Is there any way of getting around

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Wills1

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#11556 30-Jan-2007 16:24

the shaping xtra does of bittorent. Without changing isp's?
Im on Go Large, locked on a contract and torrent speeds max out at 20-30 kbps since being on this plan

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#59255 30-Jan-2007 16:51

Nope, otherwise everyone would do it. You could try using encryption, but I doubt it will help very much,

weblordpepe

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#59716 3-Feb-2007 23:14

Bollocks.

Of course you can. Im not saying I've done it - but you can proxy/tunnel/vpn through to another connection, and then out to the internet. The traffic shaping is only looking at your connection, remember - and all your ISP will see is proxy/vpn/tunnel traffic, not BT or anything else.

Not that I endourse doing such a thing. But anyways - you can do anything you like with your own internet connection.

sbiddle

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#59722 4-Feb-2007 09:26

weblordpepe: Bollocks.

Of course you can. Im not saying I've done it - but you can proxy/tunnel/vpn through to another connection, and then out to the internet. The traffic shaping is only looking at your connection, remember - and all your ISP will see is proxy/vpn/tunnel traffic, not BT or anything else.

Not that I endourse doing such a thing. But anyways - you can do anything you like with your own internet connection.

But many Go Large users don't seem to be suffering from the L7 filtering, they seem to be suffering from poor bandwidth overall in which case tunneling your traffic to get around the L7 filter can't make things any faster.

barf

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#59731 4-Feb-2007 17:45

sbiddle: every Go Large connection I've seen suffers from the filtering, although they have slightly relaxed the throttling recently. I'd be interested if you can prove otherwise?

there are ISPs who don't filter but if you want to stay with Xtra and not have a throttled connection you'll need to sign up for a 'Pro' plan.

I'm on Pro Advanced, it costs a limb but with the right conditions I can get over 400kb/s on amule and torrents. Although I am connected to an overloaded conklin which means 4 megabits is shared between about 20 people in my area, and I get alot of packet loss. make sure you're connected to an exchange and can actually get decent overall speed before dishing out for a Pro connection.

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sbiddle

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#59733 4-Feb-2007 18:46

I should have phrased that a little better. I didn't mean that Go Large wasn't suffering from throttling from the L7 filter but that Go Large just seems to be exceptionally slow for a large number of users 24/7 no matter what services they're trying to use.

weblordpepe

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#59734 4-Feb-2007 19:29

Well yeah thats right. A simple test of downloading a big file over HTTP while your friend on another ISP downloads the same file will confirm that.

However the packet filtering itself is kinda an akward one. Because at the end of the day - we know the real reasons for packet filtering are nothing about conserving bandwidth. That much is obvius. A quick look at the list of the filtered applications /protocols reveals that.

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raytaylor

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#60052 7-Feb-2007 20:56

weblordpepe: Bollocks.

Of course you can. Im not saying I've done it - but you can proxy/tunnel/vpn through to another connection, and then out to the internet. The traffic shaping is only looking at your connection, remember - and all your ISP will see is proxy/vpn/tunnel traffic, not BT or anything else.

Not that I endourse doing such a thing. But anyways - you can do anything you like with your own internet connection.

I somehow doubt that VPN'ing or tunneling in any way would work because where would you find a relay server that has a decent speed? I mean even annonymous proxy servers have very very low speeds. This is the same sort of thing, just a different protocol.

I believe the solution would be to use Azureus as your client, change the port settings to something that are uncommon and on the connection > transport encryption settings tab, tick all boxes and set the encryption to RC4.

In theory, Azureus will encrypt the traffic if the other user sendng the data to you also has encryption enabled. There is more of a chance that the traffic will then be allowed through at high speed as it could be encrypted and the isp wont know its torrent traffic.
Azureus have more of the workings of this on their website.

Ray Taylor

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weblordpepe

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#60319 10-Feb-2007 10:12

raytaylor:

I somehow doubt that VPN'ing or tunneling in any way would work because where would you find a relay server that has a decent speed? I mean even annonymous proxy servers have very very low speeds. This is the same sort of thing, just a different protocol.

I believe the solution would be to use Azureus as your client, change the port settings to something that are uncommon and on the connection > transport encryption settings tab, tick all boxes and set the encryption to RC4.

It doesn't seem to work. I tried encryption on many a Bittorrent clients, including Azureus. Didn't work. And also I know that the specific ports doesnt make a difference either.

And yes you can find decent speed relays. Although they generally catch on that you're sucking their bandwidth twice over. Once to download the torrent data and then again to send it to your connection.

Your very best chance at getting around the traffic filtering is to use encapsulation like a VPN or SSH/SSL tunnel. Anything to make the traffic a different protocol than is listed as naughty.

* One thing of note is that DCC on IRC doesnt seem to be affected for the most part. Probably the oldest protocol in the book for sharing music and warez.

raytaylor

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#60324 10-Feb-2007 11:20

It probably doesnt work in most cases. The person or people who you are downloading from also have to have their encryption turned on. That way there is only a 'chance' that they do, and the traffic would be encrypted. Unfortunatly, the encryption isnt turned on by default to a use-if-available mode in most clients.

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Felix

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#60661 13-Feb-2007 12:40

hi kids,

encrypting and changing ports won't help... shaping / throttling, packet tagging etc will pick up pretty much anything...

F5

raytaylor

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#60692 13-Feb-2007 17:10

Click here for azureus specific settings
Or here

Most traffic shaping devices will not detect this, and the traffic shaping hardware would have to be able to perform deep packet inspection which I hear uses a huge amount of processing power. I doubt any but the big 5 isps have such a system in place.

Ray Taylor

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barf

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#60694 13-Feb-2007 17:28

mate, deep packet inspection is what every d-link, dynalink, netgear, cisco and other ADSL NAT device does - it's just a fancy marketing term.

Xtra use a system which will detect encrypted bittorrent easily, the tracker data is monitored and related connections tagged for throttling, it's even free Linux software.

It's why Go Large sucks!

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Felix

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#60697 13-Feb-2007 17:49

correct... xtra does indeed have the ability to tag your packets, encryption or no! sorry but encrypting will not get around the FUP.

barf

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#60704 13-Feb-2007 18:50

it's a shame they do this, I could live with a non-specific throttle on a flat-rate connection but the specific throttling of bittorrent is quite seriously deleterious upon legitimate uses of the Internet.

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weblordpepe

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#60705 13-Feb-2007 18:54

Thats why we make an encapsulating protocol that looks just like its browsing the web. I wonders how difficult it would be to kick start a peer to peer network based on HTTP and HTML. Afterall, the content inside files transferred by HTTP can be anything.
Maybe something which uses a tracking system with the actual protocol, but the actual transferring of data is HTTP with seemly random tags etc so filtering cant affect it?

Perhaps a bit off topic, but its a good thought.

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