One NZ (Vodafone) 3G phase out

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#2964746 8-Sep-2022 18:05

sudara:

Vodafone's 4G network is weak when compared to Spark's. I recently moved and noticed a huge difference. I am in Whenuapai, Auckland and I am almost always on 3G with Vodafone, but used to be on 4G with Spark. I checked the geek zone cell tower maps and it shows both Spark and Vodafone towers physically close to each other.

I think a big part of the weakness is due to Vodafone's aversion to rolling out 700MHz in urban centres resulting in lousy coverage even areas where one would think coverage would be pretty good - I'm around Naenae/Avalon, solid 4G on Spark, 3G if I am using Vodafone and if on a good day I might get one line on 4G but that is only if all the moons, stars and planets are aligned just right. Even 2 Degrees, the plucky underdog is able to provide better 4G support where I live.

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#2964758 8-Sep-2022 18:52

@matisyahu The power is turned down on 4G for about the 5th time this is done on purpose so 4G coverage is not better / stronger than 3G coverage!

Once 3G is off end users will see a massive improvement in 4G coverage footprint

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#2964760 8-Sep-2022 18:56

The 4G coverage footprint is artificially shrunk!

quickymart

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#2964855 8-Sep-2022 21:28

I have a (potentially) dumb question John, why do they make the 4G signal smaller? Is it due to interference/not enough available spectrum for both to co-exist at the same signal strength? That's what I would think but I'm genuinely curious if I'm right (or not).

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#2964910 9-Sep-2022 08:05

quickymart:

I have a (potentially) dumb question John, why do they make the 4G signal smaller? Is it due to interference/not enough available spectrum for both to co-exist at the same signal strength? That's what I would think but I'm genuinely curious if I'm right (or not).

@quickymart Was done by design when 4G was first deployed as you did not want 4G coverage better than 3G coverage due to Voice over 3G only

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#2964932 9-Sep-2022 08:47

To expand on @Linux’s answer - in a voice over 3G world, if you had 4G signal but no 3G signal, you would not be able to make or receive calls. You’d only be able to use data only which was a poor customer experience as they’d expect to be able to call wherever there is mobile service.

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#2964948 9-Sep-2022 09:31

TheMightyKiwipeso:

I don't see why the overwhelming majority of cellphone users have to deal with luddites holding back the networks,

the infrastructure is increasingly expensive to support long after it has ceased to be manufactured.

Budget smartphones can be bought from $30 at the new world supermarkets, or similar at the warehouse.

As the warehouse does support laybuys and buy now pay later on zip, it is laughable to say this is unaffordable or out of reach of beneficiaries.

I really wish that some commentators would come here to make sober comments, rather than half baked nonsense.

Thanks for illustrating that most people don't get the cost and technology aspect of this problem and that some commentators talk half baked nonsense.

New World, Countdown and Pak-n-save websites presently shows no smart phones for sale (yeap, there might be a smattering in store but their offerings will be similar to the warehouse so lets look there).

Warehouse website shows the cheapest "smart" phone is $55 and the cheapest 3 "smart" phones are all 3G, so are part of the problem as you view it. I checked all their 4G phones under $100 and none have VoLTE (I welcome correction if I missing something), so they too rely on 3G for making calls. So it seems highly unlikely that any phone presently available under $100 is going make calls in a non 2G/3G world and the $30 phone allegation is clearly half baked nonsense.

As I alluded to, these budget phones are false economy anyway due to short lifespans, and a flagship phone has never been good sensible economy. Budget phones are a lot more fragile than an expensive model or button phone, won't be supported well, and future updates that google pushes out eg for google services or the play store, has historically hobbled (or even entirely broken) these budget phones due to their very modest specs. (all my old 3G button phones work properly, but all my old [edit:] budget smart phones only work after a reset and only work until you turn on data and they get their first google update).

As for nonsense about being held back: Not a single customer is presently being "held back". The wireless companies are re-framing 3G frequencies to 4G meaning 'almost' as much spectrum as can be is presently allocated to non-3g technology. Re-framing the last of the 3G frequencies across to 4G will be barely perceivable to most 4g data users (obviously it will simplify the network for the wireless companies so there is motivation there to do it), yet it will adversely impact not only all 3G devices but also a great swath of 4G voice customers, due to poor VoLTE device penetration, and sketchy VoLTE performance. (Many voice drop-out and break-up issues can be resolved by disabling VoLTE).

I acknowledge that 2 & 3g will need to go extinct sooner or later. I'm just saying it isn't time to do so yet.

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#2964951 9-Sep-2022 09:42

@tripper1000

Try using a non VOLTE phone on the RCG network. 3G switchoff is here now.

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#2964957 9-Sep-2022 09:45

Linux: The 4G coverage footprint is artificially shrunk!

@Linux is this not also done so as to shrink cell-size and enable the available spectrum to be reused more often, there by increasing total network through-put? I.E. when there are few towers with 4G they crank up the power and as they in-fill they reduce the power of neighboring cells to prevent them overlapping/interfering? If so, wouldn't this prevent the 4G power being turned back up much in urban environments?

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#2964963 9-Sep-2022 10:03

If someone is too poor to get a new phone, that is not welfare that the telcos should be providing. work and income will contribute to phones when needed for jobseeking. The telcos can choose to do a subsidized upgrade plan if they want to, but those users will be low return so there is no point in doing that.

I am being held back in that I am frequently seeing 1 bar of 4g that works become 4 bars of worthless H or H+ on the phone when at many places around Auckland. I have to toggle airplane mode to get it back on 4G in order to have data.

Richard rich.ms

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#2964978 9-Sep-2022 10:52

A few months ago I tried to find a basic phone for my mother but the only cheap options I could find were dodgy looking iPhone knock-offs that appeared to be fiddly and complicated to use. We ended up spending $800 on an entry level iPhone to get something that would be simple and familiar for her.

Bring back the Nokia 3310!

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#2966287 12-Sep-2022 17:39

pindrop.vodafone.co.nz

Got an email this morning with this link and so background info. Really good to see they are willing to listen. I have added a few pins on the map, lets see if this is going to turn out as they thought.

[Mod edit (MF): fixed link]

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#2966290 12-Sep-2022 17:43

@halper86 You need to fix your link it is pointing to https://www.geekzone.co.nz/pindrop.vodafone.co.nz

richms

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#2966303 12-Sep-2022 18:44

pretty crap list of problems tho. None there for no 4G

I guess no coverage will do since I am paying for a 4g connection.

Richard rich.ms

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#2966304 12-Sep-2022 18:51

Is it just me or is it when you fall back to 3G the data connection can be next to useless if not completely dead? I've not experienced this first hand but have had plenty of such complaints.

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