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Topic # 191193 27-Jan-2016 10:58
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I have an issue with poor wifi in my house which I have been trying to resolve for some time now.  While the ideal would be to lay ethernet, there are issues which make that less than practical for the mean time (underfloor/wall access being one of them).  I've been contemplating powerline (though my last experiment a while back wasn't that encouraging), as a means of getting a second AP into the dead-zone of the house, but while searching through the forums here I read something that gave me an idea.

 

Somebody mentioned using the existing (now unused) phone jacks to create a small "private VDSL" connection.  I have no idea what that means or would entail, but it got me wondering about the unused phone jacks in our house (of which we have three).  One is in the lounge where my router sits, and one is in the kitchen, where I have a dead zone.  I remember reading that the Chorus techs, when installing fibre, sometimes use the existing copper wire to "pull through" the new fibre cable.  I wondered if it would be possible to do the same thing to run an ethernet cable from the lounge to the kitchen.  In other words, snip the old copper wire at one end, tie the ethernet cable to it, and then at the other end of the copper wire pull through both the old copper and the new ethernet.  Fix a socket plate at each end, and voila a simple end-to-end ethernet connection for the second AP.  Would that work, or is it a terrible idea?  Is there a better way (one that doesn't involve burrowing under the house or cutting into the walls) to achieve the same result?  


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  Reply # 1479724 27-Jan-2016 11:16
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It would work fine, so long as you were able to pull the cable through without it snagging or not getting througha small hole (and breaking the draw cable/pulling the Ethernet cable off the draw cable).




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  Reply # 1479728 27-Jan-2016 11:23
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Yeah, that's what I suspected.  Not sure how the copper wires were installed though, whether they would be "hanging loose" or whether they would be securely fastened to joists etc.  The three way connection of the existing phone jacks worried me too, whether it would actually be a direct connection between those two jacks or not.


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  Reply # 1479737 27-Jan-2016 11:31
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I read a page a while ago where someone had used powerline ethernet bridges, but opened them up and was powering them from USB and had the connection to the mains pins instead going over a pair of old phone cables. There are powerline devices with an accesspoint in them as well, but not sure how much they seperate the DC power supply from the data stuff to know how easy it would be to get them talking over a different pair of wires.

 

Pulling thru is always risky. Worst would be if it gets half way and then jams so you cant pull it back either. All I can suggest is lots of silicon lube spray on it _after_ you tape them together securely with a good quality insulation tape. There is also specific cable pulling lubricant but I can see bad things coming up if you start googling for that eh ;)





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  Reply # 1479740 27-Jan-2016 11:37
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The copper is stapled throughout my house (or was till I ripped it out and replaced it with cat 6)


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  Reply # 1479745 27-Jan-2016 11:46
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You mentioned a "private VDSL connection" as one possible option. What you can get these days are "VDSL extenders" that (I understand) act like a VDSL modem between two points in your house. Think of them like the powerline adapters, but running over your phone lines rather than your power wiring.

I haven't used them myself, so can't recommend any particular model. I think they would also need to use wires in your phone line that are not connected to the outside line. There is probably a spare pair of unused wires for a second line through the house that you could use.

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  Reply # 1479757 27-Jan-2016 12:06
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Decent vdsl extenders are 1600 bucks and run for kilometers, maybe they, re not right for this.
You can always get a new cable through. The challenge is whether you can conceal it all or part way. A useful method is through the ceiling and down through a cupboard. Surface mounting outside your house is ultra quick but ultra hard to make look good.

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  Reply # 1479781 27-Jan-2016 12:30
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I wouldn't count on using phone cable as a draw cord, in my experience it is fed through very small holes in the framing and often stapled

 

Perhaps take the cover off your phone jacks and take a photo for us. There's a good chance that you could add RJ45 sockets and use the existing cable for ethernet (technically half-duplex). If it's good you might get 100Mb throughput, if the cable is a bit bad/old maybe only 10Mb throughput - but that might be still useful if you're using an ADSL connection


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  Reply # 1479785 27-Jan-2016 12:43
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I have had 100 meg ethernet run fine thru the white 2 pair phone cable and also the 2 pair black buried stuff for ages between buildings. No noticiable slowdown on other 100 meg links.





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  Reply # 1479845 27-Jan-2016 13:43
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That sounds like it might be more do-able.  How hard would it be to re-wire the socket for RJ45?  I'm not too worried about high-end speeds, as all I want to do is have a wired connection between the main router and a second AP to use for wifi in the dead-spots of the house.  I'm only on 30/10 UFB, so as long as it can do 30-50Mb then it should be fine...


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  Reply # 1479848 27-Jan-2016 13:45
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Depends on what the cable is. But basically just punch one pair down into green and one in orange.





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  Reply # 1479906 27-Jan-2016 15:19
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And even easier if you live near a GZ member - whereabouts in the country are you?




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  Reply # 1479936 27-Jan-2016 15:57
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Palmerston North


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  Reply # 1479975 27-Jan-2016 16:24
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I offered to have a look at your place to see what could be done in the way of networking a few years ago. The offer is still there if you're interested...




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  Reply # 1479981 27-Jan-2016 16:28
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That's right, completely forgot about that.  Will think about when might be a good time and get back to you Kermit...




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  Reply # 1480494 28-Jan-2016 09:59
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I'm colourblind (colour-dyslexic is probably a better description), so I couldn't honestly say whether the wires are green and orange (they look kind of cream and red to me), but they look about right.

 

It looks like it should relatively simple to convert it to RJ45: get hold of RJ45 sockets from Jaycar (would these do? http://www.jaycar.co.nz/IT-Products/Networking/Networking-Specialty-Products/RJ45-Socket-Cat5E-Keystone-Jack---White/p/YN8028), and match up the wires to the right pins in the socket.  Repeat at the other end, and then connect ethernet from the router to the first socket, then ethernet from the second socket to the second AP.  Presuming it works, it would then just be a matter of getting the right faceplate to mount it nicely to the wall.  Have I missed anything?


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