North and South Korea talks

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#2037684 14-Jun-2018 18:13

Trump-Kim Deal Signals North Korea May Never Give Up Its Nukes

“I don’t think it would be the end of the world, because it’s the world we already live in,” he said. “My worry is that the president keeps promising that Kim will give up his weapons. If he suddenly wakes up one day and realizes what’s really going on, he could just explode, and then we’re in real trouble.”

...

"Saddam gave up his nuclear program and died; Qaddafi gave up his program and died; Kim didn’t give up, built a bunch of nuclear weapons and not only stays alive but gets rewarded. That is not a good message to be sending out.’’

Article in Bloomberg.

I consider that Bloomberg, with an editor in chief ex "The Economist" is a reasonably neutral publication, not prone to publishing opinion pieces which are provocatively sensational or liberal leaning.

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#2037841 14-Jun-2018 19:58

Sure:

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo blasted a reporter on Wednesday after the journalist asked why the denuclearization of North Korea was not included in an agreement signed between the country's leader, Kim Jong Un, and President Trump.

“The president said it will be verified," the reporter said to Pompeo in South Korea, to which Pompeo responded, "Of course it will."

"Can you tell us a little bit more about what is, what is — what discussed about how," the reporter continued.

“Just so you know, you could ask me this, I find that question insulting and ridiculous and, frankly, ludicrous," Pompeo said. "I just have to be honest with you, it’s a game and one ought not to play games with serious matters like this."

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#2037856 14-Jun-2018 20:21

Fred99: Trump-Kim Deal Signals North Korea May Never Give Up Its Nukes

“I don’t think it would be the end of the world, because it’s the world we already live in,” he said. “My worry is that the president keeps promising that Kim will give up his weapons. If he suddenly wakes up one day and realizes what’s really going on, he could just explode, and then we’re in real trouble.”

...

"Saddam gave up his nuclear program and died; Qaddafi gave up his program and died; Kim didn’t give up, built a bunch of nuclear weapons and not only stays alive but gets rewarded. That is not a good message to be sending out.’’

Article in Bloomberg.

I consider that Bloomberg, with an editor in chief ex "The Economist" is a reasonably neutral publication, not prone to publishing opinion pieces which are provocatively sensational or liberal leaning.

Its a very fair article, accepting NK as a nuclear state is often discussed as an option. There are three outcomes. NK goes CVID and everyone lives happily ever after. They fail and decieve, so we revert back to last year. Or they keep them and the US pushes the UN to retain sanctions, albeit other countries may vote for reducing these over time. The US builds up personnel in the region, so we end up with last year as well. 6 months will tell us which.

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#2037861 14-Jun-2018 20:25

freitasm:

Sure:

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo blasted a reporter on Wednesday after the journalist asked why the denuclearization of North Korea was not included in an agreement signed between the country's leader, Kim Jong Un, and President Trump.

“The president said it will be verified," the reporter said to Pompeo in South Korea, to which Pompeo responded, "Of course it will."

"Can you tell us a little bit more about what is, what is — what discussed about how," the reporter continued.

“Just so you know, you could ask me this, I find that question insulting and ridiculous and, frankly, ludicrous," Pompeo said. "I just have to be honest with you, it’s a game and one ought not to play games with serious matters like this."

I agree with Pompeo. Probably the most grounded and experienced US person involved in this issue.

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#2037917 14-Jun-2018 23:14

tdgeek:

I agree with Pompeo. Probably the most grounded and experienced US person involved in this issue.

He's a war-mongering religious extremist of the worst kind. This is him:

“America had worshipped other Gods and called it multiculturalism. We’d endorsed perversion and called it an alternative lifestyle.” He lamented government efforts to “rip faith from our schools” and then segued immediately into a discussion of the jihadi threat: “This evil is all around us.” Pompeo concluded by describing politics as “a never-ending struggle … until the rapture.”

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#2037928 15-Jun-2018 06:21

Fred99:

tdgeek:

I agree with Pompeo. Probably the most grounded and experienced US person involved in this issue.

He's a war-mongering religious extremist of the worst kind. This is him:

“America had worshipped other Gods and called it multiculturalism. We’d endorsed perversion and called it an alternative lifestyle.” He lamented government efforts to “rip faith from our schools” and then segued immediately into a discussion of the jihadi threat: “This evil is all around us.” Pompeo concluded by describing politics as “a never-ending struggle … until the rapture.”

He is a hard liner, thats fine with me. But he is close to Trump, is that the issue? The response to the journo was completely fair.

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#2038019 15-Jun-2018 08:26

He's not just a "hard liner" - in the text from him I quoted above, he's also an American evangelical who believes in rapture.
American reporters are far too churlish on the subject of religion to probe that further. They should when it comes to leaders with fingers close to the nuclear button. Some believers in rapture think the immediate prelude to rapture is inevitable nuclear war, some have the attitude "bring it on - it's about time for a cleanup". He is a religious extremist. It's not conceivable that someone with such extremist views could separate those views from their decision making processes. This reads like crazy CT - it isn't.

As far as his reaction to the reporter goes:

1) involved in withdrawal of US from a treaty with Iran - as in their opinion verification was flawed
2) meets with NK with #1 objective being full denuclearisation
3) comes back with an aspirational agreement signed - but no mention at all of verification
4) explodes when asked a perfectly reasonable question - whether verification had been discussed - as it's going to be the single most important part of ensuring compliance with any treaty - especially since the USA have thrown all their toys out of the cot.
5) calls a perfectly reasonable question "insulting" and "ridiculous".

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#2038028 15-Jun-2018 08:48

Fred99:

He's not just a "hard liner" - in the text from him I quoted above, he's also an American evangelical who believes in the concept of rapture.
American reporters are far too churlish on the subject of religion to probe that further. They should when it comes to leaders with fingers close to the nuclear button. Some believers in rapture think the immediate prelude to rapture is inevitable nuclear war, some have the attitude "bring it on - it's about time for a cleanup". He is a religious extremist. It's not conceivable that someone with such extremist views could separate those views from their decision making processes. This reads like crazy CT - it isn't.

As far as his reaction to the reporter goes:

1) involved in withdrawal of US from a treaty with Iran - as in their opinion verification was flawed
2) meets with NK with #1 objective being full denuclearisation
3) comes back with an aspirational agreement signed - but no mention at all of verification
4) explodes when asked a perfectly reasonable question - whether verification had been discussed - as it's going to be the single most important part of ensuring compliance with any treaty - especially since the USA have thrown all their toys out of the cot.
5) calls a perfectly reasonable question "insulting" and "ridiculous".

What do you expect from a less than 5 hour meeting? Everything nailed down to the last minute and detail? The detail that you and the news seeking journo's want can come next. While Pompeo and others have been doing background stuff over there, that meeting could have lasted 5 minutes if KJU came on like the tough guy, or Trump acted like he usually does. So the charm offensive worked, a 1.5 page list of intentions, now the work can begin. As far as CVID is concerned, it was very clear in the press conference that it was disarmament and inspections, and sooner than later. Trump said that to the world. Pompeo clarified that complete means complete and that NK are aware of that, hence Trump stating dismantling and inspections to the world, there was no vagueness about that. The perfectly reasonable question had already been answered, more than once in the over one hour press conference. The Iran agreement was 150 odd pages, high detail, it took ages to put together.

Now that this meet and greet has occurred, now the work starts.

And all this has nothing to do with Trump or Pompeo. Its been put together by KJU. This topic is about North Korea talks, essentially will they work or not, its not about hating Trump or his cronies. The pity is if all this works out he will look good, although he has played an extremely minor part in the affair, its all about North Korea lining their ducks in a row, and executing what they planned for. They win. The US will think they won, wrong. If it works out, NK will get what they want, the world will have peace there, and the US will still grumble over NK

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#2041168 20-Jun-2018 15:20

Kim Jong Un is in China for two days of talks.

Here's a translation/summary from the Chinese FT site:

The North Korean leader visited China for the third time this year in an effort to restore North Korea-China trade. Analysts said that in view of the Sino-U.S. trade war, Chinese leaders may respond to requests.

North Korean leader Kim Jong Un launched a third visit to China this year seeking to ease sanctions, the latest in a series of diplomatic efforts after his summit with Donald Trump this month.

Yesterday, the Jin Zhengen team, escorted by the Chinese police, marched along Chang An Street, the aorta of the center of Beijing. The official Xinhua News Agency of China stated that the visit will last for two days.

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#2041306 20-Jun-2018 19:25

Love to be a Chinese or Korean speaking fly on the wall when they talked about the Trump meeting.

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#2041309 20-Jun-2018 19:29

linw:

Love to be a Chinese or Korean speaking fly on the wall when they talked about the Trump meeting.

Yep, played him. Russia and China have secretly eased sanctions. No matter, Trump is just USA, its jut one country, plus his hands are full of lies at the moment.

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#2041360 20-Jun-2018 21:18

tdgeek:

Trump is just USA, its jut one country, plus his hands are full of lies at the moment.

Trump is leader of the largest economy on earth, with a military budget / capability larger than the next 8 nations combined.

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#2041453 21-Jun-2018 07:15

Fred99:

tdgeek:

Trump is just USA, its jut one country, plus his hands are full of lies at the moment.

Trump is leader of the largest economy on earth, with a military budget / capability larger than the next 8 nations combined.

Its only just the largest economy. As to military, who of the other top 8 would they attack?

Fred99

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#2042763 23-Jun-2018 11:16

tdgeek:

Fred99:

tdgeek:

Trump is just USA, its jut one country, plus his hands are full of lies at the moment.

Trump is leader of the largest economy on earth, with a military budget / capability larger than the next 8 nations combined.

Its only just the largest economy. As to military, who of the other top 8 would they attack?

No - it's still by far the largest economy - GDP US$ trillions

USA 21.4

China 14

Japan 5.1

Germany 4.2

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#2042914 23-Jun-2018 16:58

Fred99:

tdgeek:

Fred99:

tdgeek:

Trump is just USA, its jut one country, plus his hands are full of lies at the moment.

Trump is leader of the largest economy on earth, with a military budget / capability larger than the next 8 nations combined.

Its only just the largest economy. As to military, who of the other top 8 would they attack?

No - it's still by far the largest economy - GDP US$ trillions

USA 21.4

China 14

Japan 5.1

Germany 4.2

Not according to this https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/022415/worlds-top-10-economies.asp

We often hear that China will take over in a few years. China is developing, the US is old and has poor and neglected infrastructure. Think of it has a grand house that hasn't been maintained. Also, the US population of 300 million is developed, China has yet to develope its 1.3 Billion.

EU GDP is 17.1 a major. The world needs to get over the US superpower. They can waste public funds to be the military superpower if that makes them feel good

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