SaltyNZ:

MikeSkyrme:
I'm going to assume that people also said the same when the national road toll was 'only' one per year.

Things change.

Yes, they do. But in the face of the far greater threat of the road toll, we didn't ban cars. We didn't force everyone to keep detailed logs of their trips... We thought about it, debated it publicly, and came up with a bunch of solutions that everyone is OK to live with, that are set out in public, and enforced in public, with a public right of appeal for those who believe they have been dealt with unfairly.

SaltyNZ: Apparently there are about 80 kiwis under surveillance because they may be potential terrorists, according the the PM's speech yesterday. 80. And about half of them are only suspected of being loudmouths, as opposed to someone who is actually about to perform mayhem. According to Wikipedia, there were 934 Mongrel Mob members in prison in April 2013. So yeah... we definitely need to urgently review what civil rights we should suspend in order to deal with this imminent existential terrorist threat. We only need them to grow by more than an order of magnitude and they'll be roughly as annoying as a bikie gang.

plambrechtsen:

KiwiNZ: That is why the Government hires professionals to detect, investigate and prevent and not a bunch of internet amateurs who think they know more.

Right.... Fascinating reading I say: http://www.gcsb.govt.nz/assets/GCSB-Compliance-Review/Review-of-Compliance.pdf

gzt:  That mob membership number is almost certainly wrong and more likely represents some kind of known (and assigned) association metric.

plambrechtsen:

And drink driving is still unbelievably high. Yet lowering the blood alcohol limit and raising the drinking age is something that is debated over years.

The number of beheadings Saudi has done this year I'm sure ISIS haven't even come close to it yet where is the outcry? Calls to no longer fund them by no longer buying their oil?

SaltyNZ: Ah, I see you meant it in a different way to what I thought. I interpreted the question as 'Where were you when you nearly got blown up?'

plambrechtsen:

SaltyNZ:

MikeSkyrme:
I'm going to assume that people also said the same when the national road toll was 'only' one per year.

Things change.

Yes, they do. But in the face of the far greater threat of the road toll, we didn't ban cars. We didn't force everyone to keep detailed logs of their trips... We thought about it, debated it publicly, and came up with a bunch of solutions that everyone is OK to live with, that are set out in public, and enforced in public, with a public right of appeal for those who believe they have been dealt with unfairly.

And drink driving is still unbelievably high. Yet lowering the blood alcohol limit and raising the drinking age is something that is debated over years.

The number of beheadings Saudi has done this year I'm sure ISIS haven't even come close to it yet where is the outcry? Calls to no longer fund them by no longer buying their oil?

MikeSkyrme: 
Actually, drink driving is battled against in a manner that catches every road user (yes, I'm certain you will find a list of people who have never been stopped), by way of booze buses/breath testing checkpoints.

Speeding also is monitored indiscriminately by way of speed cameras.

Rather simplified I know, but this is essentially the same as the monitoring of communications is it not? For all three scenarios, I only see a problem if you have been doing something you shouldn't be doing.....

gzt:

SaltyNZ: Apparently there are about 80 kiwis under surveillance because they may be potential terrorists, according the the PM's speech yesterday. 80. And about half of them are only suspected of being loudmouths, as opposed to someone who is actually about to perform mayhem. According to Wikipedia, there were 934 Mongrel Mob members in prison in April 2013. So yeah... we definitely need to urgently review what civil rights we should suspend in order to deal with this imminent existential terrorist threat. We only need them to grow by more than an order of magnitude and they'll be roughly as annoying as a bikie gang.

Just a footnote here. That mob membership number is almost certainly wrong and more likely represents some kind of known (and assigned) association metric.

MikeSkyrme: 
Actually, drink driving is battled against in a manner that catches every road user (yes, I'm certain you will find a list of people who have never been stopped), by way of booze buses/breath testing checkpoints.