Auckland's New Sports Stadium

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thermonuclear

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#314941 31-May-2024 11:43

Had a quick look around and couldn't see this discussed anywhere, but interested in the communities views about the proposed new sports stadium for Auckland.

My phone is telling me this morning that the original four shortlisted proposals have been whittled down to a final two -- the existing dog with fleas that is Eden Park, and the Quay Park submission which I believe has NZ Rugby backing?

I'm in Napier now but spent about ten years in Auckland for uni and initial work opportunities and have some fond memories of events I've attended at Eden Park in the past. But, quite how the venue continues to be put forward as an acceptable option for continued redevelopment in 2024 is beyond me.

Carisbrook in Dunedin is gone, Lancaster Park in Christchurch is gone, Athletic Park in Wellington is gone. You can argue that the replacements in those cases have been improvements but, nevertheless, time has moved on and those cities have bit the bullet and done something about it. Surely it's time for Auckland to put a bullet in Eden Park and build something that's fit for purpose in this century.

As a relatively impartial observer I thought all of the three central city proposals were an improvement over the status quo v.3.0, with my own personal preference being the Wynyard Point design and location. But, I'm not close enough to know for sure any longer with traffic, etc. As I say, interested in your viewpoints as fellow sports followers.

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#3243245 31-May-2024 12:35

I'm a bit ambivalent really. I feel like the are ultimately loss makers for the city. Now you can argue plenty of things are, community pools, libraries etc.

However they seemed to pushed by a particular sport. Albany Stadium is in a really good spot, but is almost derelict now.

Auckland needs a decent test cricket ground. And by decent, I mean a dedicated oval, modeled on say Hagley or University Oval, grass banks, shade and capacity of about 10,000. Make watching cricket enjoyable.

wellygary

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#3243273 31-May-2024 13:51

The council is trying to appear positive, but they still haven't grasped the issues,

1) Eden Park Isn't theirs to control, Since the govt sunk a bunch of cash into it for the RWC, wellington controls to board

:The Crown appoints five of the nine Board trustees. The Board is accountable for the Park’s financial and strategic management"

2) All of these shiny drawings were predicated on "no cost to the council". neither have actually shown how they make the numbers stack up,

3) The chances of getting any Govt money in the next few years is pretty much Zero,

This report will be quietly filed on a shelf for the next 10 years, when a future council can either look at moving forward or get a new report and dump this one....

Handsomedan

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#3243334 31-May-2024 15:43

The only way I can see anything worthwhile happening is if they convince billionaire Auckland FC owner Bill Foley to sink a few hundred million bucks into a new stadium in the CBD, which has a dedicated rectangular pitch shape and is perfectly suited to Football.

If he were to do this, I can imagine that while he'd be keen to see multiple uses for the stadium (concerts, other sports etc), the turf would be exclusively for the AFC team in the A-League season and only out of their season would anyone else get a sniff. That would make it out-of-bounds from October to May every year - rendering it useless through the summer months for anyone but the Black Knights.
Would it be useful? Sure. Is it necessary? no.

I'd rather see North Harbour (Albany) Stadium improved upon and a second stand built to match the single existing one. Better public transport access and friendlier carparking options would need to be in place too.
The issue is that many non-Shore folk don't like to head over the bridge, let alone all the way to Albany. I can understand why. From the depths of South or East Auckland it is a long trip, return to Albany. There's no train. It's at the fringe of the Northern end of the city. There's effectively wasteland between there and Orewa. It would feel like a long, long way away for many.

With all of that said, I think it's a good option for reinstatement as a proper stadium - especially after the debacle that was the baseball reconfiguration.

I'm not a fan of Eden Park. It needs to be demolished and covered with terraced houses.

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Handle9

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#3243336 31-May-2024 16:10

North Harbour stadium is in a good place if you live in Glenfield. It’s in a terrible location if you live anywhere else. It, and Eden park, both need bulldozers put through them. The major stadium needs to be in the CBD. That’s where the transport is, that’s whene the entertainment options are.

Eden Park is a god awful rugby stadium and a worse cricket stadium. It really is the worst of both worlds.

Unfortunately this is a consequence of the useless Auckland councils squabbling when the government offered to build a CBD stadium before the 2011 Rugby World Cup. None of them could give up their own self interest for the good of the region.

I can’t see it getting up. There’s no money or desire to invest in entertainment facilities in the current environment.

cddt

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#3243387 31-May-2024 16:28

The council (i.e. ratepayers) does not have money for something like this. We're up against the debt limits already, public transport is a shambles, traffic is congested, lack of investment in stormwater infrastructure caused thousands of homes to flood last year, the CBD has gone seriously downhill, etc.

There are many more things which should be addressed before investing in what is likely to be a white elephant money pit.

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ezbee

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#3243389 31-May-2024 16:54

It comes down to who is paying, not just construction, but running costs ?
They seem to rarely pay for their operational costs let alone construction ?

Given ongoing problems with old stormwater and sewage upgrades needed.
Public transport issues, rises in rubbish collection costs and many other things.
Along with rate rises.

Auckland ratepayers are unlikely to support in mass?
Especially those who were absorbed into supercity who need services in their communities too.

Bulldozing other Stadia to pay may hit vociferous opposition from communities quite liking the space they silenced remaining mostly empty, and the organizations that use them occasionally.
Then would it really yield that much profit for council after deconstruction.

mattwnz

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#3243390 31-May-2024 16:59

Eden park had hundred of millions spent on it in 2011 to update it, with new stands and roofs for the rugby world cup. So I can't understand why that can't continue to be used for a long time. But NZ really needs a single larger stadium to attract the big events, because they have that requirement. But if they do that, then it will need to be built somewhere different, and not try an reuse Eden park. Wellington went through this 25 years ago, when there was the choice to update Athletic park, or build a new downtown stadium. A pity they didn't go for the larger capacity design that was designed for the site, because then we wouldn't need another larger stadium.

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mattwnz

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#3243393 31-May-2024 17:22

cddt:
The council (i.e. ratepayers) does not have money for something like this. We're up against the debt limits already, public transport is a shambles, traffic is congested, lack of investment in stormwater infrastructure caused thousands of homes to flood last year, the CBD has gone seriously downhill, etc.

There are many more things which should be addressed before investing in what is likely to be a white elephant money pit.

Wellington did it with a far smaller population via a stadium levy in the rates. So I am sure Auckland with the massive population could afford it using a levy. But building costs have increased by far more than inflation since the Wellington one was built and people also want other expensive things like a removable roof

mattwnz

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#3243394 31-May-2024 17:26

Handle9: North Harbour stadium is in a good place if you live in Glenfield. It’s in a terrible location if you live anywhere else. It, and Eden park, both need bulldozers put through them. The major stadium needs to be in the CBD. That’s where the transport is, that’s whene the entertainment options are.

Eden Park is a god awful rugby stadium and a worse cricket stadium. It really is the worstbof both worlds.

Unfortunately this is a consequence of the useless Auckland councils squabbling when the givenment offered to build a CBD stadium before the 2011 Rugby World Cup. None of them could give up their own self interest for the good of the region.

I can’t see it getting up. There’s no money or desire to invest in entertainment facilities in the current environment.

People are also fed up with these professional sports. IMO they need to build their own stadiums or put a lot of money towards them if they want them.

GV27

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#3243544 1-Jun-2024 15:59

Handsomedan:

I'm not a fan of Eden Park. It needs to be demolished and covered with terraced houses.

You aren't getting terraced houses on Eden Park. For that land use change to stack up it will need to be high-rises, especially if the idea is that the proceeds are then used to fund a stadium elswhere. I'm not entirely sure the residents would be keen on the alternatives if they were being realistic about what they're likely to be.

Personally I hope it stays but with some sanity about its use as an existing community asset, but if we have to abandon the history and warm fuzzy bits then I hope we see the railyard proposal pan out. That land, by its nature as leasehold and current use, is not likely to get a precinct-level makeover any other way.

elpenguino

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#3243563 1-Jun-2024 17:16

Handsomedan:

The only way I can see anything worthwhile happening is if they convince billionaire Auckland FC owner Bill Foley to sink a few hundred million bucks into a new stadium in the CBD, which has a dedicated rectangular pitch shape and is perfectly suited to Football.

If he were to do this, I can imagine that while he'd be keen to see multiple uses for the stadium (concerts, other sports etc), the turf would be exclusively for the AFC team in the A-League season and only out of their season would anyone else get a sniff. That would make it out-of-bounds from October to May every year - rendering it useless through the summer months for anyone but the Black Knights.
Would it be useful? Sure. Is it necessary? no.

I agree. Having a rectangular stadium for football makes viewing much better. Wgtn stadium hosts 1 cricket game every 10 years and that was used to justify the round shape that makes watching footy a bit of a remote experience.

Wn stadium hosts rugby and A league games on successive days so I don't see sharing the ground as a problem. After the recent rugby game there was no sign of turf damage the next day.

And one thing that's awesome about the wn stadium is that it's next to the train station so it's easy to get there and home. It's an almost unbelievably sensible thing to have done for an NZ stadium !

Surely a central site is going to better tick the transport and entertainment boxes for Auckland.

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ezbee

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#3243566 1-Jun-2024 17:31

I had to post this, for Eden Park.

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I expect any development will get howls from those that live in the area and the great and worthy of Auckland.
Even if its the current fashion of what is in the Mt Wellington Quarry.

Would it even be saleable over the objections of the Eden Park Trust Board ?

Stu1

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#3243575 1-Jun-2024 19:26

elpenguino:

Handsomedan:

The only way I can see anything worthwhile happening is if they convince billionaire Auckland FC owner Bill Foley to sink a few hundred million bucks into a new stadium in the CBD, which has a dedicated rectangular pitch shape and is perfectly suited to Football.

If he were to do this, I can imagine that while he'd be keen to see multiple uses for the stadium (concerts, other sports etc), the turf would be exclusively for the AFC team in the A-League season and only out of their season would anyone else get a sniff. That would make it out-of-bounds from October to May every year - rendering it useless through the summer months for anyone but the Black Knights.
Would it be useful? Sure. Is it necessary? no.

I agree. Having a rectangular stadium for football makes viewing much better. Wgtn stadium hosts 1 cricket game every 10 years and that was used to justify the round shape that makes watching footy a bit of a remote experience.

Wn stadium hosts rugby and A league games on successive days so I don't see sharing the ground as a problem. After the recent rugby game there was no sign of turf damage the next day.

And one thing that's awesome about the wn stadium is that it's next to the train station so it's easy to get there and home. It's an almost unbelievably sensible thing to have done for an NZ stadium !

Surely a central site is going to better tick the transport and entertainment boxes for Auckland.

Wellington is terrible for sport , Miles away from the action. The wind swirls round no matter where you sit you freeze your ass off. Transport is a joke the trains don’t run in the weekends and if they do they reduce carriages and the train drives right pass you. The busses are non existent, even though the council said they would put extra services on there were no buses after the nix games families and punters got soaked trying to walk into the cbd to find Ubers. Eden and mt smart are way better experience the transport is great to both venues and the council actually knows how to put on transport for punters . It’s actually free and included in the ticket price. The idea of the cbd is good if the CBD is actually good. Auckland is Sess pit of drunken homeless people and scaffolding alleyways that smell like toilets. We watched a stabbing in McDonald’s at 4pm , drunken people arrested at 3 on a Saturday afternoon. Our next trip we won’t be staying in the CBD . You don’t know how lucky you have it compared to the cake tin

mudguard

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#3243613 2-Jun-2024 09:00

I think the issue I have with Auckland's CBD (even Eden Park) is the thought of getting to any kind of event for say 7pm on a Friday is a nightmare.
I think in the US they often build their stadiums in the middle of nowhere, they make it the destination.

I think the whole CBD thing is almost an old fashioned idea of drumming up hospo which will then make events under lights instead of day games.

I think the Wellington Sevens proved a point, if you make your event dry, and no one comes, your sport is no good. We have this discussion a bit after golf, we tend to play early, so normally it's an early lunch and coffee or a beer in summer. The days of the bar making lots of money from drink are long gone so the club needs to address the need for staffing etc.

Starlith

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#3243703 2-Jun-2024 12:28

mudguard: I think the issue I have with Auckland's CBD (even Eden Park) is the thought of getting to any kind of event for say 7pm on a Friday is a nightmare.
I think in the US they often build their stadiums in the middle of nowhere, they make it the destination.

I think the whole CBD thing is almost an old fashioned idea of drumming up hospo which will then make events under lights instead of day games.

I think the Wellington Sevens proved a point, if you make your event dry, and no one comes, your sport is no good. We have this discussion a bit after golf, we tend to play early, so normally it's an early lunch and coffee or a beer in summer. The days of the bar making lots of money from drink are long gone so the club needs to address the need for staffing etc.

If the CBD thing is old fashioned just build another stadium in the middle of nowhere like Albany right? The best stadiums have easy access from mass transit options which is what a CBD focused stadium should have. Eden Park is actually pretty good but its not a proper rectangle stadium for Football or Rugby, it should have stayed as a proper cricket oval.

The Wellington Sevens was really just a carnival piss-up with the rugby being secondary, they moved it and the event is nowhere near as good as what it was and the rugby product is just the same.

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