$108 million to rebuild a Cathedral, or 10-14 million a year to provide free lunches in low decile schools??

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Forums › Politics › $108 million to rebuild a Cathedral, or 10-14 million a year to provide free lunches in low decile schools??

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Wiggum

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#1862239 11-Sep-2017 11:33

MikeB4:

Have you heard the term "change in circumstances" ? Many start off in good positions but due to loss of partner, loss of job(s), illness etc etc their lives turn to disaster beyond their control and they are no longer in the position to feed, house clothe when previously they could.

In NZ is pays to have plenty of kids. It makes financial sense for somebody not willing to work, to have many kids. Thats wrong IMO, change of circumstances or not.

MikeB4

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#1862245 11-Sep-2017 11:37

Wiggum:

MikeB4:

Have you heard the term "change in circumstances" ? Many start off in good positions but due to loss of partner, loss of job(s), illness etc etc their lives turn to disaster beyond their control and they are no longer in the position to feed, house clothe when previously they could.

In NZ is pays to have plenty of kids. It makes financial sense for somebody not willing to work, to have many kids. Thats wrong IMO, change of circumstances or not.

That is a load of nonsense, you are just making garbage up.

sen8or

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#1862253 11-Sep-2017 11:49

MikeB4:

Wiggum:

MikeB4:

Have you heard the term "change in circumstances" ? Many start off in good positions but due to loss of partner, loss of job(s), illness etc etc their lives turn to disaster beyond their control and they are no longer in the position to feed, house clothe when previously they could.

In NZ is pays to have plenty of kids. It makes financial sense for somebody not willing to work, to have many kids. Thats wrong IMO, change of circumstances or not.

That is a load of nonsense, you are just making garbage up.

Pot / Kettle?

MikeB4

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#1862257 11-Sep-2017 11:55

sen8or:

Pot / Kettle?

My posts have been based on real life experience of working for close to 30 years in paid and voluntary social services.

Wiggum

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#1862258 11-Sep-2017 11:57

MikeB4:

Wiggum:

MikeB4:

Have you heard the term "change in circumstances" ? Many start off in good positions but due to loss of partner, loss of job(s), illness etc etc their lives turn to disaster beyond their control and they are no longer in the position to feed, house clothe when previously they could.

In NZ is pays to have plenty of kids. It makes financial sense for somebody not willing to work, to have many kids. Thats wrong IMO, change of circumstances or not.

That is a load of nonsense, you are just making garbage up.

Go do the maths, then come back and tell me if its more cost effective for a single mom with more than 2 kids to work 8hours a day (minimum wage), or be jobless and receive the following weekly benefit payments:

- A weekly payment which helps me with one or more dependent children.

- A weekly payment which helps people with their rent, board or the cost of owning a home.

- A weekly payment which helps someone who can''t meet their essential living costs from what they earn or from other sources.

https://www.workandincome.govt.nz/eligibility/index.html

Wiggum

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#1862260 11-Sep-2017 11:59

MikeB4:

sen8or:

Pot / Kettle?

My posts have been based on real life experience of working for close to 30 years in paid and voluntary social services.

Have you ever been to Africa or any other 3rd world country and witnessed poverty? Well my posts are based on that.

We lucky in NZ, we have a fantastic welfare/social system. No need to throw even more money at it. I would much rather see that money go overseas to countries that desperately need it.

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#1862294 11-Sep-2017 12:16

Wiggum:

Go do the maths, then come back and tell me if its more cost effective for a single mom with more than 2 kids to work 8hours a day (minimum wage), or be jobless and receive the following weekly benefit payments:

- A weekly payment which helps me with one or more dependent children.

- A weekly payment which helps people with their rent, board or the cost of owning a home.

- A weekly payment which helps someone who can''t meet their essential living costs from what they earn or from other sources.

https://www.workandincome.govt.nz/eligibility/index.html

MSD's website shows one side of the ledger

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Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

Rikkitic

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#1862297 11-Sep-2017 12:18

networkn:

I am happy with this news. There is funding for both projects. I don't think you need to be religious to see the value this magnificent building presents for NZ and for Christchurch. After the quakes, CHCH has appeared a little soulless compared to pre-quake with it's older buildings replaced by predominately modern buildings.

I am hopeful the Cathedral will continue to draw people to the center of the CBD and rebuild some of the sense of community that used to be a prime reason for visiting, once again.

After spending time in Europe with it's amazing historical beautiful buildings, it's a shame we barely have anything to compare.

I am from Europe and when I did my pre-earthquake tiki tour of New Zealand I made a point of seeing the cathedral. I honestly thought it was rather drab and uninspiring compared to the magnificent edifices Europe is so rich in. It just struck me as a poor attempt at imitation. I have nothing against it and if Christchurch thinks it is an important symbol of the city then by all means they should have it, but I wasn't particularly impressed by it. I thought the Arts Centre was much better, both architecturally and as a place to experience.

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Rikkitic

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#1862299 11-Sep-2017 12:22

Wiggum:

amiga500: Our politicians are fast to find millions to pay for fleets of BMWs and transport projects yet c
ome up with dozens of reasons why giving poor hungry kids two decent meals a day at school is a bad idea.
Providing these is hardly a new idea - it's just that NZ has not done what many other countries have done for generations. Shame on the politicians who voted against this bill..

Its a bad idea because it takes the responsibility from parents, and places it on schools/government. In short, it will make already bad parents even worse.

If a child is hungry at school it should never be the schools/governments fault. Bad parenting needs to be tackled.

I'm sure that will satisfy the child's hunger pangs.

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Rikkitic

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#1862301 11-Sep-2017 12:28

networkn:

I used to feel one way about kids and lunches being provided by charity/state, but ultimately you can't punish children for their parents stupidity, lack of responsibility, or poor parenting skills. You also can't punish kids for parents with low incomes that struggle. Kids should be getting 3 meals a day.

I do think however, that it shouldn't be a one pronged approach and parents who continually can't feed their kids should be supervised or assisted with budgeting, family management skills etc. It's a really hard thing though, because it's very complex and complicated.

This!

While everyone sits around debating bad parenting the kids suffer. It doesn't matter whose fault it is. Just f-ing feed them, for christsake. Then you can satisfy your need to punish the parents.

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Rikkitic

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#1862304 11-Sep-2017 12:41

Wiggum:

Have you ever been to Africa or any other 3rd world country and witnessed poverty? Well my posts are based on that.

We lucky in NZ, we have a fantastic welfare/social system. No need to throw even more money at it. I would much rather see that money go overseas to countries that desperately need it.

You sure do have a peculiar way of looking at things. Yes, I have been in countries where extreme poverty exists. Yes, the worst here is not as bad as the worst elsewhere. That does not make the worst here in any way acceptable. You stated somewhere that charity begins at home. I happen to believe that charity begins wherever there is need. I suggested, based on previous comments of yours, that you might want to consider expressing your charity by taking in some needy foster children. You came back with a flippant reply that there were plenty of foster parents in New Zealand. In fact, that is not the case. At this moment there is a huge shortage and children are suffering as a result. You have a big mouth about a lot of things, but I wonder what you actually do to make things better.

I happen to know that many people here on Geekzone actively support a wide range of charities. They don't mention it because they are not looking for credit or points with god. They do it because they feel it is the right thing to do. I am a pensioner and I don't have a lot of money but I also support charities in New Zealand and overseas. What do you do?

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Wiggum

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#1862321 11-Sep-2017 13:17

Rikkitic:

You stated somewhere that charity begins at home. I happen to believe that charity begins wherever there is need. I suggested, based on previous comments of yours, that you might want to consider expressing your charity by taking in some needy foster children. You came back with a flippant reply that there were plenty of foster parents in New Zealand. In fact, that is not the case. At this moment there is a huge shortage and children are suffering as a result. You have a big mouth about a lot of things, but I wonder what you actually do to make things better.

I happen to know that many people here on Geekzone actively support a wide range of charities. They don't mention it because they are not looking for credit or points with god. They do it because they feel it is the right thing to do. I am a pensioner and I don't have a lot of money but I also support charities in New Zealand and overseas. What do you do?

You obviously not familiar with the phrase "charity begins at home". Let me fill you in, it means a person's first responsibility is for the needs of their own family and friends.

Think about it for a few minutes before you come back with your flippant reply.

If you have spare money (you will on the 1st April 2018) and your own family/friends are in desperate need, where is that spare money better spent? Giving it back to the tax system so that government can decide how to distribute it? Or giving it to somebody close to you?

Adopting foster children has nothing to do with charity beginning at home. I suggest you go do some research on this topic too, because there really is not a huge shortage here.

I have already stated elsewhere that I donate to an origination. I do this because I have witnessed first hand what poverty is. Go read my past posts. Wont mention it again because you feel mentioning it means I am looking for credit.

Wiggum

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#1862328 11-Sep-2017 13:30

Adopting foster children would be a stupid decision because we simply can't afford it. We already have 2 kids, and don't plan to have any more. If we had to foster a few kids then unfortunately my own kids would suffer and we would have less for them. Same reason as to why we have not had more kids of our own.

Volunteering/giving to charities is always a good thing, but putting that as a higher priority than ones own kids/family is bad advise IMO.

You seem to be making out that because I'm not fostering any kids I'm a bad person. Grow up.

Charity begins at home.

Rikkitic

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#1862332 11-Sep-2017 13:33

Wiggum:

Adopting foster children has nothing to do with charity beginning at home. I suggest you go do some research on this topic too, because there really is not a huge shortage here.

Yup, I did some research. Maybe you should, too.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/338811/foster-parent-shortage-leading-to-placement-problems

http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/201857462/foster-parent-shortage-hurting-kids-caregivers-oranga-tamariki

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Rikkitic

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#1862341 11-Sep-2017 13:41

Wiggum:

You seem to be making out that because I'm not fostering any kids I'm a bad person. Grow up.

Nope. I'm just saying you should put your money where your mouth is. That is just an example.

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