Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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#2416750 12-Feb-2020 15:47

networkn:

One thing I wonder about, but don't have any insight into, was how the pro players get paid.

Are all SR players getting the same, or is it on a tiered system whereby say Richie McCaw gets paid more than say Matt Todd. Is it a flat rate regardless of what how many games they play and what happens if a player is out with Injury, and then if they then go and play for the AB's are the AB's paid a base salary and then for every test they are selected they get an additional fee?

Its a tiered system. I used to know the rates a few years ago.....perhaps more than a few years:-)

SuperRugby used to be $80k-$180k

AB's used to be up to $400k (Richie/Dan) and this was on top of SR and Provincial payments.

So, the better the player than the more they earn.

All players have insurance, but it depends on the level of injury for when this kicks in.

7's used to be paid a small retainer and then appearance money per tournament but this was changed a few years ago so that they get the same as a SR player. If you look at the 7's team their players are more settled now as they can make a reasonable living.

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#2416758 12-Feb-2020 16:24

networkn:
I'll come back to the above a bit later, I am still thinking things though :)

On another note, it seems that we have the usual two trolls in the media, but now, Hamish Bidwell seems to be trying to get in on the action. We don't really need more, so that's a shame. I don't recall him being like that in the past.

What did he wrote that you consider trolling? I read his article that addresses many of the same points I've written about. It wasn't positive towards the NZRU but why should it be?

One positive that I do see with Mark Robinson is that the media seems far more willing to be critical of New Zealand rugby and question their strategy. It can only be a good thing

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#2425737 23-Feb-2020 08:06

Wales France was an outstanding game. Tough, some exceptional tries and super close at the end.

If France can build from here they will be outstanding in 2023. Dupont and Ntamack have the potential to be the best half combination in the world. Ntamack has the kind of time and place that Carter had - I'm not saying he's there yet but the potential is there.

Dan Biggar was a total disgrace the whole game, whining and complaining to the referee. The antics of Biggar, Sexton and Farrell are
a blight on the game. I'd like to see the IRB go really hard on their nonsense as it is going the way of football.

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#2434823 9-Mar-2020 09:21

The Hurricanes Blues game was the worst I can recall in recent history.

The Hurricanes have a serious discipline issue. Their tackling has been badly timed and many are high, fairly consistently in all of their games this season. I am tired of commentators downplaying the danger of those tackles as if they are no big deal. The laws are clear, they have been clear for 5+ years. For them to lose 3 guys in quick succession was disgraceful in my opinion and I am pretty sick of hearing TJP and Dane Coles whining at the referees all the time. TJP and Aaron Smith need a serious talking to about it in my opinion. It's been going on for a long time.

In the end, the worst of it other than discipline was how the Blues failed to capitalize on having a 3 man advantage. They barely won that game, and they really should have got a bonus point. They looked completely lost for most of the second half, EXCEPT for some excellent defensive work throughout the game. I am not sure where their attacking has gone to, perhaps they are focused on defense? Akira Ioane had some periods of strong play. I will be interested to see if he gets a look in at the AB's this year. I suspect Foster has a softer approach than Hansen, hopefully, it doesn't backfire.

The only team in the competition who held themselves to a decent standard was the Chiefs. The Crusaders won just but didn't look convincing much. Ryan Crotty really was the best backline defensive 12/13 in the game. His ability to organize a backline defence was unparalleled and the Crusaders are obviously struggling defensively in the midfield. The Reds put traffic through it the entire game. Holes that definitely should not have been there. They were off a bye and they weren't organised for lots of the game. The Crusaders were lucky the Reds didn't have a decent kicker on Friday night or they would have lost their long home winning streak.

Re France vs Scotland, I cannot understand how the French manage to undo themselves so effectively. The punch that led to the red card was a shocker!

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#2434827 9-Mar-2020 09:27

networkn:

The Hurricanes Blues game was the worst I can recall in recent history.

The Hurricanes have a serious discipline issue. Their tackling has been badly timed and many are high, fairly consistently in all of their games this season. I am tired of commentators downplaying the danger of those tackles as if they are no big deal. The laws are clear, they have been clear for 5+ years. For them to lose 3 guys in quick succession was disgraceful in my opinion and I am pretty sick of hearing TJP and Dane Coles whining at the referees all the time. TJP and Aaron Smith need a serious talking to about it in my opinion. It's been going on for a long time.

In the end, the worst of it other than discipline was how the Blues failed to capitalize on having a 3 man advantage. They barely won that game, and they really should have got a bonus point. They looked completely lost for most of the second half, EXCEPT for some excellent defensive work throughout the game. I am not sure where their attacking has gone to, perhaps they are focused on defense? Akira Ioane had some periods of strong play. I will be interested to see if he gets a look in at the AB's this year. I suspect Foster has a softer approach than Hansen, hopefully, it doesn't backfire.

The only team in the competition who held themselves to a decent standard was the Chiefs. The Crusaders won just but didn't look convincing much. Ryan Crotty really was the best backline defensive 12/13 in the game. His ability to organize a backline defence was unparalleled and the Crusaders are obviously struggling defensively in the midfield. The Reds put traffic through it the entire game. Holes that definitely should not have been there. They were off a bye and they weren't organised for lots of the game. The Crusaders were lucky the Reds didn't have a decent kicker on Friday night or they would have lost their long home winning streak.

Re France vs Scotland, I cannot understand how the French manage to undo themselves so effectively. The punch that led to the red card was a shocker!

Can't agree more on Hurricanes vs Blues game. Blues aimless kicking in the second half was an absolute bizarre. When they had 3 man advantage why not keep the ball for 4-5 more phases and have clear highway on either side for tries to fly... Blues defence is outstanding, but attack is lacking team work. Everyone tries to break the line like they are playing league and have to give up ball at some stage. Very frustrating to watch.

helping others at evgenyk.nz

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#2434832 9-Mar-2020 09:29

They had space out wide every single time they had the ball, and persisted with attacking the Hurricanes narrow defence through the middle. It was conceivable they could have lost that game, even in the last 7 minutes!

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#2435412 10-Mar-2020 05:59

Wales England was a cracking game this weekend. England were far too good and the score flattered Wales but the physicallity was incredible. Obviously Marler is going to get a nice holiday as will Tuialagi and probably Lawes and Liam Williams.

France were just awful. The punch was brainless but they just played horrible rugby the whole game. It's a young side and France are France. I'm sure they will learn a lot from it but it was disappointing from them.

Now the six nations won't get decided until the northern autumn, it will be interesting to see how they reschedule to fit the remaining games in.

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#2438634 15-Mar-2020 15:37

The Crusaders ill discipline cost them 2 men in almost identical fashion to the Hurricanes a week earlier. A horrendous elbow smash and I hope he gets a decent ban for it. We want this BS stomped out of the game.

Despite that, scoring two tries and showing such unbelievable self-belief on defense stopped the Sunwolves from scoring in the same timeframe.

It's a shame about the postponement, but Sanzar were left with no choice. It will be interesting to see if they run a new draw and play local derbies etc instead.

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#2438645 15-Mar-2020 16:05

Super Rugby is finished for the season IMO.

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#2438670 15-Mar-2020 17:18

^... and the international season.

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#2449923 30-Mar-2020 10:46

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12320792

I stand by my criticism of RA and RC. Yet another example. NZ, UK, Argentina, Italy, all held talks with players and discussed it. Australia pretty much decided with next to no player input.

Also, as I predicted, their decision to "go to market" over Rugby TV rights left them high and dry as far as I can see, now they are getting *less* money from the broadcasters over Rugby rights.

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#2454502 4-Apr-2020 16:25

Well, it took much longer than it should of (I was against her selection for the role in the first place), but Raelene Castle will almost certainly be removed. Only to be replaced by a potentially worse choice, Phil Kearns!

It's like they go out of their way to cause themselves grief. I actually thought it may have been Rod Kafer, but hopefully, he stays in the mix somewhere as he has some pretty reasonable ideas on how to improve Australian Rugby including calling for better junior recruitment and training facilities. He has a calmer and more logical approach in my opinion.

My experience with Kearns largely has been some of the dumb things he has said whilst commentating (which include some things about Australian Rugby that I can't recall this minute, but was shocked at the stupidity of, at the time). He may well have great business acumen and be suited to the role, but I have my serious doubts.

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#2454542 4-Apr-2020 18:14

I think you are not seeing the whole picture with Australian rugby. Fox offered a radically reduced broadcast deal ($20m vs $57m per year) which lead to going to market. Going to market made sense and if the virus situation hadn’t come about may well have been successful in securing significantly improved revenue. They don’t have a broadcast deal at the moment so we don’t know.

Most of the media criticisms of Rugby Australia comes from media owned by Murdoch, who of course owns Fox. The rumours of Kearns taking over come from the Murdoch press, who employs Kearns. Murdoch is ruthless in using his media organisations to promote his own interests. You need to read more widely to get a true picture.

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#2456173 6-Apr-2020 20:15

My understanding was that the talks re a new deal, were concluded before anything started to get cancelled, and the amounts offered by other providers was even less than what was offered by their incumbent (at least that was what I read). Dropping interest by Australians in watching Australians play Rugby (badly) was said to be a contributing factor. The offer (by Fox) was in line with viewer number decline over the past 3 years. Fox felt it overpaid for the rights last time and made little or no money for it. I can't find where I read it, but the number of 20M had a performance bonus component based on viewer numbers or something, that could RA have got more viewers interested in Rugby again, would have bumped that number quite a bit.

I'd heard stuff through other channels about Kearns before I heard it on the NZ Herald news. Time will tell, but I'll be surprised if Castle is still in charge in a month regardless of who takes over from her. Having said that, I have been wrong with previous predictions when it comes to Rugby Australia

/me shrugs

On an unrelated note, as a Richie Mo'unga and Crusaders fan, I am very disappointed to see this:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12322947

I sincerely hope they get a virtual ass kicking.

Lastly, I must say I am really missing Rugby. I underestimated how much time I spent watching etc it. I'm not having trouble filling the time, but I'd rather be watching Rugby.

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#2457877 9-Apr-2020 05:48

The interview with Warren Gatland on the breakdown this week is realy cool. He was very open and gave some really interesting insight. He talked for 40 or 50 minutes. One of his comments which I found rang true was that all the Super teams play the same way.

This makes it easy to integrate players into the All Blacks but it has created teams players that only know one way to play. It was interesting listening to him talk about how he's getting the Chiefs to kick a bit more from midfield to get the ball kicked back to them. Mackenzie then gets a broken field to run into gaps.

He was really thoughtful and I don't think I've ever heard a New Zealand based coach be so open and relaxed. He doesn't have to care too much about damaging his own career so he can be really open and candid.

Highly recommended.

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