Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


4 posts

Wannabe Geek


Topic # 60600 28-Apr-2010 17:59
Send private message

Hello everyone
Thank you in advance for any help received.

Situation: Traffic was virtually stationary along Shore Road and I was driving my scooter west (between victoria ave and burwood cres) along the medium strip when a car attempting to do a U turn pulled out in front of me causing me to skid and crash into the front of her car. They were indicating but I didn't see until too late.

Does the fact that I was in the medium strip put me at fault? or should she have looked before she pulled out?

Anyones advice would be great and maybe if someone could point me in the right direction for finding info in the road code or something similar that I can reference when discussing it

Thanks
Stubbies..

View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
253 posts

Ultimate Geek

Geekstore

  Reply # 324357 28-Apr-2010 18:31
Send private message

By my understanding (but I could be wrong) the person doing the U-turn has to give way to any traffic on the road, if you were on the medium strip turning right, you are still in that line of traffic.

I think that you're in the right by my judgment.




Shaun Fisher - www.geekstore.co.nz

E: shaun[at]geekstore[dot]co[dot]nz
P: 0800894508  F: 0800897451

4241 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 68

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 324359 28-Apr-2010 18:47
Send private message

A little more information if you could?

Why were you on the median strip, were you indicating, what speed were you travelling?

At this stage, I would say you are to blame.

For more information, refer to this, at the bottom of the page it explains proper use of a median strip.

:)
2876 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 85

Subscriber

  Reply # 324365 28-Apr-2010 18:57
Send private message

rscole86: A little more information if you could?

Why were you on the median strip, were you indicating, what speed were you travelling?

At this stage, I would say you are to blame.

For more information, refer to this, at the bottom of the page it explains proper use of a median strip.


That was the conclusion I came too as well.







4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 324366 28-Apr-2010 19:04
Send private message

I was using it to pass the stationary queue of cars.

I used this advice from scootersurvival
"Let’s face it, getting to the front of a whole line of cars can feel pretty good. And it is OK to pass stationary vehicles, provided you indicate before pulling out and don’t cross over a yellow line. Just be careful not to knock a car wing mirror on your way past. It’s not OK, however, to pass on the extreme left."

So I didn't want to pass on the left and all the cars were close to the middle of the road so I couldn't get past without using the medium strip.

But what I was thinking is that, even if I was doing something wrong by using it to pass cars, the fact that I could have been using it to turn right makes her at fault as well for not looking. So both of us are at fault?

3080 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 918

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 324381 28-Apr-2010 19:58
Send private message

Stubbies: Does the fact that I was in the medium strip put me at fault?

According to the way you described yourself using it, yes.

should she have looked before she pulled out?

Yes but...
They were indicating but I didn't see until too late.

...she possibly did look but you may not have been in her line of vision and, going back to the first point, you shouldn't have been there.  How long had she been indicating for?

Proper usage of a median strip is depicted as per the link rscole86 posted.

21 posts

Geek


  Reply # 324385 28-Apr-2010 20:09
Send private message

Quite simply, you are not allowed to ride over a flush median during a passing maneuver. There is actually an explicit example of this about 3/4 of the way down this page: http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/roadcode/motorcycle-road-code/about-riding/passing.html 



4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 324386 28-Apr-2010 20:11
Send private message

Thanks for the replys everyone.

I don't know how long she had been indicating, only noticed after she pulled out. If she had looked in her wing mirror she would have seen me

4241 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 68

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 324389 28-Apr-2010 20:26
Send private message

Ultimately, based on your description, you are in the wrong.

No matter how you argue it, and what scooter guide you refer to, the NZTA set down the rules of the road. And in this case, you have broken it, and been unfortunate in being involved in an accident in the process. I ride motorbikes, and do as you do, but have never had an accident, its just the risk we take.

"Let?s face it, getting to the front of a whole line of cars can feel pretty good. And it is OK to pass stationary vehicles, provided you indicate before pulling out and don?t cross over a yellow line. Just be careful not to knock a car wing mirror on your way past. It?s not OK, however, to pass on the extreme left."


What you have to realise, is that this is just 'advice' they will have a legal disclaimer in there for sure. Also, you were not pulling out and passing stationary cars, eg going over a white line, you were entering a section of road and not using it how it is intended.

485 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 6


  Reply # 324396 28-Apr-2010 21:05
Send private message

rscole86: Ultimately, based on your description, you are in the wrong.

No matter how you argue it, and what scooter guide you refer to, the NZTA set down the rules of the road. And in this case, you have broken it, and been unfortunate in being involved in an accident in the process. I ride motorbikes, and do as you do, but have never had an accident, its just the risk we take.

"Let?s face it, getting to the front of a whole line of cars can feel pretty good. And it is OK to pass stationary vehicles, provided you indicate before pulling out and don?t cross over a yellow line. Just be careful not to knock a car wing mirror on your way past. It?s not OK, however, to pass on the extreme left."


What you have to realise, is that this is just 'advice' they will have a legal disclaimer in there for sure. Also, you were not pulling out and passing stationary cars, eg going over a white line, you were entering a section of road and not using it how it is intended.


I am too a motocyclyist and happily break this rule many many times a day. I disagree with your conclusion - although the road code specifies that this is illegal and the police could fine you for this the cause of the accident was the driver failing to properly ensure the path was clear before starting a u-turn.

Imigaine if instead the scotter rider was driving their car down a bus lane in a car rather than the median, although this would be 'illegal' it would still have been the fault of the car doing the u-turn






pɐǝɥ sıɥ uo ƃuıpuɐʇs

:)
2876 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 85

Subscriber

  Reply # 324397 28-Apr-2010 21:11
Send private message

Filterer:
rscole86: Ultimately, based on your description, you are in the wrong.

No matter how you argue it, and what scooter guide you refer to, the NZTA set down the rules of the road. And in this case, you have broken it, and been unfortunate in being involved in an accident in the process. I ride motorbikes, and do as you do, but have never had an accident, its just the risk we take.

"Let?s face it, getting to the front of a whole line of cars can feel pretty good. And it is OK to pass stationary vehicles, provided you indicate before pulling out and don?t cross over a yellow line. Just be careful not to knock a car wing mirror on your way past. It?s not OK, however, to pass on the extreme left."


What you have to realise, is that this is just 'advice' they will have a legal disclaimer in there for sure. Also, you were not pulling out and passing stationary cars, eg going over a white line, you were entering a section of road and not using it how it is intended.


I am too a motocyclyist and happily break this rule many many times a day. I disagree with your conclusion - although the road code specifies that this is illegal and the police could fine you for this the cause of the accident was the driver failing to properly ensure the path was clear before starting a u-turn.

Imigaine if instead the scotter rider was driving their car down a bus lane in a car rather than the median, although this would be 'illegal' it would still have been the fault of the car doing the u-turn




I agree you do make a valid point. However the cyclist was still not abiding by the law. For all we know yes, the lady could have looked, but missed the cyclist, however, had he not been breaking the law in the first place, it wouldnt have happened to begin with. Furthermore, the rider admits she was indicating, so there is also the possiblity that they (the rider) weren't paying attention either.


Though, on a more personal note. The way motorcyclists do this really pisses me off. I don't believe it's fair and they shouldn't do it, and quite often than not, they become a hazard which I have found while driving during peak-hour traffic. But that's just me.



EDIT: Added a wee bit more.





300 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 5

Trusted

  Reply # 324398 28-Apr-2010 21:12
Send private message

This http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/roadcode/about-driving/turning.html#uturn says the car driver must make sure "the road is clear in both directions", so isn't that contributory negligence? Maybe both drivers are committing offences?

4241 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 68

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 324399 28-Apr-2010 21:20
Send private message

Filterer: I am too a motocyclyist and happily break this rule many many times a day. I disagree with your conclusion - although the road code specifies that this is illegal and the police could fine you for this the cause of the accident was the driver failing to properly ensure the path was clear before starting a u-turn.

Imigaine if instead the scotter rider was driving their car down a bus lane in a car rather than the median, although this would be 'illegal' it would still have been the fault of the car doing the u-turn.


I agree with what you say, and both of them would be likely to receive a fine. Both would get $150 fines for what they did. But, for who is at fault here? I would still say that the fault is on the scooter rider here.

361 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 1


  Reply # 324401 28-Apr-2010 21:24
Send private message

If it was a vote I'd say the car driver is at fault. They are crossing lanes they MUST make sure it's clear before they do.

Lane filtering scooters or bicycles aren't exactly uncommon, and you should look for them.

485 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 6


  Reply # 324402 28-Apr-2010 21:27
Send private message

Aaroona:
Though, on a more personal note. The way motorcyclists do this really pisses me off. I don't believe it's fair and they shouldn't do it,


Most definitly not a valid argument! They don't slow you down, in fact if anything they REDUCE the traffic on the road and get YOU to your destination sooner

Aaroona:
And quite often than not, they become a hazard which I have found while driving during peak-hour traffic. But that's just me.


Perhaps a fair point - depending on the point of view - however perhaps it is your presence on the road creating the hazard for the motorcyclist?




pɐǝɥ sıɥ uo ƃuıpuɐʇs

4241 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 68

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 324403 28-Apr-2010 21:28
Send private message

lapimate: This http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/roadcode/about-driving/turning.html#uturn says the car driver must make sure "the road is clear in both directions", so isn't that contributory negligence? Maybe both drivers are committing offences?


While this is correct, the car driver was entering a section of road that should NOT be used by through traffic. A road user should only enter it to make a turn into a side street, as per our links. The OP was riding through, and has not told us the speed at which he was riding. If the car making the u-turn looked, checked blind spot and pulled out, and the scooter rider was riding at an 'excessive' speed then it could still fall to the scooter ride at fault.

A car using a median, to turn into a side street, should not need any more than 100m of lane, especially if the traffic is at a standstill. Any more than that, and they are illegally using a median stip.



Disclaimer: I am not a Police Officer.

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic

Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Hawaiki Transpacific cable ready-for-service
Posted 20-Jul-2018 11:29


Microsoft Dynamics 365 Business Central launches
Posted 10-Jul-2018 10:40


Spark completes first milestone in voice platform upgrade
Posted 10-Jul-2018 09:36


Microsoft ices heated developers
Posted 6-Jul-2018 20:16


PB Technologies charged for its extended warranties and warned for bait advertising
Posted 3-Jul-2018 15:45


Almost 20,000 people claim credits from Spark
Posted 29-Jun-2018 10:40


Cove sells NZ's first insurance policy via chatbot
Posted 25-Jun-2018 10:04


N4L helping TAKA Trust bridge the digital divide for Lower Hutt students
Posted 18-Jun-2018 13:08


Winners Announced for 2018 CIO Awards
Posted 18-Jun-2018 13:03


Logitech Rally sets new standard for USB-connected video conference cameras
Posted 18-Jun-2018 09:27


Russell Stanners steps down as Vodafone NZ CEO
Posted 12-Jun-2018 09:13


Intergen recognised as 2018 Microsoft Country Partner of the Year for New Zealand
Posted 12-Jun-2018 08:00


Finalists Announced For Microsoft NZ Partner Awards
Posted 6-Jun-2018 15:12


Vocus Group and Vodafone announce joint venture to accelerate fibre innovation
Posted 5-Jun-2018 10:52


Kogan.com to launch Kogan Mobile in New Zealand
Posted 4-Jun-2018 14:34



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.