One NZ (Vodafone) 3G phase out

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#2961885 1-Sep-2022 12:44

You mean one of these?

https://palm.com/pages/product

Those things are tiny. I like smaller phones too - hell, my first Android was an A3 2017 with a 4.7" screen - but I think that Palm thing is a little too small for me.

TheMightyKiwipeso

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#2961948 1-Sep-2022 13:30

tripper1000:

Framing the problem as expecting Telco's to support 20 year old equipment for Luddites is an oversimplification.

VoLTE exclusivity will increase the barriers to entry, increasing the total cost of ownership for the customer and increasing the amount of e-waste and consumption etc.

Once you step onto the "smart phone" freight-train, you are flung into a ecosystem where your are forced to/can easily be spending $100's more annually on hardware than the subscription service.

A $50 button phone from the Warehouse, with a lifespan of 5 years, won't be good enough anymore. You are going to need a VoLTE palm phone just to make a phone call. A budget palm phone with VoLTE will be lucky to have a lifespan of 2 years max (6 months tops if you put things in your pockets) and cost 4 - 6 times more than the button phone. Budget palm phones are not as enduring as a button phone or a flag-ship palm phone. They quickly become un-usable through breakage or through updates that overload its (lack-of) memory, or through lack of updates.

Palm phones are the perfect choice for the status symbol conscious, materialistic consumer.

I don't see why the overwhelming majority of cellphone users have to deal with luddites holding back the networks,

the infrastructure is increasingly expensive to support long after it has ceased to be manufactured.

Budget smartphones can be bought from $30 at the new world supermarkets, or similar at the warehouse.

As the warehouse does support laybuys and buy now pay later on zip, it is laughable to say this is unaffordable or out of reach of beneficiaries.

I really wish that some commentators would come here to make sober comments, rather than half baked nonsense.

sudara

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#2964555 8-Sep-2022 09:35

Vodafone's 4G network is weak when compared to Spark's. I recently moved and noticed a huge difference. I am in Whenuapai, Auckland and I am almost always on 3G with Vodafone, but used to be on 4G with Spark. I checked the geek zone cell tower maps and it shows both Spark and Vodafone towers physically close to each other.

shk292

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#2964573 8-Sep-2022 10:07

What's to say that simple phones can't be VoLTE? The Alcatel 3080, recently sold at the Warehouse for $49, has VoLTE:

https://www.dataselect.com/new-alcatel-3080-now-available/

timmmay

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#2964595 8-Sep-2022 10:48

I asked the person at work who deals with Vodafone (we're a corporate customer with many many phones), they said it's controlled by Google rather than Vodafone.

I've realised my Pixel 4a end of support date is late next year, so by the time 3G is turned off I may have a new phone anyway. Then again, if the phone is still going strong and I can't find a replacement that's a moderate size maybe I'll root it and put Lineage on and see if I can get VoLTE working that way. Modern phones last years if you don't drop 'em, the 4a is still plenty fast enough, but even midrange phones these days are quite a bit faster.

Lias

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#2964619 8-Sep-2022 11:50

TheMightyKiwipeso:

Budget smartphones can be bought from $30 at the new world supermarkets, or similar at the warehouse.

Even if I were to accept that it's okay to force consumers to replace working equipment to save the Telco's money (which I most definitely don't), we're not just talking about that. We're also talking about a huge range of IOT, Metering, Industrial, etc equipment that has cellular connectivity. Some of which is 6 or 7 figures to replace and has an expected life span of decades. There was a post on here not long ago from a user trying to emulate dialup conditions for just such a piece of equipment. A few years ago I had to work on industrial equipment with an ISA based 486 running the guts of it, that even at 25ish years old was still worth hundreds of thousands.

Just like I still expect a modern WAP to support 20 year old standards like 802.11b/g in addition to the latest ones, I expect cellular providers to provide decades of support for any standard.

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Lias

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#2964622 8-Sep-2022 11:55

alexx:

I understand the sentiment, but expecting network operators to provide support for 10-20 year old mobile phones that are out of support from the phone maker, might be a bit like me expecting Apple and peripheral manufacturers to support my old Macbook and it's Firewire 800 interface. The government could pass a law, but do people really benefit from the allocation of spectrum for the support of vintage phones?

How many million of dollars of network infrastructure would be needed per 1000 people that don't want to upgrade, or can't afford to upgrade and wouldn't it be better for the government and industry to a) just give poor people new phones and b) and start funding coverage improvements?

Isn't the later happening already with RCG, who apparently get funding from the government's Rural Broadband Initiative?

As above.. it's not just personal cellular devices. 10 years might be long enough purely for end user handset, laptop, tablet etc support, but for the industrial/IOT stuff, it needs to be longer.

shk292

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#2964624 8-Sep-2022 11:59

Lias:

Just like I still expect a modern WAP to support 20 year old standards like 802.11b/g in addition to the latest ones, I expect cellular providers to provide decades of support for any standard.

If RF spectrum were free and unlimited, that would be a reasonable expectation. But it isn't. Good engineering includes obsolescence planning

MikeAqua

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#2964627 8-Sep-2022 12:05

I have notice big chunks of Marlborough where my Vodafone device reverts to 4G. This includes parts of SH6 and SH1 and parts of some the town like Picton and Havelock.

I guess those will now be no coverage areas?

Mike

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#2964630 8-Sep-2022 12:10

Lias:

TheMightyKiwipeso:

Budget smartphones can be bought from $30 at the new world supermarkets, or similar at the warehouse.

Even if I were to accept that it's okay to force consumers to replace working equipment to save the Telco's money (which I most definitely don't), we're not just talking about that. We're also talking about a huge range of IOT, Metering, Industrial, etc equipment that has cellular connectivity. Some of which is 6 or 7 figures to replace and has an expected life span of decades. There was a post on here not long ago from a user trying to emulate dialup conditions for just such a piece of equipment. A few years ago I had to work on industrial equipment with an ISA based 486 running the guts of it, that even at 25ish years old was still worth hundreds of thousands.

Just like I still expect a modern WAP to support 20 year old standards like 802.11b/g in addition to the latest ones, I expect cellular providers to provide decades of support for any standard.

Tbh, you're being really pedantic about obsolete stuff which is costing the telcos an unreasonable amount of money to support for a few customers.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but ask yourself why cellphones have to be supported for over a decade after parts stopped being made for it ?

Now do you see why I'm saying you're taking an absurd position ?

quickymart

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#2964634 8-Sep-2022 12:21

MikeAqua:

I have notice big chunks of Marlborough where my Vodafone device reverts to 4G. This includes parts of SH6 and SH1 and parts of some the town like Picton and Havelock.

I guess those will now be no coverage areas?

If you have 4G coverage you'll be fine - or did you mean 3G? 😉

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TheMightyKiwipeso

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#2964642 8-Sep-2022 12:33

quickymart:

MikeAqua:

I have notice big chunks of Marlborough where my Vodafone device reverts to 4G. This includes parts of SH6 and SH1 and parts of some the town like Picton and Havelock.

I guess those will now be no coverage areas?

If you have 4G coverage you'll be fine - or did you mean 3G? 😉

This is correct.
If you have 4G coverage, you will be fine.
If you only have 2G and 3G on your phone, you will have 2G for at least a year after 3G goes away in August 2024.

As noted previously, the connectivity is accessible for 4G around the $30 ~ $50 mark depending on either a supermarket or warehouse device.
This is considered to be affordable to most pensioners and beneficiaries who can always put it on laybuy or zip at the warehouse, or get it on christmas club at a supermarket.

Linux

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#2964648 8-Sep-2022 12:58

MikeAqua:

I have notice big chunks of Marlborough where my Vodafone device reverts to 4G. This includes parts of SH6 and SH1 and parts of some the town like Picton and Havelock.

I guess those will now be no coverage areas?

@MikeAqua Of course not and I think you mean 3G coverage, The 3G turn off is just over 2 years away and this gives Vodafone loads of time to add 4G to 3G only sites

Further to this the power can be turned up on 4G once 3G shutdown is complete

ajw

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#2964658 8-Sep-2022 13:49

@Linux

And the radio spectrum released for 4G use.

richms

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#2964672 8-Sep-2022 14:22

Lias:

Just like I still expect a modern WAP to support 20 year old standards like 802.11b/g in addition to the latest ones, I expect cellular providers to provide decades of support for any standard.

Except you go and turn that off so that the network speeds are not compromised with the old devices being connected.

Same with the cellular networks. Keeping the old protocols alive and having phones connect to them just leads to devices jumping on things that are no longer secure, waste spectrum on inefficient modulations and mean that they have to support legacy circuit switched data and voice making the network build harder and take more resources to maintain it and troubleshoot.

Richard rich.ms

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