What to do about neighbours who smoke dope?

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#2414751 8-Feb-2020 20:32

Spike14:

Guess what your options will be after the country goes silly and passes legislation after the referendum later this year? None. Zero. Zip.

Think about that as you vote this year.

Rubbish. Meanwhile other countries that have legalized marijuana, still control where it’s not ok to smoke it, just like tobacco.

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#2414759 8-Feb-2020 22:12

nathan:
Spike14:

Guess what your options will be after the country goes silly and passes legislation after the referendum later this year? None. Zero. Zip.

Think about that as you vote this year.

Rubbish. Meanwhile other countries that have legalized marijuana, still control where it’s not ok to smoke it, just like tobacco.

Does that include banning smoking in your back yard where your smoke drifts to the neighbours, which is effectively the OP's problem?

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#2414772 8-Feb-2020 23:31

Technofreak:

Does that include banning smoking in your back yard where your smoke drifts to the neighbours, which is effectively the OP's problem?

I think if it was legal it would make the conversation a whole lot easier "oh hey I noticed smoke drifting over into kids bedroom, any chance you could avoid this area of the section while smoking please?"

Imagine how much easier that conversation would be if it was tobacco that was the issue.

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#2414822 9-Feb-2020 06:54

Technofreak:

Does that include banning smoking in your back yard where your smoke drifts to the neighbours, which is effectively the OP's problem?

It certainly does.

One of the major concerns during the debate around legalisation of Cannabis where I live - was around the effects of second hand smoke.

It turns out that legalisation hasn't given Carte Blanche for pot-heads to send plumes of smoke drifting willy-nilly across the neighbourhood.
In fact - due to the publicity and attention the issue's received - it's become much more regulated, and enforced, than before legalisation.

Second hand smoke is controlled by various acts and bylaws at the Federal, Provincial and Municipal levels.

Municipalities have generally included drifting cannabis smoke into their 'nuisance' bylaws. Regulations regarding odor that might previously have been enforced against people who say, burned plastic in a back yard fire, or had a stinky compost bin, have been applied - with much more rigour - to Cannabis smoke.

Federal and Provincial second-hand smoke laws that were originally introduced to control tobacco smoke in 'shared air spaces' such as workplaces, public places and communal areas have been adapted and strengthened to specifically include cannabis smoke in the definitions of smoking.

All this is helped by the fact, that after legalisation less intrusive ways to use cannabis that don't impact the rights of others have become available.

It's recognised that smoking cannabis flower through joints or a bong in - say - an apartment building, or condominium, is likely to cause unnaceptable disruption or annoyance to neighbouring tenants, and maybe smoke damage to the building.

Vaporizers now offer the option to smoke cannabis without the intrusive aroma that would cause causes neighbours to complain, Dabbing of concentrates is a better option than burning raw flower, and almost fume free. Ingesting of cannabis edibles or beverages should cause no annoyance to the neighbours at all - unless the sound of sustained giggling keeps them up at night. As these alternatives are freely available, any use of cannabis that results in visible smoke, or an annoying smell has become much less acceptable.

The whole point is neighbours should never even know you smoke weed. There will always be people who will have loud parties, tie up a dog who scream-barks all day long, rev their cars at 3am, or insist on incinerating medical waste in their back yard. People who allow cannabis smoke to drift into neighbours houses fall into this category.

As many have already suggested to OP in this thread, if it was me I'd have a firm discussion first with the tenants or landlord.

He appears to be fearful that they may act obnoxiously, or even resort to violence, however - in my limited experience - dealing with things like this up-front is cathartic. The apprehension he feels about confronting them may turn out to be unfounded and - in any case, allowing bullies to have their way never works out in the long run.

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#2415212 9-Feb-2020 16:13

What to do about neighbours who smoke dope?

The thread topic turned out to be mainly wrong. The OP has already clarified the neighbors or the smoking of dope are not really the issue here.

The issue is second hand smoke drifting into children's sleeping area.

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#2416526 12-Feb-2020 08:23

We talked to council about the neighbour running a caravan park -- apparently he applied for a resource consent to do this and the council issued it to him -- without asking any of the neighbours . This is quite outrageous the council would do that, given the detrimental effects on the neighbourhood.

I wonder if the council employee would have issued this consent if it were next door to them personally?

So, nothing we can do. The people in the caravan park can smoke pot at 3am (for some reason this is a common time for this activity) and fill our rooms up with that disgusting smell.

There is a 2 million dollar plus building being developed next door to us just now -- i wonder if they'll have problems selling it now, given the activities just over their fence.

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#2416543 12-Feb-2020 09:13

Delphinus:

Technofreak:

Does that include banning smoking in your back yard where your smoke drifts to the neighbours, which is effectively the OP's problem?

I think if it was legal it would make the conversation a whole lot easier "oh hey I noticed smoke drifting over into kids bedroom, any chance you could avoid this area of the section while smoking please?"

Imagine how much easier that conversation would be if it was tobacco that was the issue.

I don't think for one moment if it were legal to smoke pot it would make it any easier to have the conversation. In fact I suggest the converse might apply. There is no need to mention what "product" is being smoked. It is the smoke that is the problem and that's all that needs to be mentioned.

I would play it dumb as to what "product' is being used for smoking when discussing the problem with the neighbours. If the culprits were smart they'd correct the situation to preempt the possibility of the complaint being escalated and attracting the attention of someone who will recognise and may take an interest in the "product" they are using.

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#2416546 12-Feb-2020 09:19

Technofreak:

I don't think for one moment if it were legal to smoke pot it would make it any easier to have the conversation. In fact I suggest the converse applies. There is no need to mention what "product" is being smoked. It is the smoke that is the problem and that's all that needs to be mentioned.

I would play it dumb as to what "product' is being used for smoking when discussing the problem with the neighbours. If the culprits were smart they'd correct the situation to preempt the possibility of the complaint being escalated and attracting the attention of someone who will recognise and may take an interest in the "product" they are using.

This. So much this.

I have seen nothing in the proposed legislation that indicates that NZ plans to introduce or add cannabis to the nuisance bylaws either. If I am incorrect, happy for someone to post the relevant section.

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#2416554 12-Feb-2020 09:59

surfisup1000:

We talked to council about the neighbour running a caravan park -- apparently he applied for a resource consent to do this and the council issued it to him -- without asking any of the neighbours . This is quite outrageous the council would do that, given the detrimental effects on the neighbourhood.

I wonder if the council employee would have issued this consent if it were next door to them personally?

So, nothing we can do. The people in the caravan park can smoke pot at 3am (for some reason this is a common time for this activity) and fill our rooms up with that disgusting smell.

There is a 2 million dollar plus building being developed next door to us just now -- i wonder if they'll have problems selling it now, given the activities just over their fence.

Wow - as someone who's been through the process of consenting a caravan park in New Zealand, that does seem outrageous.
Can I ask what area you're in? It's not something like Papakainga Housing you're talking about - but a licensed campground?

To permit a campground we had to work through a slew of issues

Not only did we have to notify, and get approval from all adjoining neighbours in writing..
..we had to work through many, many processes, consult with absolutely everyone, and supply endless engineers reports.

Everything from quantifying the increase in vehicle movements on local roads to the size and placement of onsite parking areas, sewage and potable water supply, grading of sites, the effects of increased impermeable surface area on stormwater drainage, noise issues, boundary setbacks, the list goes on.

Particularly taken into account were potential effects on the visual character of the neighbourhood, even the potential effect on other nearby licensed accommodation operators.

It was only after several hearings – and armed with letters of support from organisations that ranged from other operators and a ratepayers group to Tourism NZ, the Camping Caravan Assoc. and many others that the approval progressed.

The Building Permits and Resource Consents finally issued were subject to all sorts of restrictions, including approved guest record keeping, the total numbers of guests that could be accommodated, and number and type of caravans, vans or motorhomes. The small shop was subject to it's own permitting and consents...

In particular, we had to consult and receive approval for emergency services access (with an actual fire engine coming on site), common areas had to be constructed to meet fire, safety and disability codes, alarm system and publicly accessible fire extinguishers, we had to have an evacuation plan, and after everything was completed, be subject to yearly building WOF's and Fire Safety inspections.

I'd imagine their approval as a Caravan Park allows you MORE leverage, rather than less to make a complaint about your issue.
The very last thing they'd want would be a complaint to council about illegal activities happening on their newly permitted campground.

At first just the sight of a marked council ute driving through the gate used to give me the willies..

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#2416586 12-Feb-2020 10:43

Sidestep:

I'd imagine their approval as a Caravan Park allows you MORE leverage, rather than less to make a complaint about your issue.
The very last thing they'd want would be a complaint to council about illegal activities happening on their newly permitted campground.

That's a very good point!

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#2416607 12-Feb-2020 10:52

networkn:

This. So much this.

I have seen nothing in the proposed legislation that indicates that NZ plans to introduce or add cannabis to the nuisance bylaws either. If I am incorrect, happy for someone to post the relevant section.

I'm not sure if any amendment to the Smoke-free Environments Act 1990 is needed to "include" cannabis - as it's not "excluded":

to smoke—

(a) means to smoke, hold, or otherwise have control over an ignited tobacco product, weed, or plant; and (b) includes to smoke, hold, or otherwise have control over an ignited product or thing whose customary use is or includes the inhalation from it of the smoke produced from its combustion or the combustion of any part of it; but (c) does not include to hold or have control over an ignited product or thing customarily used as incense

(OTOH - I can't find anything specific in that legislation - that would allow prosecution of those "neighbours" if the nuisance smoke was tobacco or anything else stinky being "smoked" - except as pointed out by a couple of posts above, they're not really "neighbours", but "guests" staying at a commercial business)

I wasn't going to post anything more in this thread. It smells to me not of cannabis smoke, but something else.

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#2416619 12-Feb-2020 11:48

https://home.nzcity.co.nz/news/article.aspx?id=306107

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#2416668 12-Feb-2020 11:59

Err. Feels like this thread has run its course...

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#2416706 12-Feb-2020 13:36

Sidestep:

Wow - as someone who's been through the process of consenting a caravan park in New Zealand, that does seem outrageous.
Can I ask what area you're in? It's not something like Papakainga Housing you're talking about - but a licensed campground?

To permit a campground we had to work through a slew of issues

Not only did we have to notify, and get approval from all adjoining neighbours in writing..
..we had to work through many, many processes, consult with absolutely everyone, and supply endless engineers reports.

Everything from quantifying the increase in vehicle movements on local roads to the size and placement of onsite parking areas, sewage and potable water supply, grading of sites, the effects of increased impermeable surface area on stormwater drainage, noise issues, boundary setbacks, the list goes on.

Particularly taken into account were potential effects on the visual character of the neighbourhood, even the potential effect on other nearby licensed accommodation operators.

Tauranga city council.

I'm not sure what the difference is between a caravan park and what our neighbour is doing. Maybe it is the number of caravans? This is not an official 'caravan park' in the normal sense of the word. I just call it a caravan park because it feels like living next door to one.

He has dumped 4 or 5 old unroadworthy caravans on his property, plus a shack. The owner lives in the main house. He rents to Brazilians mostly(on his flyers he asks for brazilians), for any period. I believe he is getting $1200 a week when fully rented - and, given the rental shortage, they probably have close to 100% occupancy. So, it is pretty decent cash for very little investment.

Many of those factors you describe are problems, such as parking, noise, and boundary issues. His tenants park across neighbouring driveways at times. Also undesirable behaviour in a suburb where quite a few homes are worth 2 or 3 million dollars plus.

I was astounded the neighbour was given resource consent. I thought I'd just be able to complain and it would get sorted. I didn't expect the council to be complicit.

Anyway, we are still following up with council on this. A city planner is supposed to be giving me a call to discuss. Council are making planning changes this year, but, can previously issued resource consents be revoked? At this stage, we are looking like we just have to have lots of caravans next door to us.

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#2416735 12-Feb-2020 14:49

OP has clarified it's a permitted caravan park and not some kind of gang.

In addition, young Brazilian travelling workers in NZ who tend to be an educated and considerate lot IME and worth talking to.

This is starting to look like a 24/7 business next door with an inadequate and badly positioned outdoor smoking area. Imo the first thing to do is investigate moving the smoking area. The non-notified application is something most people would not be happy about.

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