Formula 1 2025 Season Discussion

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#3366103 21-Apr-2025 09:03

I don't understand Lawson's penalty either. He had already passed Doohan but in doing so he went into the turn a little hot. He at least made an attempt to make the corner and in doing so lost a lot of time that let Doohan in with a chance of getting the position back. It wasn't as though he just completely missed the corner and ploughed on straight ahead. At most it should have been a track limits warning.

tdgeek

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#3366105 21-Apr-2025 09:15

Senecio:

I don't understand Lawson's penalty either. He had already passed Doohan but in doing so he went into the turn a little hot. He at least made an attempt to make the corner and in doing so lost a lot of time that let Doohan in with a chance of getting the position back. It wasn't as though he just completely missed the corner and ploughed on straight ahead. At most it should have been a track limits warning.

https://racingnews365.com/fia-stewards-explain-crucial-reason-for-max-verstappen-punishment

The standard penalty is 10 seconds, but dropped to 5 seconds as first lap, they are always lenient first lap on any incident due to the mayhem, close quarters factor on lap one.

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#3366107 21-Apr-2025 09:29

I get that, but my argument is that he didn't gain an advantage, he'd already completed the pass. Lots of people leave the track and are given warnings until they add up.

tdgeek

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#3366116 21-Apr-2025 10:53

Senecio:

I get that, but my argument is that he didn't gain an advantage, he'd already completed the pass. Lots of people leave the track and are given warnings until they add up.

If you make a pass, the pass needs to be legal, i.e when you pass, you are within track limits. In F1 one part of one tyre needs to be on the inner or outer white line.

If you leave the track and pass thats not legal.

The issue on turn 1 today, was that Oscar won the corner. he was on track, he was alongside, so he owned the corner, Max had to either ease back, or if he passed as he did, to give the place back.

Your latter point, if any car goes off track 3 times they get a warning, then they get a penalty.

Going back to turn 1 today, the rules keep changing. At one time, the passing car say Max, needs to have an overlap, then the other car, say Oscar, has to leave enough room for Max to stay within track limits. Now, Oscar was in front at the first apex before the corner, so he owns the corner, he can use his racing line, which he did, leaving Max to accept that and ease back, or Max goes off track. If Max goes off track he wasnt pushed off (in today's rules) so if he passes, he has to give it back.

Thats how I see it from what I heard and read, feel free anyone to chime in if Im wrong. The rule needs to be as black and white as possible, which it isn't but its better than what it was.

thermonuclear

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#3366198 21-Apr-2025 13:36

Agree with those who think Lawson was hard done by with the ten second penalty, the pass on Doohan had been completed earlier on the straight and Liam going into turn one a little hot was a separate issue and should have resulted in a track limits strike at best. Looking at the replay from outside the car it wasn't like he cut across the chicane, he barely had the left hand wheels off the track and mostly made the corner. That said, if there was some doubt over events then Desiderio should have told Lawson to give the place back and get him to re-take the spot off Doohan again.

Thought Liam had a solid weekend overall. Pleased he out-qualified Hadjar for the first time and thought he was really unlucky with the start in the race. The places just didn't open up for him, which allowed Hadjar and Alonso to mug him off the line. According to Desiderio on the cooldown lap, Liam had to lift to avoid hitting Alonso at the start which ultimately cost him the places to Hadjar. Sometimes those things go your way and sometimes they don't, he was just unlucky and Hadjar was super lucky as a result.

Aside from the Doohan stuff-up he made plenty of good overtakes and looked decently quick, especially on the hards during the second stint, so plenty of positives to be taken from the race weekend. He looked on an upward trajectory overall so that should build his confidence going into Miami in a fortnight.

Looking over his shoulder, Lindblad scored 16 points for his race weekend, including the Sprint Race win. He stands 7th overall with three weekends completed but has scored points in each of the last four races. Lawson will need to keep pushing to hold off the coming challenge.

Benoire

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#3366199 21-Apr-2025 13:39

Lawson also did better than Yuki....

nzkc

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#3366210 21-Apr-2025 14:06

tdgeek:

If you make a pass, the pass needs to be legal, i.e when you pass, you are within track limits. In F1 one part of one tyre needs to be on the inner or outer white line.

I think the point Senecio is making is that he had arguably completed the pass before the corner. Doing so within track limits (it was the start/finish straight). After which its a simple track limits violation.

Question becomes: When is a pass completed? Based on the penalty I guess it has to include at least one corner.

Other than the penalty I though Lawson drove a pretty good race. Bit unlucky not to get into the points.

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tdgeek

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#3366213 21-Apr-2025 14:24

nzkc:

tdgeek:

If you make a pass, the pass needs to be legal, i.e when you pass, you are within track limits. In F1 one part of one tyre needs to be on the inner or outer white line.

I think the point Senecio is making is that he had arguably completed the pass before the corner. Doing so within track limits (it was the start/finish straight). After which its a simple track limits violation.

Question becomes: When is a pass completed? Based on the penalty I guess it has to include at least one corner.

Other than the penalty I though Lawson drove a pretty good race. Bit unlucky not to get into the points.

Ah ok, Ive deleted the race, dang it. I guess the stewards felt that he left track limits due to the pass, i.e.the pass caused the track limits. Like the reverse of lasting advantage.

Yes, he was pretty rock solid. Unlucky at the start, and the penalty. He confirmed the car felt quick, as he said after quali. Im confident is is leaving the results trough. Probably accepts that Red Bull is over, forget about that and them, and focus solely on himself and his new team

Jaxson

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#3366266 21-Apr-2025 15:19

Was just sad he wasn't able to eek out a 10s lead on the car behind to nullify the penalty.
Still not in the points, but racing balls looking like a car that will place 12 - 9th most weekends if driven well.

thermonuclear

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#3366267 21-Apr-2025 15:24

Benoire:

Lawson also did better than Yuki....

This is a bit of a biased view no doubt, but Perez's 152-point haul in 2024 is still looking a huge way off for Tsunoda. Just two points out of his three weekends in the big seat so far. Perhaps the optics look better but, as the golfers apparently say, drive for show and putt for dough. Red Bull are zero chance at the constructors unless Tsunoda can significantly improve his contribution.

Although, perhaps Red Bull already saw the writing on the wall regardless of the second seat occupant and took the opportunity to bank some Honda cash and install Tsunoda as a glorified "pay driver" for the season.

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#3366291 21-Apr-2025 17:28

thermonuclear:

Benoire:

Lawson also did better than Yuki....

This is a bit of a biased view no doubt, but Perez's 152-point haul in 2024 is still looking a huge way off for Tsunoda. Just two points out of his three weekends in the big seat so far. Perhaps the optics look better but, as the golfers apparently say, drive for show and putt for dough. Red Bull are zero chance at the constructors unless Tsunoda can significantly improve his contribution.

Although, perhaps Red Bull already saw the writing on the wall regardless of the second seat occupant and took the opportunity to bank some Honda cash and install Tsunoda as a glorified "pay driver" for the season.

100%

Tsunoda is scoring as well as Perez. Many times last year the commentators talk about the top 4 teams, and those 7 drivers. Yuki isnt delivering the results to be one of those 8 drivers from the top 4 teams. Exactly how Sergio was when he was dumped. But Red Bull have run out of cards.

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#3366414 22-Apr-2025 01:17

Red Bull has upped its game. Much closer at the top now for Max Verstappen.

JPNZ

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#3366427 22-Apr-2025 07:50

Jaxson:

Red Bull has upped its game. Much closer at the top now for Max Verstappen.

Its a long season but RBR is already 100 points behind Mclaren. The car is faster but I'm sure upgrades will come along the season for all teams.

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Jaxson

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#3366430 22-Apr-2025 07:55

Red Bull are very unlikely to take the constructor title with only 1 1/2 cars in the competition for real points.

Drivers they still have a shot, and will have no internal squabbling for race finishing order points.

thermonuclear

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#3366465 22-Apr-2025 10:52

Miami is a Sprint weekend so two opportunities for Lawson to impress. A couple of weeks to get to grips with the new circuit in the sim.

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