Gull Employment Dispute.

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Mad Scientist
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#1181033 21-Nov-2014 21:37

ah yes i remember that now :D

Handle9

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#1181035 21-Nov-2014 21:47

tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

It doesn't matter what the situation is, if there's negligence or criminal action on behalf of the employee then the employer should either begin dismissal procedures or take legal action action against the employee. NOT just arbitrarily take wages.

That's just bollocks and the fact that it seems to be commonplace is simply because the people putting up with these policies are the ones least able to fight them.

I totally agree. People driving off is a business risk of service stations. The employees don't have a share in the profits, so they should not have to share in losses.

If there was a prepay only policy then disciplinary action is the way that this should be dealt with, not payroll deduction.

networkn

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#1181098 22-Nov-2014 00:02

tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

Should they ? If you are outraged about this, how do you feel about pedophiles attacking little kids, thousands of women and Kurdish refugees being slaughtered ?

Save your "outrage" for something truly outrageous. It's badm but it's being put right and no-one died!

MikeB4

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#1181126 22-Nov-2014 07:41

networkn:
tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

Should they ? If you are outraged about this, how do you feel about pedophiles attacking little kids, thousands of women and Kurdish refugees being slaughtered ?

Save your "outrage" for something truly outrageous. It's badm but it's being put right and no-one died!

With respect this is somewhat arrogant as was the post responded to. You cannot dictate what someone chooses to be outraged by.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

meesham

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#1181138 22-Nov-2014 08:54

networkn:
tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

Should they ? If you are outraged about this, how do you feel about pedophiles attacking little kids, thousands of women and Kurdish refugees being slaughtered ?

Save your "outrage" for something truly outrageous. It's badm but it's being put right and no-one died!

Argumentum ad absurdum, no one's saying it's the same thing. I think people have gotten angry about this because it's an underdog story. If it was my local service station I wouldn't go there because of this story, mainly because it's backed up by the letter that he sent around and the media got a copy of. I'm not listening to any of the comments on Stuff and Facebook about other service stations until they're backed by facts I just take it as typical trolls.

Has anyone actually said that it's being put right yet? The CEO of Gull said that he'd speak to the franchise owner but he's not talking to the media.

Geektastic

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#1181144 22-Nov-2014 09:19

Sideface: I have never pre-payed for petrol, and I never will.
I am very old and stubborn.

Agreed - although I am not very old (at least not physically!).

I usually avoid establishments that assume I am a criminal.

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meesham

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#1181150 22-Nov-2014 09:55

It looks like the former employee of the service station is going to be paid back by Gull - http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/63399273/gull-worker-repaid-docked-wages.html

The cynic in me says it was the bad PR that forced their hand and it's the head office paying the money not the franchise owner, but it's good that they're making this right.

networkn

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#1181209 22-Nov-2014 11:13

meesham: It looks like the former employee of the service station is going to be paid back by Gull - http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/63399273/gull-worker-repaid-docked-wages.html

The cynic in me says it was the bad PR that forced their hand and it's the head office paying the money not the franchise owner, but it's good that they're making this right.

Exactly. Yet again it's not about legal vs not legal. It's about what will be perceived to be better PR.

networkn

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#1181210 22-Nov-2014 11:17

KiwiNZ:
networkn:
tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

Should they ? If you are outraged about this, how do you feel about pedophiles attacking little kids, thousands of women and Kurdish refugees being slaughtered ?

Save your "outrage" for something truly outrageous. It's badm but it's being put right and no-one died!

With respect this is somewhat arrogant as was the post responded to. You cannot dictate what someone chooses to be outraged by.

I can't dictate what someone chooses to be outraged about, but I think I have every right to offer some perspective in the hope that a little common sense takes grip here instead of the media whipped frenzy which
appears to be the case now.

ckc

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#1181211 22-Nov-2014 11:21

Often legal isn't moral. I don't think you can conflate legality and morality, especially when the law clearly often puts people in terrible situations and itself does not act as the arbiter of morality, only as the arbiter of what the law allows.

But if it helps, docking pay for criminal events is probably illegal under current law. Even a clause in a worker's contract that allowed unspecified deductions for random acts at random times that happened outside the employee's control would probably be illegal.

Handle9

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#1181213 22-Nov-2014 11:25

IANAL but in my understanding the law is pretty clear. If you want to make a deduction from an employee they must agree in writing to the specific deduction or the employer is entitled to sue them for damages. Unilateral deductions aren't allowed.

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#1181217 22-Nov-2014 11:46

That was my opinion as well but I couldn't find anything in my notes when I had a look so I'm not 100% on that

meesham

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#1181219 22-Nov-2014 12:13

networkn:
I can't dictate what someone chooses to be outraged about, but I think I have every right to offer some perspective in the hope that a little common sense takes grip here instead of the media whipped frenzy which
appears to be the case now.

Well I think the media have done exactly what they should be doing here, bringing to peoples' attention an injustice that has been going on for quite a while. Apparently the Government's now investigating: http://www.3news.co.nz/tvshows/campbelllive/drive-off-dockings-occurring-around-nz-2014112120

Handle9

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#1181223 22-Nov-2014 12:21

networkn:
KiwiNZ:
networkn:
tigercorp: People should be rightfully outraged about this.

Should they ? If you are outraged about this, how do you feel about pedophiles attacking little kids, thousands of women and Kurdish refugees being slaughtered ?

Save your "outrage" for something truly outrageous. It's badm but it's being put right and no-one died!

With respect this is somewhat arrogant as was the post responded to. You cannot dictate what someone chooses to be outraged by.

I can't dictate what someone chooses to be outraged about, but I think I have every right to offer some perspective in the hope that a little common sense takes grip here instead of the media whipped frenzy which
appears to be the case now.

You can offer your perspective but IMO you were really condescending about it. You asked people's opinion about something then belittle their opinion. Seems pretty rude to me.

Aredwood

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#1181224 22-Nov-2014 12:22

The thing that gets me about the driveoffs / prepay system. Is that it could easily be solved by the petrol stations upgrading their POS systems. To the same type that Pak n Save fuel stations have - ones that support placing temporary "Holds". Then you would still have to goto the counter first. But then you could just fill your car and then simply drive off. With the system then billing your card for the actual amount. Instead of having to goto the counter twice.

Or they could install barrier arms on the entry and exits to the forecourt.

But since they haven't done either, it can't be costing them that much in driveoffs. (probally in part due to them forcing their employees to wear the costs of driveoffs).

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