3x Harvey Norman 55" 4K TVs $1,188 --> Which One?

Forums › Home Theatre (including HTPC and EPG Collector) › 3x Harvey Norman 55" 4K TVs $1,188 --> Which One?

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#1748164 26-Mar-2017 16:56

dafman:

Talkiet:

My friend upgraded from a Panasonic 55" Plasma (VT60 I think)...

That ain't no upgrade. Downgrade I believe.

I've sat in front of both TVs, in the same conditions, 30 minutes apart, watching the same material. As much as it pains me to admit it, some entry level UHD sets are better (to my eyes) than a great Plasma from 2013 (manf date)...

The upscaling (particularly of newer shows on Lightbox) is nothing short of magical. Black levels are the only area where there's a noticable difference and I am so busy being wowed by everything else I just don't care.

And that's an entry level Samsung... There are panel improvements (local dimming and other magickery) on newer panels that improve contrast and black levels further.

I'm a firm believer in economics as well - if the Plasma was genuinely better than a $1300 new UHD LCD set, then it would be worth more than $400 :-)

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

solaybro

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#1748217 26-Mar-2017 18:13

I've been looking at getting a new TV but all NZ TVs seem to be 50hz. After I was doing some research I read something about how the 50hz only refers to the power and that all 50hz TVs can output 60fps, but I have also read that this isn't true. Can a 50hz TV output at 60fps?

Dunnersfella

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#1748231 26-Mar-2017 18:35

Talkiet:

I'm a firm believer in economics as well - if the Plasma was genuinely better than a $1300 new UHD LCD set, then it would be worth more than $400 :-)

Cheers - N

Watch them side-by-side when there's panning shots / high speed action on-screen... and then you'll know.

OLED is the current top banana, but the motion is still poor at best.

LED's attract people like moths to a flame, because, well the sets are very bright.

To offer even slightly decent motion performance the amount of processing they put on the image is massive. This in turn drops the quality of the picture...

OLED's also suffer in this respect.

Still, if one of my plasmas dies, I'd have to bite the bullet and buy an OLED.

sbiddle

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#1748311 26-Mar-2017 20:18

solaybro:

I've been looking at getting a new TV but all NZ TVs seem to be 50hz. After I was doing some research I read something about how the 50hz only refers to the power and that all 50hz TVs can output 60fps, but I have also read that this isn't true. Can a 50hz TV output at 60fps?

Yes most will support 60Hz content and have done for many years. Many US panels however will not support 50Hz content meaning even if you buy a TV in the US it's useless in NZ if you want to display 50Hz content correctly.

At the end of the day you can have a 200Hz screen but all content is still 50Hz - the TV just interpolates frames to increase the frame rate to 200Hz.

Jaxson

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#1748525 27-Mar-2017 09:40

I may have to google this, but does anyone know what sort of Android hardware the TV is offering? As in what would it compare to, either tablet or cellphone wise?

I heard there is 16Gb of onboard memory, which seems pretty generous.

Jaxson

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#1750490 30-Mar-2017 08:48

Picked up the Sony and set to hanging it on the wall last night.

A few observations:

The thing is only 3cm wider than my 50" Panasonic Plasma, despite being a 55" TV. The difference is in the much smaller bevelled edge borders.
Overall it doesn't actually look any bigger, though it does seem more 16x9 in shape/flat rectangle, whereas the previous TV had much more depth in the frame at the bottom of the screen. Nowhere near as imposing as we'd thought, quite the same really.

None of the smart setup options worked. It seemed cool, apps in the room on cellphones etc could see the TV, but they all timed out. Eventually did a manual setup/google log in etc. This thing really is googlefied. No idea how stores get on selling these to the older generations?! Quite involved really if you don't have a google account etc.

Wifi connects but apps time out, and then you head back to the wifi settings and it say it's still connected to the home wifi but a wifi test reveals it's not working. Nice. Off to google and find many others with the same issue. Awesome. It's midnight now, I'm off to bed. May run an Ethernet cable to it instead one day, but being wall mounted that's actually quite an effort and it's only 2m from the wifi unit anyway.

Tried outputting 4K from the Xbox One S, but it can't detect a 4K TV. That's because in between is an old Onkyo receiver, which obviously isn't passing 4K through it. I may have to re cable as a direct Xbox One S to TV hdmi and then get audio back another way, but that kinda sucks in terms of HD audio, which can only be passed over hdmi, and the Xbox is my Bluray Player.
If the wifi worked then I'd use the TV Youtube app for example, and wouldn't need a 4K link from the Xbox One anyway at this stage.

Audio out via optical is annoying. There seems to be options for TV speakers plus audio out or no speakers and only audio output. Pressing mute on the TV remote mutes the rear optical output too?! I might have to commit to having to run the receiver and wall speakers at all times, and have no audio from the TV speakers ever. That will work but when watching the news etc, I often use just the TV speakers, instead of firing up the receiver too. This works differently to the original Panasonic, where the audio out was a constant feed, even if I muted the TV audio.

That's about as far as I got, but it's up and hanging on the wall again. Much much easier than lugging a 50" plasma around!

Dunnersfella

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#1750900 30-Mar-2017 20:52

That does sound fairly terrible...

Hopefully you can run a firmware update to get the WiFi working.

If the Onkyo is an older vintage that is known to have dodgy HDMI or network boards, consider moving that on and picking up something else. Probably not something you want to hear after buying a new TV...

Oh yeah, all the XBox's are getting Bitstream audio next week... so that's a definite reason to keep it plugged into the receiver.

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sbiddle

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#1750908 30-Mar-2017 21:10

Jaxson:

Wifi connects but apps time out, and then you head back to the wifi settings and it say it's still connected to the home wifi but a wifi test reveals it's not working. Nice. Off to google and find many others with the same issue. Awesome. It's midnight now, I'm off to bed. May run an Ethernet cable to it instead one day, but being wall mounted that's actually quite an effort and it's only 2m from the wifi unit anyway.

WiFi on any smart TV seems to just be a train wreck. Avoid it at all costs. Samsung TV's are particularly bad.

ben28

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#1750916 30-Mar-2017 21:41

Good point about the firmware. You may be a couple of releases back, so do some manual updates, assuming you can keep the wifi connected for long enough!

I've had no issues with wifi and the Sony

blakamin

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#1750949 30-Mar-2017 22:22

I have the Sony 8500C and no issues with wifi... or anything else really. I'm running a static IP tho.

But on first boot up, it's always wise to plug in a cable to get all the latest updates. You'll be waiting days over wifi.

Running an ethernet cable for a day won't kill you.

Jaxson

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#1751010 31-Mar-2017 08:32

Report back #2

After googling the wifi issue yesterday I went home armed with some options. Tried the first one though that was a power off. Switched the TV off at the wall whilst reprogramming the Harmony remote for it. Turned it back on and the wifi worked fine yesterday, no issues. Solid as in fact, so happy with that. As above though, still shake my head thinking of your average consumer buying something like this?!

Inserted the Logitech K400 Wireless touchpad keyboard usb dongle and that worked fine.
Oh, and this model doesn't include a microphone on the remote, so a lot of standard popup search menus first sit there waiting for you to speak, and you have to hit the ok button to let you type something in.
I read somewhere that a USB mic plugged in works, so I have one coming from banggood to try. Worth a punt at $4 including post...

Freeview plus is quite intrusive, comes up in front of the TV show for quite a while before buggering off. Still shake my head at Freeview and it's slow systems...

Bit the bullet and have turned the TV speakers right off. On the previous Panasonic (I'd opted to send a mute command to the TV when using the receiver, but on this sony that same mute command muted the audio output.) Now have to run the receiver whenever the TV is on. A bit more power that way, but sounds good.

Android wise this thing is a walk in the park. Downloaded Spotify, the SPMC version of Kodi and VLC player apps. (Total aside but am not sure if SPMC is still worth pursuing for Android use, or if the latest Kodi version is fine on Android now anyway? SPMC looks to have been updated as recently as March 2017 on the play store.) This side of things does seem pretty cool, with no reliance on providers to release a TV specific application.

What else was on my list?...

Oh yeah, receivers and all. Yeah the Onkyo is old, and yes Dunnersfella they are prone to hdmi board failures. I've replaced all caps on my hdmi board already and have had many more years out of this thing than I should have. Shopping list requirements for a replacement are: 4K and Zone 2 outputs, as I currently power/feed my outdoor deck speakers off a chromecast audio analog connection into this streaming spotify. Oh and ideally a mic setup as I have inwall speakers and frankly they need equalisation. I have the Audyssey mic setup on my current Onkyo and must say it's really really good.

However, the next part though is that right now it's not needed, as the TV has youtube and plays 4K content from there fine. It's a pity the Xbox doesn't have two hdmi outputs like some of the fancy DVD players used to, (one for projector, one for audio). I'll revisit the setup once TiVo disappears I think, that will give me a few months to sort something. Don't want to go back to audio out from the Xbox One over Optical. That would be a step back in time. Looking down the list, no games are in 4K and I don't have any of the titles that are HDR capable, so right now the Xbox One S is fine hooked up at 1080P output, even for Blurays. I will however try a direct connection to confirm everything handshakes fine though.

Final comments have to be on image quality. Frankly, it's really good. I was initially really peeved with the soap opera vibe going on but burying down in the settings I've found the motion flow settings and turned them off. I was instantly happier after that. The TV is bright enough and the blacks aren't too bad. Coming from a plasma I was pleased with this, as this TV doesn't have the local dimming options etc. I'm not pretending this is the best, but I am referencing my experiences based on the purchase price of under $1,200. Coming from Full HD plasma to this, the image is really good and I'm pleased about that. Obviously 4K content is going to be limited, and I was pleased to see the Noels sales guy pushing that aspect hard, as he's had some users come back complaining that Prime TV on Freeview HD looks terrible etc. That said, Youtube now has lots of 4K content, and your still photos are '4K capable' (my wording) if your camera is greater than 8MP etc.

So, for the money, a day later having ironed out some issues, it's looking good.

Dunnersfella

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#1751012 31-Mar-2017 08:47

If you're after a receiver that is 4K compliant and features the specs you're after, look at...

Pioneer VSX1131 (no stated Dolby Vision compatibility as a new model should be on its way soon - will eventually release Chromcast audio update... not sure if it'll work into Zone 2)

Denon AVRX1300 (no stated Dolby Vision compatibility as a new model should be on its way soon)

Yamaha RXV683 (a few months away but just announced, features Dolby Vision via update)

Onkyo TX-NR676 (Should have Dolby Vision via an update, also just announced and soon to be released - will eventually have a Chromcast audio update... not sure if it'll work into Zone 2)

Note : The Onkyo / Pioneer models will typically be the same as they share the same parent company. The room EQ is different (some would argue only by name) and Onkyo no longer has Audyssey.

sbiddle

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#1751020 31-Mar-2017 09:16

Just one thing worth mentioning while trying to deal with some issues with multiple Samsung TV's purchased by a customer that they then wanted to connect to WiFi - these TV's really didn't like UAPSD being disabled and would often connect to the WiFi, get an IP address, be pingable but refuse to pass any traffic as they decided the TV had no internet access.

Jaxson

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#1751025 31-Mar-2017 09:28

sbiddle:

Just one thing worth mentioning while trying to deal with some issues with multiple Samsung TV's purchased by a customer that they then wanted to connect to WiFi - these TV's really didn't like UAPSD being disabled and would often connect to the WiFi, get an IP address, be pingable but refuse to pass any traffic as they decided the TV had no internet access.

That pretty much aligns with what I saw.

The TV itself was happy to check and confirm the firmware was up to date etc but the apps on the TV, youtube etc, would not be able to connect.

But then later I went to the TV wifi settings and it showed as connected fine, but when I used the wifi check option in that menu it confirmed that it wasn't passing any information and it timed out.

I'll go and take a closer look in case I encounter this again.

Where does one normally identify that option? Under wifi power savings, or under TV power savings etc?

sbiddle

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#1751029 31-Mar-2017 09:41

Jaxson:

sbiddle:

Just one thing worth mentioning while trying to deal with some issues with multiple Samsung TV's purchased by a customer that they then wanted to connect to WiFi - these TV's really didn't like UAPSD being disabled and would often connect to the WiFi, get an IP address, be pingable but refuse to pass any traffic as they decided the TV had no internet access.

That pretty much aligns with what I saw.

The TV itself was happy to check and confirm the firmware was up to date etc but the apps on the TV, youtube etc, would not be able to connect.

But then later I went to the TV wifi settings and it showed as connected fine, but when I used the wifi check option in that menu it confirmed that it wasn't passing any information and it timed out.

I'll go and take a closer look in case I encounter this again.

Where does one normally identify that option? Under wifi power savings, or under TV power savings etc?

UAPSD is something on a WiFi AP - and isn't configurable or not supported on many routers. You could try enabling/disabling WMM as the two can be tied together.

Interestingly there were two ways to make the TV work when it encountered this issue - one is to manually change the DNS (it's only a temporary fix as the error will just happen again eventually even with something like 8.8.8.8 as the DNS) and the other is to assign the TV a new IP address via DHCP. As long as it keeps getting issued the same IP it'll keep saying the same thing, often even after a factory reset.

I would never personally go near a setup using a TV connected via WiFi after these dramas.

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