's for heel-toeing. Not recommended for BMW drivers.

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#1870526 21-Sep-2017 21:55

One foot for me, I'm a fairly new driver too and have been n all sorts of different traffic situations and environments

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#1870575 22-Sep-2017 01:31

I guess another way of rewording the OPs question - If you have always been using 1 foot. Is there any advantage to start using 2 feet in an Automatic car? Assuming only for normal driving, not burnouts, drifting, racing etc. As I can't see any advantage.

NB, I learnt to drive in a manual car, I don't currently own any automatic cars, and it was over a year between when I learned to drive and when I drove an automatic car for the first time. So I definitely would have lots of muscle memory related to manuals. Im also in the habit of pressing both the clutch and brake in an emergency - specifically so the engine doesn't stall. If it does stall, you no longer have power assisted steering and power assisted brakes. And depending on where the car came to a stop, It might be on the other side of the road or somewhere equally bad, meaning that you might only have moments to move it. Or you end up crashing and the crash disables the starter motor. Or you have accidentally triggered your alarm system while you are driving, and the car won't start until you press the unlock button on the remote. Sure, some of those scenarios are unlikely, but just because it is unlikely doesn't mean that it can never happen.

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#1870616 22-Sep-2017 07:38

Rikkitic:

mudguard:

Well the million dollar question is what happens in an emergency? And the other question is where your left foot is when it's not braking? Hovering above it? On the footrest?

As been discussed, I don't think anyone who left foot brakes thinks they're touching the brake unless they're braking. I just read an article about downhill mountainbikers with telemetry onboard measuring how much they're trailing the brakes even when they think they're not.

I don't think vehicle manufacturers intend drivers to use their left foot brake, the pedals seem offset to the right mostly, and usually the clutch is well out of the way too.

Besides, the most important thing is, how do you heel and toe in a manual if you're left foot is on the brake!

At one point in my youth I worked in valet parking and was switching and whipping cars of all kinds around hundreds of times a day. Believe me, it is not hard, except for those who don't know how to do it.

I have done the same, One thing thats harder than you think is an Aston Martin V8 clutch and older Porsche 911's. Screw those things :P

Last night I was parked at the bottom of a steep hill nose down and I noticed my left toes on the brake pedal slightly holding the car as I was taking off. Rather than a sudden brake to accelerator change causing a jolt I pre loaded the drive line then went.

Here is a poll for us. Lets see what the trend is?
https://goo.gl/dfcYSQ

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#1870631 22-Sep-2017 07:59

Aredwood:

I guess another way of rewording the OPs question - If you have always been using 1 foot. Is there any advantage to start using 2 feet in an Automatic car? Assuming only for normal driving, not burnouts, drifting, racing etc. As I can't see any advantage.

NB, I learnt to drive in a manual car, I don't currently own any automatic cars, and it was over a year between when I learned to drive and when I drove an automatic car for the first time. So I definitely would have lots of muscle memory related to manuals. Im also in the habit of pressing both the clutch and brake in an emergency - specifically so the engine doesn't stall. If it does stall, you no longer have power assisted steering and power assisted brakes. And depending on where the car came to a stop, It might be on the other side of the road or somewhere equally bad, meaning that you might only have moments to move it. Or you end up crashing and the crash disables the starter motor. Or you have accidentally triggered your alarm system while you are driving, and the car won't start until you press the unlock button on the remote. Sure, some of those scenarios are unlikely, but just because it is unlikely doesn't mean that it can never happen.

I'm a little bit late to this thread but am amazed that anybody would consider left foot breaking in an automatic. What possible benefit in the world is there?

I learned to drive in an automatic originally but for the last 18 or 19 years have driven manuals before moving back to an automatic quite simply because it's getting harder and harder to get manual cars due to the increased fuel efficiency figures of an automatic and customer preference being for them. I love driving a manual but certainly don't miss them in stop start traffic.

I was actually taught to drive by an ex MOT driving instructor and recall him saying to press the clutch and brake in an emergency and actually found myself doing that when I was in an accident a couple of years ago. I know I did that because the clutch had actually become stuck down from pushing it hard and I needed to wedge my foot under it to pull it back to move my car when I was hit.

I can totally understand left foot breaking if you're driving a track car - but other than that see absolutely no benefit or need.

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#1870803 22-Sep-2017 10:07

sbiddle:

Aredwood:

I guess another way of rewording the OPs question - If you have always been using 1 foot. Is there any advantage to start using 2 feet in an Automatic car? Assuming only for normal driving, not burnouts, drifting, racing etc. As I can't see any advantage.

NB, I learnt to drive in a manual car, I don't currently own any automatic cars, and it was over a year between when I learned to drive and when I drove an automatic car for the first time. So I definitely would have lots of muscle memory related to manuals. Im also in the habit of pressing both the clutch and brake in an emergency - specifically so the engine doesn't stall. If it does stall, you no longer have power assisted steering and power assisted brakes. And depending on where the car came to a stop, It might be on the other side of the road or somewhere equally bad, meaning that you might only have moments to move it. Or you end up crashing and the crash disables the starter motor. Or you have accidentally triggered your alarm system while you are driving, and the car won't start until you press the unlock button on the remote. Sure, some of those scenarios are unlikely, but just because it is unlikely doesn't mean that it can never happen.

I'm a little bit late to this thread but am amazed that anybody would consider left foot breaking in an automatic. What possible benefit in the world is there?

I learned to drive in an automatic originally but for the last 18 or 19 years have driven manuals before moving back to an automatic quite simply because it's getting harder and harder to get manual cars due to the increased fuel efficiency figures of an automatic and customer preference being for them. I love driving a manual but certainly don't miss them in stop start traffic.

I was actually taught to drive by an ex MOT driving instructor and recall him saying to press the clutch and brake in an emergency and actually found myself doing that when I was in an accident a couple of years ago. I know I did that because the clutch had actually become stuck down from pushing it hard and I needed to wedge my foot under it to pull it back to move my car when I was hit.

I can totally understand left foot breaking if you're driving a track car - but other than that see absolutely no benefit or need.

Why would you depress the clutch when emergency braking? That would increase the stopping distance.

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#1870812 22-Sep-2017 10:14

Batman:

Why would you depress the clutch when emergency braking? That would increase the stopping distance.

For the reason listed above - the car won't stall. In a modern car there is negligible difference in stopping distance. In the old days it ran the risk of locking up wheels but this won't happen with ABS.

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#1870814 22-Sep-2017 10:16

Batman:

Why would you depress the clutch when emergency braking? That would increase the stopping distance.

Why is that? My (maybe naive) understanding is that if when you press clutch it would actually disengage the engine. If you don't the engine would still try to push the car forward (until stalled) even when you apply the brake.

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#1870816 22-Sep-2017 10:17

I was taught that to emergency brake a manual, to use the clutch and brake.

If you don't clutch, you will stall the engine, losing power steering, ABS(?) and brake hydraulics. Maybe Airbags too (though I think they'd still go so long as the ignition was on).

Also, as mentioned earlier in this thread, it is better to brace your left foot when braking hard, and what better to brace it on than the Clutch pedal?

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#1870843 22-Sep-2017 10:32

Bracing the foot is potentially damaging to the driver. On an advanced driving course I was shown the correct spacing to set for the steering wheel and seat position. The seat should be moved forward so that when mashing the brake pedal to the floor, there is still some bend in the knee joint. Definitely should not be a straight extended leg. For the steering wheel position (on cars that can move the steering wheel in and out) the instruction was that with the right hand on the 10 o'clock position, the arm should not be extended straight but should still have some bend at the elbow.

This left me feeling very close to the pedals and the wheel, but I was assured it was the correct position!

The point is that in an impending crash, drivers will reflexively straighten their arms and legs to press the brake and brace themselves. The result is that in-lined bones in the arms and legs transfer impact into shoulders and hips causing serious injuries. What they want to happen is bending at the knee and elbow joints so the force is not transmitted, and let the airbags and seat belts to their work to protect you.

This was at an Audi Quattro drivers' day run by the NZ distributors, taught by VAG professional instructors from Germany.

[edit] also this driving position means you can always fully press the brake and you can turn the wheel in corners without your shoulders coming away from the seat and losing lateral support.

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#1870846 22-Sep-2017 10:42

kryptonjohn:

Bracing the foot is potentially damaging to the driver. On an advanced driving course I was shown the correct spacing to set for the steering wheel and seat position. The seat should be moved forward so that when mashing the brake pedal to the floor, there is still some bend in the knee joint. Definitely should not be a straight extended leg. For the steering wheel position (on cars that can move the steering wheel in and out) the instruction was that with the right hand on the 10 o'clock position, the arm should not be extended straight but should still have some bend at the elbow.

This left me feeling very close to the pedals and the wheel, but I was assured it was the correct position!

The point is that in an impending crash, drivers will reflexively straighten their arms and legs to press the brake and brace themselves. The result is that in-lined bones in the arms and legs transfer impact into shoulders and hips causing serious injuries. What they want to happen is bending at the knee and elbow joints so the force is not transmitted, and let the airbags and seat belts to their work to protect you.

This was at an Audi Quattro drivers' day run by the NZ distributors, taught by VAG professional instructors from Germany.

[edit] also this driving position means you can always fully press the brake and you can turn the wheel in corners without your shoulders coming away from the seat and losing lateral support.

I have since been told also, that the best place to grip the wheel is 9 and 3, not 10 and 2. Also, try not to drive with thumbs wrapped around the wheel (in even a small crash, you could break your thumbs).

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#1870849 22-Sep-2017 10:48

Agreed. And the steering wheel spokes in late model cars are now usually designed for this position.

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#1870855 22-Sep-2017 10:59

eph:

Batman:

Why would you depress the clutch when emergency braking? That would increase the stopping distance.

Why is that? My (maybe naive) understanding is that if when you press clutch it would actually disengage the engine. If you don't the engine would still try to push the car forward (until stalled) even when you apply the brake.

Then engine will not push the car forward. It will hold the car back.

I accept the argument that with full brake power + ABS the car will slow down just as effectively as with full brake power + ABS + engine braking. Or does it? Who knows.

Why would you need the engine running after a crash?

If there is mental capacity left during emergency braking to depress the clutch I would recommend downshifting as you emergency brake. Not depress the clutch and let it free wheel.

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