2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2806758 3-Nov-2021 15:28

Senecio:

If one of these falsely vaccinated individuals were to contract the virus down the road, would they be able to confirm that in testing? Once you've contracted the virus could they still test to se (sic) if you (sic) body had antibodies from the vaccine? I would hate to see the statistics for vaccinated positive cases skewed by people who weren't actually vaccinated.

YES - those vaccinated have different markers to those that contract the virus.

Whilst the difficult we can do immediately, the impossible takes a bit longer. However, miracles you will have to wait for.

GV27

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#2806759 3-Nov-2021 15:30

Also, a hard border because other bits of the country are behind Auckland in vaccinations is a hard sell, ethically speaking.

Especially given how the LOIs for the Auckland outbreak are now non-existent and the virus is just basically being let-rip.

Kind of feel like they're just having that one both ways.

kobiak

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#2806762 3-Nov-2021 15:43

GV27:

Good luck with that.

There won't be an effective system for checking at the border that doesn't trigger Kopu-bridge levels of delay on top of the already congested roads.

Did see it has quietly changed from Certificate AND a test to Certificates OR a test.

I expect both to be dropped - which will of course be dressed up as a treat for Aucklanders when in reality it's because no part of it is workable.

should be no different to ticket checks before flights and ferries/trains/busses

cars - yes... rather delayed process

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ezbee

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#2806763 3-Nov-2021 15:47

FineWine:

Senecio:

If one of these falsely vaccinated individuals were to contract the virus down the road, would they be able to confirm that in testing? Once you've contracted the virus could they still test to se (sic) if you (sic) body had antibodies from the vaccine? I would hate to see the statistics for vaccinated positive cases skewed by people who weren't actually vaccinated.

YES - those vaccinated have different markers to those that contract the virus.

It may not be common to do such a detailed and possibly very expensive testing.
Few countries do so much genomic testing for example.
So I expect where false vaccination certificates are rife lots of their breakthrough cases may not be.

Handle9

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#2806765 3-Nov-2021 15:54

quickymart:
"Oh but they're not the same thing at all!" the antivaxxers doth scream.

They aren’t the same thing.

Vaccine passports are necessary but they are an impingement on peoples rights. We should never forget that as it normalises the state removing rights.

GV27

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#2806768 3-Nov-2021 15:57

Handle9:

Vaccine passports are necessary but they are an impingement on peoples rights. We should never forget that as it normalises the state removing rights.

Wild how I can't just flat out murder someone.

It's like we decided at some point that was a bad thing.

Why don't I have a god-given right to kill whoever I want.

This is reverse-racism in action.

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ezbee

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#2806769 3-Nov-2021 16:02

GV27:

Handle9:

Vaccine passports are necessary but they are an impingement on peoples rights. We should never forget that as it normalises the state removing rights.

Wild how I can't just flat out murder someone.

It's like we decided at some point that was a bad thing.

Why don't I have a god-given right to kill whoever I want.

This is reverse-racism in action.

Never mind the religious freedom to perform animal and human sacrifice ?

freitasm

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#2806780 3-Nov-2021 16:35

Press release:

The government has signed a purchase agreement with Pfizer for 4.7 million additional doses of the COVID-19 vaccine for delivery in 2022, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins announced today.

“This purchase agreement will ensure that we have a continual supply of Pfizer vaccines throughout next year,” Chris Hipkins said.

“These vaccines will be provided to those who didn’t access a vaccine in 2021, for example those turning 12 next year, be used if the eligibility is extended to younger age groups, and for a potential booster programme if the evidence determines this is required and if Medsafe grants approval.

“New Zealand is also committed to supporting our Pacific neighbours with their COVID-19 response, including vaccine supply.”

New Zealand has access to a total of 10.88 million doses of the Pfizer vaccine in 2021. The additional agreement for 4.7 million doses will be delivered throughout 2022.

“These doses will complement the other COVID-19 vaccines in our portfolio, which are scheduled for delivery in 2022. Further announcements on use of these vaccines will be made in due course,” Chris Hipkins said.

“The Pfizer vaccine is being rolled out right across New Zealand, including to our hard to reach and rural areas. We are continuing to focus on reaching at least 90% vaccination rates across all DHBs.

“We have the ability to deliver vaccines right across Aotearoa New Zealand, quickly and efficiently, and there is enough vaccines right now for every eligible person to be fully vaccinated.”

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Scott3

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#2806781 3-Nov-2021 16:36

wellygary:

EDIT: what the PM has said cannot be correct, if the Auckland border remains, that means no traffic light system operating in the rest of the North Island,

That means no festivals like Rhythm and Vines, as they can ONLY operate once Vaccine certificates begin,

These are the Level 2 rules

"Events that are held outdoors but not at an event facility — for example a concert at a park, ....These are limited to 100 people in any defined indoor or outdoor space."

Or are the rules going to change again

Not sure how you are drawing that conclusion.

Red: Regional boundary restrictions may apply.

Orange: Regional boundary restrictions will not apply.

https://covid19.govt.nz/alert-levels-and-updates/covid-19-protection/

So if any region is at red (and Auckland is expected to transition to red before Christmas), that region MAY have regional boundary restrictions.

Extremely likely that the traffic light system will be implemented at the end of the month nationwide. They have even scheduled a press conference to cover the review of our nations vaccination rates.

Apparently they are going to start low volume testing of the system in the next day or two. So system seem likely to be ready by the end of the month.

Scott3

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#2806783 3-Nov-2021 16:43

afe66: My hospital 100% occupancy, elective surgery being cancelled and no covid in our area.

When it arrives its going to be interesting

This kind of thing is really worrying.

No covid in that area, No influenza, and I assume we have eliminated RSV again. Seriously how did we allow the system to get that lean?

When we open back up to international arrivals, in addition to the covid-19 workload we are likely to have a really harsh influenza and RSV season. Plus a smorgasbord of other respiratory illness.

wellygary

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#2806803 3-Nov-2021 16:51

Scott3:

Not sure how you are drawing that conclusion.

Red: Regional boundary restrictions may apply.

Orange: Regional boundary restrictions will not apply.

https://covid19.govt.nz/alert-levels-and-updates/covid-19-protection/

So if any region is at red (and Auckland is expected to transition to red before Christmas), that region MAY have regional boundary restrictions.

Extremely likely that the traffic light system will be implemented at the end of the month nationwide. They have even scheduled a press conference to cover the review of our nations vaccination rates.

Apparently they are going to start low volume testing of the system in the next day or two. So system seem likely to be ready by the end of the month.

The PM has said that all regions in the NI (outside Auckland) will move together when we all reach 90%.... until then they remain in the Level system - vax passports only function under the new system

Auckland will move at the end of the month, but Northland, Whanganui and the East coast are not projected to hit 90% until early 2022...

So either they are going to allow individual regions to move earlier (they have said they are not) or they will allow vax passport under the existing system - (this would be a change too)

Vax passports are being trialled now so the remains of Hospo in Auckland can open as soon as the 90% target allows Auckland into the Traffic light system...

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Oblivian

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#2806804 3-Nov-2021 16:52

Scott3:

No covid in that area, No influenza, and I assume we have eliminated RSV again. Seriously how did we allow the system to get that lean?

When we open back up to international arrivals, in addition to the covid-19 workload we are likely to have a really harsh influenza and RSV season. Plus a smorgasbord of other respiratory illness.

They are juggling for scenarios already.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/126863167/covid19-hospital-cases-to-be-sent-to-dunedin-sdhb-reaches-90pc-first-doses

Batman

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#2806805 3-Nov-2021 16:54

it was always that way. Invercargill have long declared themselves unable to care for covid patients and they were always going to send them to Dunedin. *sigh