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6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3304979 3-Nov-2024 22:06

Handle9:

Are Tom Latham and Gary Stead good now? I read it on facebook.

What's that about.

Simpy brilliant by GP and Patel. GP not reviewing a fairly obvious on cost him a wicket, GP shoulda had 4, But it didnt mater.

I believed this entire series, I think because we finally brought the right bowlers, despite the batting being terrible.

Of the teams to win a series in Ind, how many won all ? No doubt many were 4 or 5 series.

Looking forward to Eng and unleashing our spinners lol.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

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#3304980 3-Nov-2024 22:10

I think possibly two wins and a draw will be enough depending on how well aussie play Ind.

Handle9

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#3304995 4-Nov-2024 00:32

TeaLeaf:

What's that about.

Tealeaf:

Seriously I dont know how NZ keeps winning with Larsen and WIlliamson playing lottery with below average players like Santner, Astle and Latham at home

You lot have been convinced that Stead and the selection of NZC has been terrible for years and yet he's the most successful coach NZ has had by some margin and this is the most successful era of New Zealand cricket ever even when international cricket is more competitive than it's ever been. It's almost like he's bloody good.

This is the only visiting team to have ever won a three match, or more, series in India. It’s also the first NZ team to win a test series 3-0

Dochart

804 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3305169 4-Nov-2024 13:09

The squad for this series has been mainly good except for Blundell. Other than that I had no problem with the other players selected for this test series.

We were quite fortunate that the 2nd and 3rd test winning the toss and batting first was crucial to our 3-0 whitewash against India and rain and cloudy conditions in the 1st test mitigated the error of India chosing to bat first. We toured Sri Lanka just before and lost 2-0 but that was going to happen anyway as we were forced to bowl first and 2 test matches played at the same venue,

Latham as captain and choosing the right call at the toss prove vital. If India had won the toss and chose to bat first for the 2nd and 3rd test result would of been 2-1 to India. If you look at previous tours in 2016 and 2021 we lost 5 games in total and all times forced to bowl first. So being able to win the toss and bat first in India made it much easier for the Blackcaps.

Out of Aus, Eng and South Africa I reckon Blackcaps have the best team for sub-continent conditions. We have the best spin bowlers and batters who can play spin in this team compared to those 3 teams.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3305605 5-Nov-2024 15:31

Handle9:

You lot have been convinced that Stead and the selection of NZC has been terrible for years and yet he's the most successful coach NZ has had by some margin and this is the most successful era of New Zealand cricket ever even when international cricket is more competitive than it's ever been. It's almost like he's bloody good.

This is the only visiting team to have ever won a three match, or more, series in India. It’s also the first NZ team to win a test series 3-0

Im critical of Stead's "selections" of players with poor averages especially in specific scenarios that they are really poor at. He is clearly a good "Manager" which is largely what they have become in Cricket, I do not think of Stead as a "Coach". I think the Selection process needs to change. I think its pointless taking out of form batsmen who are not good at facing Spin to SEA.

I think we would have lost to AFG in the single test, we didnt score above 400 in any of the 4 SL innings but bowled a rubbish 602/5 DECLARED and in reply managed a spectaular 88 ALL OUT. a 2/0 loss for us.

Against Ind our batting only managed above 263 once. Our bowling however made up for it and won 3 Tests and has us back in with a WTC chance.

NZ had 3 tests of fantastic Bowling. Our batting for the most part was rubbish and inconsistent at its peak. In the first innings when Southee helped win the test with his 68 supporting our only Series century of the Seies via Rachin. To put it simply Ind tried to score too quickly against very accurate bowling from NZ in every inn. NZ posted some woeful scores with the Bat often thanks to the mid-tail. Ind just needed to bat to get ahead of the tests, not dynamite through the tests.

Ind stated before the series they would aim for 400 per day, which to be fair they are plenty capable of, but just tried for more like 600 per day. I think they need more planning how they go about 5rpo and certainly not 7-8rpo which at times they were making look easy, until one wicket turns to ten. I have no doubt they can score 400 per day and whilst one opener who avgs near 70 can score that quick they should get a more set process for when wickets fall around him, to drop back to plodding 3rpo.

If I had to pick a player who played for the team, scored a pivotal innings, bowled some pivotal wickets and saved countless runs with his fielding, GP easily springs to mind.

Two batsmen I can think of who have shown they may not be done with just yet, but need some QUALITY batting coaching, Conway and Mitchell.

Is it time to give Cleaver a go with the gloves.....

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3305617 5-Nov-2024 15:47

Dochart: The squad for this series has been mainly good except for Blundell. Other than that I had no problem with the other players selected for this test series.

We gotta give Dane a crack surely. at his age he is unlikely to be overawed by it all. Id expect him to end up mid 40s avg.

I would like however to see GP to play 5, I think give him a go, if he fails you have to middle order in Mitchell and Cleaver to come, which is quite a good late middle. We really miss the #8 KJ with his technique and long levers.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

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#3308284 12-Nov-2024 21:16

What a comeback to draw the SL t20 series scoring only 108 from memory. What I really do remember is Lockie belting through with a hat trick, 6 wickets in the two games. But bad news, the poor chap has strained a calf so is out of the ODI series.

But I hope fellow pace bowler and fresh Black Cap Zak Foulkes plays. Very similar bowling stats to fellow Cantab Will Orourke, except Zac is a better tail end batsman like Henry etc.

Im not liking the look of the squad posted for the Odi series, its lacking many of our good players, Nicholls and Young the only top order listed so far, everyone else is a bowler or all rounder. Prob just havnt updated things. Not so sure about Tim Robinson, hasnt set the field alight in any format really.

as much as Ive hated Nicholls being in our test team, I suspect he might play in the Eng tour of NZ, with the SL Odi's as a warm up. Hes a much better batsman in NZ conditions that is for sure.

Santner to hold an end fairly early on with some fire bowling at the toes at the other end, Foulks or Milne, could see runs drastically reduced. Good all rounders like GP, Chapman, Bracewell, Foulkes, Foxcroft etc to assist Will Young to put on a big score.

I guess we will see when the squad is filled out.

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3308718 13-Nov-2024 17:36

First: SL vs NZ ODI #1 10PM tonight, worth a tired work day for. :-)

Just on my criticisms of Stead, issue #1. Id much rather have kept Henry "nick all balls" or Young in the middle and replace Blundel with Cleaver or Fletcher, but now Hay.

Canterbury cricket is where I would be looking for Coaching and Performance. Just a long list of senior black caps and now young guns like Foulkes and O'rourke, but of all for me its young Mitch Hay wicket keeping avg 46 in FC, had a duck in his first ODI but took an all time record 6 catches with the gloves.

Blundell was avgn slightly less than Fletcher (who was also with Cant cricket for a time) at low 30s and then over achieving in Tests, which has been a crazy phenomenon for nearly all NZ Test batsmen, ie Daryl Mitchell, Nicholls. add 5 maybe 10 to their FC avg. I dont know if its just psychology trying to do better at higher level, or if its being around truely great batsmen like Kane. But most have had their Test avgs plummet toward their original FC avg since around Taylors slump and subsequent retirement.

But we have two wicket keepers who avg circa 10-13 more in FC than Blunders and one in Fletcher around the same. Time to turn the .... page Stead.

another point the article makes is another criticism Ive had (excuse me for them, but I'm right), there is no blimmin way Blundell should be a 6 failing ahead of GP at 7 who is left stranded or having to hit for the ropes, lowering his own boundary. Not cool.

To Stead's credit he does acknowledge Mitch Hay, but asking him to perform in white ball to be the NZ Test Keeper ahead of Blundell, well does it's a classic example of why I criticise Steady. Hes relied upon a golden era and hes managed the team well at times, but when everybodys form slumps, nothing changes.

Sure 3-0 in Ind, was one of the NZ greats above the WTC for me, but losing the series prior with out best.... Ind was some awesome individual performances with the ball, a lot of luck with the toss and Ind playing T20 tests, with a team plenty capable of 400 runs per day but just lacked some patience.

If we could get more performance coaching and get another Cantab, Macca back as batting coach, we have the potential for another golden era with some legit quality batting and some fire brand youngsters in the middle to tail with bat, ball and gloves

Eng tour of NZ, start of another Golden Era team, class bowling leading the charge.

1. Latham
2. Conway/Will Young
3. Kane
4. Rachin
5. D Mitchell/Will Young/Nicholls
6. Phillips
7. M Hay
8. M Henry (another cantab bowler deluxe)
9. Zac Foulker
10. Sears/Milne/Southee
11. Orourke

Period!!!!!

Black Caps v England: Coach Gary Stead defends Tom Blundell amid prolonged form slump - NZ Herald

thermonuclear

604 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3308767 13-Nov-2024 20:10

Interesting.

A few comments from Napier where CD has been playing Otago at McLean Park. Dane Cleaver scored 151no for CD and Max Chu 85 for Otago. Unsurprisingly Uncle Gary is sticking by Blundell as he likes to do. Happy to see Hay get an opportunity in Sri Lanka though and see what he can do.

On your comment about Robinson, TeaLeaf, he did score that half century on the Pakistan tour prior to the World Cup to win a game for NZ. Was then overlooked for the underperforming and underprepared openers at the WC and we saw how that went. He hasn't done anything so far on this current tour but would like to see him continue to get an opportunity to press a claim.

Been disappointed not to see Nathan Smith play in the first two matches but hopefully tonight. I would pick him for the 1st Test against England before Foulkes, he was leading wicket-taker in the Plunket Shield last season and comes highly praised by his Wellington coach, former bowling coach for the Black Caps over the last decade, Shane Jurgensen. He's also a decent bat.

Barring injury they should play Henry, O'Rourke and Smith as the pace attack in Christchurch. I know the conventional wisdom is to play four quicks at Hagley Oval before Christmas, but that's overkill when both Henry and O'Rourke are in great form and playing at their home ground. If they get into the English batting as probability and form the past twelve months would suggest then the fourth seamer is unlikely to see many overs or wickets. Plus you have Phillips and Ravindra to provide some spin if needed, and Mitchell with a few overs if you really need to spell the three front-line pacemen.

Sears and Jamieson are both recovering from injury so they are unlikely to be sighted against England. Playing three seamers allows NZ to find room for Young with the return of Williamson and not having to drop a batsman (Mitchell). Young at three is a bit of insurance against failure at the top, likewise the extra bat covers the fragile lower middle order and Smith is a strong number nine. All that said and still a couple of weeks out, this is the side I would pick for that first outing against England

Latham (c)
Conway
Young
Williamson
Ravindra
Mitchell
Phillips
Blundell
Smith
Henry
O'Rourke

Dochart

804 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3308770 13-Nov-2024 20:16

Cleaver did well in that recent first class game. Should be the next man after Blundell. I felt like the NZ selectors have ignored him when he should have been given a go when Blundell was out of form. Averages 39.22 in first class cricket.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3308788 13-Nov-2024 21:20

Dochart: Cleaver did well in that recent first class game. Should be the next man after Blundell. I felt like the NZ selectors have ignored him when he should have been given a go when Blundell was out of form. Averages 39.22 in first class cricket.

Yeh, I think that innings of Danes might have been the catalyst for that NZH article.

But honestly Im super excited by Mitch Hay. fyi I meant his first t20i two ball duck but then all time most catches with the gloves. Some of the zingers from Lockies hat trick had him taking real Speccy catches. For me his FC avg is a no Brainer, a bit like O'rourke and now Foulkes those FC bowlig avgs even only 15 red ball FC in just stand out like just gotta give obvious talent opportunities.

I thought Sears was going to be ready for our Summer, dang. KJ I just so wish he could bowl like he use to, even though it was a back stran, I know with my own issues once the neurology gets super jumpy in the back, the stabilisers clamp up even when there is nothing structural. I still hope though.

But either way that team I listed can bat a bit to 10, with our good top order guys ready and the middle hopefully with Mitch Hay, or Cleaver, there is then that long tail but high quality bowlers, almost genuine all rounders etc in another life.

Smith I have been hoping he would break out in Domestic, there was a lot of interest/pressure for him to achieve, I just think some players need time. Like GP, he told them not to pick him, then he returns as a quality all rounder/spin. We will see. I guess the point is there is no reason with such quality with the bat deep and reverse such accurate bowling coming through.

I think its good to float names about, but that NZH article is spot on with what Ive been saying. Nobody is saying Stead is not a big part of our success, but just when we going down, he should be more open to his Selector and obvious changes. Im still a fan, he will mold those 15 I listed into our next Golden Era, I believe that, if the right decisions are made.

But I do wish our batting coach would return and perhaps lean on that Cantab management/coaching team.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3308789 13-Nov-2024 21:22

Yep Hay has been named.

SL vs NZ T20I series - Mitchell Hay waits for the sun to shine on him | ESPNcricinfo

I just read rain is likely to effect this series.

With 4 teams in the WTC around 55PCT and now aus at only 62.5, we in with a real good chance if we win two and draw the third vs Eng. Baz has them wanting to play like Ind, big daily scores, I think with NZ's bowling that could again be not the best way.

Edit: SL win toss, gonna bat.

Edit: Smith, Robinson and Hay debut. Getting cute, but why not, its not a world cup.

TeaLeaf

6325 posts

Uber Geek

#3308853 14-Nov-2024 09:25

Disappointing result but no surprise.

Young was going along so well with Tim Robinson, so much so if you look at the win/lose probability graph on Cricinfo they had almost got it back down to 50%. then wickets in bunches saw it climb rapidly again. But Will YOung 48 and Tim Robinson mid 30s I thought was a mini win from this very lacking playing eleven. Beastie 34No was good for the middle but ideally he would be further down the order.

Duff with a few wickets was the only other success for a non regular Pace bowler. Smith got smashed for over 8rpo as did Bracewell and even our other spinners struggled with most ove 6rpo and Sodhi the only one with a wicket.

Only second ODI for NZ so far this year and it really was a team of newbies and 3rd string players so until the release the actual eleven its always annoying and I think thats how this series, with more rain also possible may pan out.

I hope we bat first next match if a day/night there to know if its worth todays fatigue haha. Espresso time.

SL vs NZ Cricket Scorecard, 1st ODI at Dambulla, November 13, 2024

thermonuclear

604 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3309438 15-Nov-2024 18:36

Southee has called time on his Test career, stepping down after the upcoming English series.

NZ Test Squad

Latham (c)
Blundell
Conway
Duffy
Henry
Mitchell
O’Rourke
Phillips
Ravindra
Santner (second and third tests only)
Smith
Southee
Kane Williamson
Young

floydbloke

3523 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

#3312110 23-Nov-2024 07:49

Slightly off-topic sorry but not worth starting a separate thread.

Watching Bumrah rip the Aussies apart last night was something else. Try and catch a replay or some highlights if you missed it. A masterclass in pace bowling.

Did Eric Clapton really think she looked wonderful...or was it after the 15th outfit she tried on and he just wanted to get to the party and get a drink?

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