Christchurch Mosque Shooting

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98 posts

Master Geek
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#2202497 20-Mar-2019 16:46

kingdragonfly:
the real cause of the bloodshed on New Zealand streets today is the immigration programme which allowed Muslim fanatics to migrate to New Zealand in the first place ... Muslims may have been the victim today, but usually they are the perpetrators

Holy sh1t! That might be the worst possible response...

I would actually be interested in seeing some stats on terror attacks that are mulsims vs Christian or what ever.

gulfa

321 posts

Ultimate Geek
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#2202498 20-Mar-2019 16:50

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12214570

Here is a link about possible court procedure to deal with this case

Rikkitic

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#2202500 20-Mar-2019 17:06

I have never dipped my toes in extremist waters. I had a sort of vague general awareness of some of what was out there, but I hadn't experienced it and I didn't really know what it was like. I have never even had a Facebook or Twitter account. My social media experience has mainly been limited to Geekzone and, for a brief time many years ago, Kiwiblog and Whaleoil. I have cruised around the Internet, but not really stopped anywhere except on some specialist technical sites. I briefly looked at 4chan several years ago, but I didn't hang around. I truly did not know how vile some of these other sites, like Kiwi Farms really are. I guess I am naive. I have led a sheltered life.

Reading about Kiwi Farms (I didn't go there) and the person behind it, and thinking about the piece of nastiness arrested yesterday who broke down in tears and then ran from the press, I think that if anything really is to be done about extremist behaviour, the entire way the Internet is set up will somehow have to be completely overhauled. I doubt that is even possible. But it seems to me that social networking sites and blogs and chat rooms and all other forms of group communications on the Internet are directly connected to the rise of extremism. Some offer anonymity and that is probably part of it, but I think an even bigger factor may just be psychological distancing. Even when people are not anonymous they are less inhibited by social conventions of acceptable behaviour when sitting in the privacy of their home behind a computer screen. I think this acts as an enabler for some, allowing them to express their worst instincts and say things they never would dare to say to someone face to face. It is easier to be rude and crude to a keyboard than to someone looking you in the eye. It is easier to agree with racist statements and jump in with your own. I think it is possible that the Internet is an even more significant, and less understood, facilitator of extremist behaviour than many realise. If this is true, it may really be leading us on a path to hell.

It may be that the way people communicate on the Internet will have to change. The person who was arrested yesterday felt untouchable enough to say truly horrible things through his computer, but wept and ran away when exposed to a judge and the questioning press. He must have felt very humiliated. I wonder if the arrogant filthy-mouthed Kiwi Farms a$$hole would react the same if he had to account for himself to a non-supportive public in the cold light of day without his mother to comfort him? Somehow the Internet has to be changed so these people cannot hide behind technology any longer. If someone wants to say hateful things they have to be made to do it in public, in person.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

kingdragonfly

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#2202505 20-Mar-2019 17:28

gulfa:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12214570

Here is a link about possible court procedure to deal with this case

I think it's reasonable to hold this trial behind closed doors.

I am a freedom of speech nut, even for the most abhorrent speech and displays.

However New Zealand has shown itself it be extremely fair in its court system than most countries.

Obviously our court system is not perfect, and I assume the court transcripts will all be public domain eventually.

A closed door hearing is a reasonable way of cooling off extremist coverage, removing some oxygen from terrorists.

kingdragonfly

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#2202520 20-Mar-2019 18:04

timmay556: I would actually be interested in seeing some stats on terror attacks that are mulsims vs Christian or what ever.

It's hard to score a game where everyone loses. Obviously the winners are those that never participate.

ESRI makes a lot of maps, including one called "Terrorist Attacks" from 2017.

https://storymaps.esri.com/stories/terrorist-attacks/

The anti-defamation league is probably the best source. They have a large number of research tools. The ADL is a Jewish non-governmental organization based in the United States, however they make a real effort to be unbiased.

https://www.adl.org/

Here's a sample article

https://www.adl.org/blog/white-supremacist-terrorist-attack-at-mosques-in-new-zealand

White Supremacist Terrorist Attack at Mosques in New Zealand

In the latest indication that violent white supremacists pose an international terrorist threat, an apparent white supremacist went on a shooting rampage at two mosques in central Christchurch, New Zealand on Friday, reportedly killing 50 people and wounding many others.

Australian police have identified the alleged shooter as *********, a 28-year-old Australian-born man.

This latest white supremacist violence underscores the fact that white supremacy is a global threat whose ideology manifests around the world and results in acts of violence in many instances.

Tarrant apparently used social media to amplify his attack, streaming a live video of the shooting on Facebook, which was then posted on other platforms such as YouTube. He also appears to have posted a manifesto online just prior to the shooting.

...

Batman

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#2202521 20-Mar-2019 18:08

timmay556: Very interesting how the first world is up in arms about the NZ video with websites blocked (albeit only for a layman) yet anyone can watch civilians of other countries being raped, beating, blown up, tortured and shot on a host of websites right now.

QFT

Oblivian

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#2202524 20-Mar-2019 18:35

Focus in the wrong areas again. But I guess that's going to happen since the multitude of threads people keep bringing up end up the same and closed.

Overseas material separate from recent events is still objectionable material. Still covered in legislation here to even view it.

Which is backed up normally by (many more than just this type of clause)

Your Responsibilities

You must not use or permit our Services to be used in any way, which;

Breaks any law; or

Infringes anyone's rights; or

Is malicious, obscene or offensive; or

Morality. If you aren't in a mind to actively seek it out. You likely aren't going to know it possibly exists to report it. And if you do seek it out, you probably aren't going to admit it due knowing deep down about above.

Back to the topic at hand.

This puts the number of flowers into perspective.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111427676/drone-footage-shows-scale-of-floral-tributes-to-christchurch-shooting-victims

chatterbox

204 posts

Master Geek

#2202566 20-Mar-2019 19:52

gulfa:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12214570

Here is a link about possible court procedure to deal with this case

There was another one from stuff about the benefits of charging him with murder vs terrorism. I think terrorism gave him a platform as you were looking at comparing ideology whereas murder doesn't. At least in this country.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111369385/unenviable-job-for-judge-in-christchurch-mosque-shooting-case

I'm for whatever gives him the longest sentence with the reduced impact on victims, isn't drawn out and doesn't give him a platform.

I'm sure I read another article where the court could choose to hear from a lawyer instead of the gunman if he went off topic or on and on or something.

Never say never

kingdragonfly

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#2202581 20-Mar-2019 20:14

The Jim Jefferies Show,S03e01, came out recently.

Jim Jefferies is an Australian comedian, with a US show. He might be better know in the US than either Australia or New Zealand. He has spoken out frequently in the US for better gun control.

Anyhow, here's a transcript of his open.

Welcome to the Jim Jefferies Show. I'm Jim Jefferies.

As you know, last week 50 were killed and as many injured in two mosques in New Zealand.

I can only assume the best the government could offer was thoughts and prayers.

Plays clip of PM Ardern: "I can tell you right now: guns laws will change. Now is the time for change."

Ooooh! Plans and actions! Yes, after the tragedy New Zealand began working on gun reform.

See America it can be done.

I've had a lot of people message me saying things like

Hey Jim, doesn't your country have the strictest gun control laws in the world? It didn't stop this from happening. Where are your guns controls now?

And to that I say:

The laws are from Australia, where I'm from. This happened in New Zealand. New Zealand is a different country. Ok fellow? Thanks for reaching out.

In fact an Australian had to move to New Zealand because he couldn't get a gun in Australia.

He had to become an immigrant so he could (looking puzzled) so he could kill immigrants?

While a tragedy like this is rare in New Zealand, in the United States white supremist are responsible for 70% of the 427 extremist related killings over the last 10 years, far outnumbering the left-wing and Islamic extremists.

Why is this happening? Two things. A$$holes and the Internet.

A lot of white supremist ideas spread through obscure Reddit pages and 8Chan.

But most come from a little known website called YouTube.

Female announcer cuts to clip

You search for "What is the West?"

The first clip was fine, but YouTube quickly starting suggesting right-wing videos.

Eventually you hit a white power video talking about black IQs

This is how white supremacy gets normalized.

It's like Internet porn. When I first starting seeing double penetration porn, it disgusted me. DP they call it. But overtime I got extreme video recommendations I became brain washed and desensitized. Now I've gotten used to having two c**ks in me. The second hole is not my mouth.

YouTube gets more clicks by showing people crazy sh*t. It's too easy to find yourself going down a rabbit hole.

We gave it a try. We searched for our own show on YouTube. We got the result Jim Jefferies show: Why immigrants should be celebrated not feared.

YouTube recommended Inside South Africa's white displacement camp.

I like camping. That sounds fun.

Next was Why 95% of Californian are tired of illegal aliens? The person who posted this is clearly a conspiracy theorist, because he clearly mentions he will be speaking at "red pill expo"

This a common expression used by white supremist, borrowed from The Matrix, where they've seen the truth. So we're already getting into weird territory.

And next YouTube recommends this: "Why did white America allow a Muslim into Congress?"

networkn

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#2202590 20-Mar-2019 20:40

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12214723

Some good points made here.

tdgeek

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#2202619 20-Mar-2019 21:04

Oblivian:

Back to the topic at hand.

This puts the number of flowers into perspective.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111427676/drone-footage-shows-scale-of-floral-tributes-to-christchurch-shooting-victims

130 metres as reported this evening.

Kyanar

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#2202630 20-Mar-2019 21:38

Batman:

Yeah he's right? Unfortunately we can't force the FBI to get helicopters to raid his premises.

He's actually not right though. New Zealand and the United States have a Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty (UST 17-1212), Title 28 USC1782 also allows United States District Courts to order a person to produce evidence even without an MLAT to a foreign court or tribunal even before proceedings have been laid, and New Zealand Police are authorised under the Mutual Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters Act 1992 to request assistance from foreign governments in obtaining evidence. If he, as he has done, then proceeds to destroy evidence and encourage targets of discovery to tamper with evidence, he's committed a crime under US law as the evidence production order would come from a US District Court judge. The fool probably should have talked to a (competent) lawyer before shooting his mouth off.

dejadeadnz

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#2202664 20-Mar-2019 22:53

Batman: Beneficial Insulation owner arrested and charged with possession of objctionable material.

And remanded in custody. Well deserved.

chatterbox

204 posts

Master Geek

#2202666 20-Mar-2019 23:03

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/middle-east/man-sacked-deported-from-uae-for-celebrating-nz-mosque-shooting

Basically Singapore reporting on a UAE employee being deported for 'celebrating' the mosque killings via his Facebook account.

I hope many companies would make it known to their employees they have a zero-tolerance policy for inappropriate use of social media. Others have been fired for much less.

Never say never

DarthKermit

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#2202692 21-Mar-2019 07:37

I have no idea if all this publicity about white supremacy will drive the communication of such groups underground?

I think if I was a member of such a group and thought the way ********* does, I'd be keeping my thoughts and plans away from the mainstream media and social media.

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

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