[Annoy] What's something small that really annoys you?

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#3336614 28-Jan-2025 15:26

networkn:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/wellington-bus-lane-camera-clocks-up-220k-in-fines-in-just-over-a-month/5S4WU7JXPBFQ5OYDTYCFTI5S5Y/

This is either hard to read layout, or poor signage. If they are continuing making this much money on a single camera, it's no longer about compliance, it's about revenue gathering.

Its absolutely is about compliance. Bus lanes are the most prominantly marked of all road rules and its very clear on who is allowed to use them and who can't. Its not like you get half way to work and suddenly realise that you took the Camry and left the 50 seater Scania at home this morning.

networkn

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#3336615 28-Jan-2025 15:31

Senecio:

Its absolutely is about compliance. Bus lanes are the most prominantly marked of all road rules and its very clear on who is allowed to use them and who can't. Its not like you get half way to work and suddenly realise that you took the Camry and left the 50 seater Scania at home this morning.

Disagree. Kyber Passes Road Markings and transition to and from buslanes are not well laid out, and it has been acknowledged by AT but they didn't do anything about it. Co-incidentally, it's their most profitable 'compliance' location.

SirHumphreyAppleby

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#3336636 28-Jan-2025 15:51

Senecio:

Its absolutely is about compliance.

It's not absolute. I believe it's about both.

There are numerous rules in the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004 that Council's (AT, in my experience) do not enforce or do not enforce correctly. For example, Auckland Traffic routinely claims vehicles parked too close to or over driveways are legally parked, when the regulations indicate they MUST be considered an obstruction. Meanwhile, limited use of bus lanes is permitted, yet AT enforces their interpretation of the rules in a draconian way. If it were about compliance, then why are they focusing (and spending tens of millions of dollars on enforcing) only rules that happen to align with their ideology?

Some bus lanes are poorly marked, such as the Newmarket example and it's difficult to believe a ~80M bus lane with cameras appearing on the other side of a motorway junction which you approach in a similarly marked T3 lane has anything to do with compliance.

Jase2985

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#3336638 28-Jan-2025 16:01

networkn:

Senecio:

Its absolutely is about compliance. Bus lanes are the most prominantly marked of all road rules and its very clear on who is allowed to use them and who can't. Its not like you get half way to work and suddenly realise that you took the Camry and left the 50 seater Scania at home this morning.

Disagree. Kyber Passes Road Markings and transition to and from buslanes are not well laid out, and it has been acknowledged by AT but they didn't do anything about it. Co-incidentally, it's their most profitable 'compliance' location.

Go and look at it, there are 4x 10-15m sections of the whole lane that painted green indicating its a bus lane, there are at least 4 signs from crowhurst to broadway saying its a buslane. You get 50m leniency, plenty to be able to switch lanes. people are just ignorant or not observant.

Ive been done for driving in the buslane under the Newmarket viaduct as I jumped in the left lane 80m prior to the street i turned down the lane i was in was banked up from the traffic lights, there was nothing in the left lane and i wasn't going to be holding any bus up. But i knowingly broke the rule, I took it on the chin and won't be doing that again.

Jase2985

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#3336639 28-Jan-2025 16:06

SirHumphreyAppleby:

Some bus lanes are poorly marked, such as the Newmarket example and it's difficult to believe a ~80M bus lane with cameras appearing on the other side of a motorway junction which you approach in a similarly marked T3 lane has anything to do with compliance.

Where is this one you are talking about?

RunningMan

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#3336640 28-Jan-2025 16:09

Does the Google Street View car think it's a bus?

https://maps.app.goo.gl/rEaSrJi8bEv7iktT6

SirHumphreyAppleby

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#3336644 28-Jan-2025 16:18

Jase2985:

If you cant see its a Buslane when the road is painted green soild green with a white buslane painted on it and there are buslane signs every 200m then you clearly are not fit to be driving.

Jase2985:

You get 50m leniency, plenty to be able to switch lanes.

No, you do not. The regulations state "... in the lane for the minimum length necessary to complete the manoeuvre and for no more than a maximum length of 50 m". I've heard of people been fined for driving less than 50m, in particular passing vehicles stopped in the only other lane available to them. I think it's reasonable to consider that an obstruction, and such use of a bus or transit lane is explicitly permitted if it doesn't impede other traffic.

The bus lane I was referring to is on Puhinui Rd, between the motorway junction from Auckland International Airport and Wylie Rd. Most of the road from the airport is a T3 transit lane, so I expect this one would catch out a few tourists in rental cars.

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#3336657 28-Jan-2025 16:58

SirHumphreyAppleby:

It's not absolute. I believe it's about both.

There are numerous rules in the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004 that Council's (AT, in my experience) do not enforce or do not enforce correctly. For example, Auckland Traffic routinely claims vehicles parked too close to or over driveways are legally parked, when the regulations indicate they MUST be considered an obstruction. Meanwhile, limited use of bus lanes is permitted, yet AT enforces their interpretation of the rules in a draconian way. If it were about compliance, then why are they focusing (and spending tens of millions of dollars on enforcing) only rules that happen to align with their ideology?

Some bus lanes are poorly marked, such as the Newmarket example and it's difficult to believe a ~80M bus lane with cameras appearing on the other side of a motorway junction which you approach in a similarly marked T3 lane has anything to do with compliance.

People assume that the driveway is where the kerb drops, but that is normally a lot wider than a driveway is, council will often have it correct but people are not happy as their crap driving skills mean they have to cut the corner when pulling into a drive. Same as where the distance from an intersection is measured from that gets a lot of the crap parking facebook pages worked up when they're wrong.

Richard rich.ms

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#3336659 28-Jan-2025 17:00

Jase2985:

Go and look at it, there are 4x 10-15m sections of the whole lane that painted green indicating its a bus lane, there are at least 4 signs from crowhurst to broadway saying its a buslane. You get 50m leniency, plenty to be able to switch lanes. people are just ignorant or not observant.

Ive been done for driving in the buslane under the Newmarket viaduct as I jumped in the left lane 80m prior to the street i turned down the lane i was in was banked up from the traffic lights, there was nothing in the left lane and i wasn't going to be holding any bus up. But i knowingly broke the rule, I took it on the chin and won't be doing that again.

Well, if AT themselves have admitted it's not a great layout and potentially causes confusion that generates fines, and then did nothing about it, I am really not sure what to tell you.

cddt

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#3336750 28-Jan-2025 20:14

Jase2985:

Go and look at it, there are 4x 10-15m sections of the whole lane that painted green indicating its a bus lane, there are at least 4 signs from crowhurst to broadway saying its a buslane. You get 50m leniency, plenty to be able to switch lanes. people are just ignorant or not observant.

Ive been done for driving in the buslane under the Newmarket viaduct as I jumped in the left lane 80m prior to the street i turned down the lane i was in was banked up from the traffic lights, there was nothing in the left lane and i wasn't going to be holding any bus up. But i knowingly broke the rule, I took it on the chin and won't be doing that again.

What I'm confused about is what you're supposed to do when the turning lane / bus lane is banked up more than 50 metres (in some bus lanes without cameras, these are regularly banked up 300 metres or more). Do you stop your car in the main lane and indicate, impeding the flow of traffic? If so, do you do this at 50 metres? At the intersection?

My referral links: BigPipe | Mercury

richms

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#3336754 28-Jan-2025 20:21

cddt:

What I'm confused about is what you're supposed to do when the turning lane / bus lane is banked up more than 50 metres (in some bus lanes without cameras, these are regularly banked up 300 metres or more). Do you stop your car in the main lane and indicate, impeding the flow of traffic? If so, do you do this at 50 metres? At the intersection?

Yes, you do, and someone in the bus lane will make a gap for you to turn thru. Its not a lane for the use of cars so you dont go into it other than that inexplicable 50m thing that they allow people to do which seems to cause so much confusion even when the line is changed to make it obvious where 50m is.

Same for pulling into the the main road, you dont do that dickhead thing of pull into the bus lane and then stop till you are let in, you wait till there is a gap in the car lane and then take it.

Richard rich.ms

SirHumphreyAppleby

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#3336756 28-Jan-2025 20:22

richms:

People assume that the driveway is where the kerb drops, but that is normally a lot wider than a driveway is, council will often have it correct but people are not happy as their crap driving skills mean they have to cut the corner when pulling into a drive. Same as where the distance from an intersection is measured from that gets a lot of the crap parking facebook pages worked up when they're wrong.

By all means, enlighten us on how "1m of the prolongation of the side of a driveway" is meant to be interpreted, because I can tell you from experience, ATs enforcement of this is wildly inconsistent. Some cars are towed parked near the driveway, while some parked over it are resolved as "vehicle legally parked". Enforcement of fire hydrant rules seems to be practically non-existent on residential streets, but parking in the same way outside the shops on the main road will get you ticketed.

Handle9

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#3336759 28-Jan-2025 20:27

networkn:

Senecio:

Its absolutely is about compliance. Bus lanes are the most prominantly marked of all road rules and its very clear on who is allowed to use them and who can't. Its not like you get half way to work and suddenly realise that you took the Camry and left the 50 seater Scania at home this morning.

Disagree. Kyber Passes Road Markings and transition to and from buslanes are not well laid out, and it has been acknowledged by AT but they didn't do anything about it. Co-incidentally, it's their most profitable 'compliance' location.

What do you suggest AT do about Kyber Pass while maintaining the functionality of the bus lanes?

Just because a road is confusing and not able to be made less confusing doesn't make it revenue gathering.

Like most other road issues it comes down to the rules should only apply to bad (other) drivers, not good (me) drivers.

richms

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#3336762 28-Jan-2025 20:45

SirHumphreyAppleby:

By all means, enlighten us on how "1m of the prolongation of the side of a driveway" is meant to be interpreted, because I can tell you from experience, ATs enforcement of this is wildly inconsistent. Some cars are towed parked near the driveway, while some parked over it are resolved as "vehicle legally parked". Enforcement of fire hydrant rules seems to be practically non-existent on residential streets, but parking in the same way outside the shops on the main road will get you ticketed.

When a friend with a very angled driveway was having problems the council said that its 1m from the point of the driveway when projected out to the road on the other side of the verge/berm/footpath, the angled drive on their own property or that the crossing was super wide did not matter. Basically parked cars make their entrance a chicane and its not the councils fault they have a stupid layout of their property that requires entry at a near 45 degree angle.

Richard rich.ms

Jase2985

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#3336766 28-Jan-2025 21:00

networkn:

Jase2985:

Go and look at it, there are 4x 10-15m sections of the whole lane that painted green indicating its a bus lane, there are at least 4 signs from crowhurst to broadway saying its a buslane. You get 50m leniency, plenty to be able to switch lanes. people are just ignorant or not observant.

Ive been done for driving in the buslane under the Newmarket viaduct as I jumped in the left lane 80m prior to the street i turned down the lane i was in was banked up from the traffic lights, there was nothing in the left lane and i wasn't going to be holding any bus up. But i knowingly broke the rule, I took it on the chin and won't be doing that again.

Well, if AT themselves have admitted it's not a great layout and potentially causes confusion that generates fines, and then did nothing about it, I am really not sure what to tell you.

It meets NZTA road design standards, but the piece of road sucks as it's so short, has side-streets on both sides and a pretty average intersection at broadway with a tonne of traffic. Its the best of a bad situation.

Not directed at anyone in particular but if you can't effectively manoeuvre your car down there without using the buslane then you should get a ticket, if you wish to blame anyone but yourself for getting a ticket for your actions, we have to question if you should be driving or not as clearly not all rules seem to not apply to you.

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