Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Forums › Politics › Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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floydbloke

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#2551093 28-Aug-2020 08:41

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Rikkitic:

Gurezaemon:

Shutting down people because they don't agree with you? Sounds like a good way to reinforce an echo-chamber.

Read my posts before you comment on them. I am not advocating shutting anyone down, just remarking on the pointlessness of the poster's contributions. This has a very long history.

This whole thread contains plenty of cartoons and memes that are pointless. These get plenty of up-votes rather than being remarked upon as being pointless.

Did Eric Clapton really think she looked wonderful...or was it after the 15th outfit she tried on and he just wanted to get to the party and get a drink?

nathan

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#2551096 28-Aug-2020 08:50

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On gun crime in America:

Rikkitic

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#2551098 28-Aug-2020 08:52

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It amuses me that the troll has achieved his purpose. Instead if uniting against Trump, we are fighting amongst ourselves. That is what trolls do.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

freitasm

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#2551109 28-Aug-2020 09:00

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Rikkitic:

It amuses me that the troll has achieved his purpose. Instead if uniting against Trump, we are fighting amongst ourselves. That is what trolls do.

There's a debate going on. The question is "Can someone purportedly not support Trump while criticising other options, even if this could bring a second term of the Orange Turd?"

The question has one answer: yes.

People posting other views is not trolling. It may look strange but it is not.

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freitasm

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#2551111 28-Aug-2020 09:01

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Also, in addition to my previous comment, if the USA decides to elect the Orange Turd again, or if Donald steals the election then other nations will have to adjust and make sure the USA has less and less influence as the days past.

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Gurezaemon

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#2551114 28-Aug-2020 09:04

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neb:
Gurezaemon: I try to spend a few minutes every day checking out Fox, OAN, etc., just to keep aware of what is being said in that universe. It can be painful at times.
Try doing it via Trevor Noah, via his Daily Show Channel, you get the necessary clipping service from the far-right media followed by Noah methodically pulling them to pieces, it's much more palatable than going direct to the source.

A great idea in principle, and I'm a huge fan of Trevor Noah (if you haven't, check out his book Born a Crime), but I rather think this misses the point.
No one would try in good faith to learn about (for example) country music by listening to people making fun of its hokey chord changes, etc. You need a willingness to listen and consider the content on its merits. If you find it doesn't actually have any merits, then at least you can say you've tried.
Only listening to viewpoints you find unpalatable when they are being mocked (as opposed to being discussed calmly) is really only reinforcing your prejudices, and further contributing to the echo-chamber effect.

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#2551120 28-Aug-2020 09:15

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The Washington Post - The 5-Minute Fix: What the Hatch Act is and why it matters

today

The general gist of this law, called the Hatch Act, is that government officials aren’t supposed to share their political opinions on the job.

They work for all Americans, from top Cabinet members on down to your average federal bureaucrat. (The president and vice president are exempt from most parts of this law.)

So when Secretary of State Mike Pompeo talks about how deserving Trump is of reelection from an official diplomatic trip in Jerusalem, or when first lady Melania Trump campaigns for her husband from the Rose Garden of the White House, or when numerous White House officials like Ivanka Trump speak at the convention, often from a federal building, that’s the definition of violating this law, say some experts.

At the very least, it’s a lack of respect for the spirit of it.

Local, state and federal officials over the decades found to have violated it have been fired.

Trump administration officials have not. ...

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Rikkitic

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#2551140 28-Aug-2020 09:55

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Just to be clear, my objection to a certain poster here is not to the views expressed as such, but to the sense of hopelessness he appears to be trying to spread. His posts are relentlessly negative, as well as annoyingly repetitive. He keeps endlessly regurgitating the same mantra, again and again and again, and this has been going on since he started posting here.

His message seems to be that every (American) politician is hopelessly corrupt, as is the system itself, and this extends back many years through every part of the government. It makes no difference who you vote for. They are all equally venal. There is no point in trying. We might as well just give up and resign ourselves to it.

He does seem to think Bernie Sanders is marginally less awful than Biden, but Sanders is not the candidate. If Trump is to be defeated, those who do believe there is a real choice to be made, have to work with that they have got. What is the point of going on about Sanders? This just sows more confusion and dissension.

I am not advocating that the poster be silenced, annoying as he is. I simply suggested that he might get a better reception for his messages of despair in another forum.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

kingdragonfly

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#2551248 28-Aug-2020 12:41

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US ambassador Scott Brown is a controversial Trump appointment.

He made news again yesterday, and not the good kind.

------------------------------------
Dodging manage isolation
------------------------------------

RNZ: US ambassador Scott Brown dodges managed isolation in New Zealand after US trip

"Brown, who boasts close ties to President Donald Trump, and his wife Gail chose instead to self-isolate at his Lower Hutt home.

The New Zealand government can't force diplomats into managed isolation, because of international immunity rules.

But they do advise diplomats to undergo the 14-day stint in managed isolation facilities, which is mandatory for most other travellers to protect New Zealanders from exposure to Covid-19.

The US has failed to get the outbreak under control. In Brown's home country, the disease continues to claim nearly 1000 lives each day. There are now more than 5.7 million confirmed infections and about 178,000 deaths as a result of Covid-19 in the country, one of the worst tolls in the developed world.

Brown recently made the trip from Wellington to Washington where he met Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, deputy Secretary Stephen Biegun, US Trade Representative Ambassador Robert Lighthizer, and New Zealand's Ambassador to the US Rosemary Banks.

Managed isolation rules came into force here in April."

Despite his assurances that he's clean, I somehow doubt he flew in by himself, and drove himself to his home. I'm sure there's quite a few people he came into contact with.

------------------------------------
His history
------------------------------------

He had a less than ordinary start as US ambassador, the headlines focusing on a controversial past even before he arrived.

He has posed nude as a male model. He has supported waterboard torture. Former Fox News host Andrea Tantaros claimed in a lawsuit that as a senator he made sexually inappropriate comments to her while on set and put his hands on her lower waist.

"Whether you like it or not Trump's a man of his word and that's one thing I've always respected about him. Will he get a fair go from the American people, or from the world, New Zealanders and other media outlets? Gosh I hope so because I think it's critically important to give anybody who's in a new position, a new position as the President of the US, or the Prime Minister of this country - I don't care who, give them a chance first before you start criticising."

From the Guardian:

two complaints investigated by the US state department against Brown originally came from two female peace corps volunteers who were at the event, and who served food and drink to the guests as a way to flip the cultural norm of Samoans serving westerners.

But in addition to these complaints are others that the ambassador’s behaviour was “shocking”, “culturally insensitive”, “rude” and “undiplomatic”. The Guardian contacted more than a dozen people who attended the party and spoke to a number who said he had made them feel uncomfortable.

One woman told the Guardian that Brown allegedly stared at her body when she was introduced to him. She did not want to be identified, but said: “The first time I met him, he looked at my chest immediately.” She alleged that another female colleague had a similar experience.

“I felt immediately uncomfortable and it didn’t feel right,” she added.

A male ex-peace corps volunteer described a strained atmosphere developing at the party as the ambassador shouted at guests to be quiet and listen to him. “It was very culturally insensitive,” said the man. “He just did multiple things in 15 seconds that really put me off, and looking around [I] saw it put off a lot of other people as well.

“At least twice, maybe three times, he was telling everybody, ‘Stop talking, be quiet, listen to me.’”

Another ex-peace corps volunteer called Brown’s speech “really pompous and sort of shocking”. The man, who again did not want to be named, said he approached Brown after his speech, hoping to gauge the man representing his country.

The former volunteer described their exchange as “candid”, and claimed Brown became aggressive when he mentioned he was disappointed by Trump’s actions following his inauguration. According to the volunteer, Brown angrily told him to “get over it”.

------------------------------------
He should count himself lucky to be in New Zealand
------------------------------------

Per his pleading, I think we've given him a chance in New Zealand.

As a diplomat he's legally immune. Perhaps he should count his blessing as one of the handful of Americans who can come-and-go from the COVID-19 hotspot that is the US.

Obeying New Zealand laws would be ...well.. diplomatic.

floydbloke

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#2551255 28-Aug-2020 12:57

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Rikkitic:

nathan:

No, just a voter and taxpayer who cares about policies. Politics is about policies, and its weird how this group doesn't want to discuss the policies that got Trump elected, just how offensive he is.

... Nobody here cares what you think about the policies that got Trump elected. Nobody cares what you think about anything. ...

Speak for yourself.

I read nearly every post in this thread but choose not to contribute much because I've got nothing to add.

I do happen to also think that Trump is a prize plonker and generally detest the man and his behaviour (although perhaps not with the same level of venomous hatred portrayed by yourself and some of the other posters here) and struggle to understand how someone like that could be in the position that was once regarded as the most powerful in the world.

But this is exactly why I enjoy reading Nathan's posts in here as well. They give some insight as to why the situation has got where it has got to, and the general clustermess that is US politics, and don't want Nathan to stop posting.

.....or you could ask a mod to rename it to the Trump Abuse thread and request to have all posts that don't conform removed.

Did Eric Clapton really think she looked wonderful...or was it after the 15th outfit she tried on and he just wanted to get to the party and get a drink?

SaltyNZ

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#2551256 28-Aug-2020 12:57

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kingdragonfly:

As a diplomat he's legally immune.

Unless we declare him Persona Non Grata, and then we can kick him out. Ordinarily this would be a very big deal. But these are not normal circumstances:

It's not just some silly local custom (I mean, let's forget about the fact that the whole point of a diplomat is to be diplomatic) or unreasonably onerous restriction. It is a perfectly reasonable requirement that is designed to protect the whole country from a potentially devastating situation. Look how disruptive it's been not knowing where the Auckland outbreak came from. That's what we're trying to avoid
It may piss Donald Trump off (if he even spares more than a nanosecond's attention at all) but there has to come a point at which we stop sucking up to him and his sycophants simply because it is expedient, and in my opinion we're past that point
I doubt Joe Biden will hold it against us

In the event that Trump wins another four years, we're going to want to increasingly distance ourselves from the US anyway, as will the rest of the globe.

Get him out.

EDIT: I accidentally a word

iPad Pro 11" + iPhone 15 Pro Max + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

Rikkitic

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#2551272 28-Aug-2020 13:19

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floydbloke:

Speak for yourself.

I read nearly every post in this thread but choose not to contribute much because I've got nothing to add.

I do happen to also think that Trump is a prize plonker and generally detest the man and his behaviour (although perhaps not with the same level of venomous hatred portrayed by yourself and some of the other posters here) and struggle to understand how someone like that could be in the position that was once regarded as the most powerful in the world.

But this is exactly why I enjoy reading Nathan's posts in here as well. They give some insight as to why the situation has got where it has got to, and the general clustermess that is US politics, and don't want Nathan to stop posting.

.....or you could ask a mod to rename it to the Trump Abuse thread and request to have all posts that don't conform removed.

I honestly don't see what they add to anything, but of course you and anyone else are free to disagree. As far as I can tell, all of his posts are just different versions of the same thing - how corrupt and broken the system in the USA is, how corrupt and broken every politician is, how nothing anybody does can make a difference. It is worth hearing that once or twice as a different perspective. It is not worth hearing it again and again and again. It adds nothing new and just gets annoying.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

floydbloke

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#2551275 28-Aug-2020 13:29

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Rikkitic:

floydbloke:

Speak for yourself.

I read nearly every post in this thread but choose not to contribute much because I've got nothing to add.

I do happen to also think that Trump is a prize plonker and generally detest the man and his behaviour (although perhaps not with the same level of venomous hatred portrayed by yourself and some of the other posters here) and struggle to understand how someone like that could be in the position that was once regarded as the most powerful in the world.

But this is exactly why I enjoy reading Nathan's posts in here as well. They give some insight as to why the situation has got where it has got to, and the general clustermess that is US politics, and don't want Nathan to stop posting.

.....or you could ask a mod to rename it to the Trump Abuse thread and request to have all posts that don't conform removed.

I honestly don't see what they add to anything, but of course you and anyone else are free to disagree. As far as I can tell, all of his posts are just different versions of the same thing - how corrupt and broken the system in the USA is, how corrupt and broken every politician is, how nothing anybody does can make a difference. It is worth hearing that once or twice as a different perspective. It is not worth hearing it again and again and again. It adds nothing new and just gets annoying.

You could say the same thing about the anti-trump posts.

Did Eric Clapton really think she looked wonderful...or was it after the 15th outfit she tried on and he just wanted to get to the party and get a drink?

Rikkitic

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#2551280 28-Aug-2020 13:42

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floydbloke:

You could say the same thing about the anti-trump posts.

You could but no-one has to look at those. I guess the same could be said for individual posts here, but they are harder to ignore in the middle of the thread. Anyway, I don't think any purpose is served by discussing this further so I will be moving on.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

neb

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#2551437 28-Aug-2020 16:29

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Gurezaemon:
A great idea in principle, and I'm a huge fan of Trevor Noah (if you haven't, check out his book Born a Crime), but I rather think this misses the point.
No one would try in good faith to learn about (for example) country music by listening to people making fun of its hokey chord changes, etc. You need a willingness to listen and consider the content on its merits.

The problem is that the political stuff on Fox and even more so OANN is so completely bats**t crazy that I just tune out after a few seconds. To me it's the same as the nutters on Queen St. on Friday evening yelling about how the aliens are coming or whatever it is they shout about. So having it digested and commented on means it can maintain my attention rather than just tuning out the nutcase(s).

I can see your point, but I think that Noah and similar provide the best way of absorbing it. It's also a sad reflection on the state of US political reporting, pointed out some years ago by some political commentator or other, that you get better political analysis from late-night comedians than actual media sources.

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